I’ll add just a tiny bit to what @Open_Mike has contributed: PUMs are solid for me as well, and as long as the other settings are as Mike described them, the step length can be any number doable for the OT. I record perfect PM loops of 44, 28, 56, etc. steps all the time. Where the PMs have been “unreliable” for me has been when I close the loop manually before the end of the pattern. I rarely rely on the PMs setting the tempo these days.
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I don’t think it’s unreliable, I just didn’t get the logic behind it which is what I’m searching for. This is conventional coding, so there’s a fixed algoritm or better: a formula, this is not AI …, so my question remains: "why, if I with Qrec=Plen and all other settings just like Mike’s, when I “abort” the recording at beat 135, it stops as expected at 192, then sets its lenght to 256 while changing the tempo accordingly. " I will somehow figure it out. One of the great features of the PU machines is that you can start recording without fixing a lenght beforehand and still have quantized start and stop. This is not random. If people like me have issues with this aspect of the PUM’s it’s because the formula doesn’t meat real world expectations. But it would help if at least we knew what it is!
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Well it seems that the logic behind Pickup Machine tempo recalc (sequencer running, OT is master clock ) is as follows:
1: Qrec and Qpl obey master track lenght like @Open_Mike noticed so if your master track is 64 steps, rec/play actions will be quantized to a 64/128/192/256/320 grid
2: Tempo recalc on the other hand takes the next coming value on a 16/32/64/128/256/512 etc grid as a reference.
Example: with master track =64, a PU recording stop action at step 135 will stop recording at step 192 and tempo will be recalculated as if the recording was 256 steps long as shown in the video I posted above (mind this: it will not choose 128 which is closer to 135 than 256!!).
In other words, if we want quantized PU recordings, of an undefined lenght, that do not change the tempo, we only have the choice of 64/128/256/512 etc amount of steps but we need to initiate a stop action during the last master track cycle. (BTW Track scale doesn’t matter, only Master Track scale does).
For master track =64:
target=64: action stop anywhere will do
target=128: action stop between 64 and 128
target=256: action stop between 192 and 256
target=512: action stop between 448 and 512
target=1024: action stop between 960 and 1024
Hence, a fully quantized Pickup recording of 96, 192 or 320 beats is not possible.
This is not a bug, but I qualify this as a design flaw: we have two different reference grids, AND a weird rounding choice has been made.
This explains most of the “Pick-up’s are unpredictable” issues. They are very consistent! But we are musicians, not mathematiciens…
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Thanks for taking time to decode this :
Edit: I take it these are when using QREC and QPL as PLEN?
Yes, it’s a confusing term: Plen is an abbreviation of “pattern lenght” but in fact it refers to the master track lenght. You won’t mention the nuance when in scale mode=normal because master track lenght== pattern lenght, but when in scale mode=per track, this is not the case: master track lenght then becomes a separate parameter
EDIT: QPL doesn’t act upon recording. It defines when the playback will start when the PUM track is in a stopped state and you hit play (rec2).
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Nice… Here’s some clips from the manual that might hint toward this weirdish behavior…
Master track length is when every track gets reset to step 1 again when you have tracks of different lengths. It kinda is a pattern length… Sorta… Haha
Remember you can set the q settings up to 128 or maybe 256 (can’t check) or to plen and then set your master track length really high like 1024 or more… It doesn’t have to be 64 it can be a lot higher…
And again I’ll just note that with set rlen (and maybe Len off?) the bpm won’t change because OT won’t try to calculate the lenght…
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Rlen only goes to 64. The “len” parameter only acts upon slave PU machines. BTW I don’t know how you managed to set a fixed master PU recording lenght over 64!
Yes but note that if you set Qrec to a high value like 256 your recording won’t start before 256 beats have been played.
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Yes, it tries to guess the BPM by evaluating the transients (there is a setting to adjust the sensitibity of the detection) but that only sort-of works with beat-based material.
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Good info in here!
Any way to do this? (I don’t believe so, but may be wrong)
Set up PUM on track 1
Press start on transport (or via midi start) and track 1 starts recording.
I know we can press rec1 for PUM and have sequencer start, but in some scenarios I want it like the example above.
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With rec trig on beat 1?
Sure… I never said I set an rlen over 64, I know you want to be able to define your loop length but since we’re already off topic from the thread title I’m just posting things that might help folks that read it.
As for the q’s I thought I’d mention it because it’s maybe easier to not have to wait till the last 64 to press or in some cases might avoid ending on a number that will end up changing the bpm, like if you know you might want 128 or 256 steps setting to 128 you can press anytime before 128 to get 128 or anytime between 128 and 256 to get 256…
I realize you might know some of this but plenty of other folks will read it too that don’t…
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No trigs for PUM or did you mean flex?
Qrec defines when recording starts and when it ends if you go straight to overdub. Qpl defines the end of a recording when you go straight to playback. You can set a short qrec and a long qpl if you don’t need to go to overdub straight away…
It’s fine, that’s why I posted my findings too. Even if we drifted off topic … (but I started it after all 
)
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I kinda feel like everything I say you challenge or try one up by being more specific, maybe it’s just me, I don’t know… I’m just trying to help people… I’m pretty good with an Octatrack and have used PU’s for years…
I haven’t tried it but some stuff lingers from flex if you set it up there and then change to PU… @avantronica pointed out you can set a scene to rate at for example -64, switch to PU and use it to slow your loops and go full reverse. Worth a shot to put a one shot recorder trig on flex and then change to a PU…
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So do I… I’m not into competition at all. It’s my conception of dialogue, and see this as a positive way of moving forward while providing aother people with information they might find useful. Just trying to figure out how it works exactly. I have not found a comprehensive explanation of the mysterous PUM inner workings so I try to contribute as well. Most threads start with " I don’t understand why PUMs mess up" and end with “just deal with it or use flex”… I read countless threads on the subject before starting this one. BTW, I’m not responsible for the fact that the topic I started has been merged with an older one that has no relationship.
Needless to say I appreciate our conversation, sorry if that didn’t show…
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@Open_Mike Turn that frown upside down 
I didn’t see it like that FWIW, you are always one of the most helpful people and positive on here, we love you dude! As I see it @pinup57 was just adding his findings and conversing in the topic.
Sometimes text isn’t always the clearest method of communication, especially for people like me.
This is a great thread with lots of useful info. 
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