Octatrack - Feedback Loop - Dub like king tubby - for real

Hello everyone,

I figured I should share this with you people as I’ve never come across it. I initially created this patch to produce dub techno but I feel that this example is much more diverse and covers the dub reggae genre as well. Dub techno is much more “static” so you’ll get the gist and apply it to any other genre you want.

This is a patch that uses the Octatrack as a 4(or 5) channel console with a “traditional” reggae feedback loop and lets you take it on the stage and perform reggae dub live, the way it’s supposed to be done :slight_smile:

So with this patch, we need a backpack compared to:

  • An analog console
  • A source that plays the tracks and feeds them to our channels
  • Outboard FX (racks etc)

I’m kinda obsessed with delays and feedback loops and to me the Octatrack is hands down the best machine to use as a delay. You can go into unimaginable configurable depths where no other machine can take you (maybe some pure-data organelle custom stuff…)

I didn’t fiddle too much with this, I think that if someone likes dubbing reggae tracks will dig deeper cause there’s great depth to this (using the arranger, sophisticated scenes, more LFOs, etc).

YouTube video of it working

------------------ CONNECTIONS ------------------

CUE R -> Octatrack Input C

------------------ TRACKS ------------------

CHAIN 4 CHANNELS:
T5 THRU -> IN C comes here
EFFECT 1 -> FILTER (WIDTH 0, BASE ~80) This control has a lot of variation
EFFECT 2 -> DELAY (FB: 0%, SEND: 100%) a single repeat (2nd page DIR: 0)
CUE LVL -> 0

T6 NEI
EFFECT 1 -> CHORUS
EFFECT 2 -> PHASER
CUE LVL -> 0

T7 NEI
EFFECT 1 -> FLANGER
EFFECT 2 -> COMPRESSOR
CUE LVL -> MAX

Our feedback loop ends here. The next neigh channel offers control (compression) and reverb, also the level of the last channel controls the final mix/volume of the wet result.

T8 NEI
EFFECT 1 -> COMPRESSOR
EFFECT 2 -> REVERB
(Bonus: Elektron spring reverb algo is great for dubbing, it even bongs like a true spring reverb)

------------------ HOW TO USE ------------------
Just send any channel (1-4) to the cue and listen to the outcome

------------------ WARNING ------------------
Whenever playing with feedback loops be VERY careful about your levels until you’re sure you got everything under control, it can get ugly really quickly and can damage your ears/equipment!

------------------ NOTES ------------------
The hardest thing is to control the levels of the loop nicely, this is why compressors help in
various steps of the signal chain. to start let the loop work and calibrate the volume with the
T7 compressor threshold (and ratio somewhere in the middle), you should aim for 3-4 repeats max. When you understand that you have control of the loop volume and repeats you can go to infinity.

Levels (send) come into play a bit but after calibrating correctly you should be able to fully send to cue and use the input level on T5 to feed the compressor correctly.

If you want more repeats afterwards just add make up gain from this compressor.

In all this process there should NOT be any kind of feedback-y sound (like a very dominant frequency), this most probably means that you have left the feedback open OR sent more than one (neigh-loop) channels back to the loop (CUE).

One channel ONLY (5 -> 8) MUST be sent back to the loop.

Lastly, you will see that there are 2 filters in this chain (T5 & T5 DELAY) which offer plenty of control. Also, T5 Filter offers distortion as well.

To control the overall volume of the loop use T8’s volume (the last of the chain).

To make insanely crazy delay effects play with the chorus/flanger/phaser that exists in the other channels. Each of these effects applies the effect to the repeated signal again and again with insane results! You can of course exchange the creative effects in this chain for others that you might like more.

You can also make a send-like fader with the octa fader, just attach it to T5 input volume but just note that when you close the fader the feedback loop will stop working, so you will hear delays as long as the fader is open!

------------------ DUB REGGAE EXAMPLE ------------------
In this example, with the midi controller, we use 2 faders per Octa channel to control Track level and Cue level respectively (my midi controller fader 3 is broken so I bypassed it and used the rest, also I did not send the bass channel so it’s ok)

Our channels for this example contain:
Track 1: Drums/Beat
Track 2: Bass
Track 3: Guitar chords
Track 4: Vocals
Very simple, just for this example to work.

Limitations:
Well, there is the obvious limitation of the 4 channels, you can get creative with Conditional Triggers/Fill Triggers/Arranger, or simply patterns to add more elements. Also, this is the full-blown dub loop, meaning that you can easily throw away 2 FX from Chorus/Flanger/Phaser and gain one more channel, but I think that the loop needs at least 2 channels (without counting the last, so 2 + 1) to be glorious :grinning:

If you ever use it to create dubs, please do share the outcome or other ideas!

Cheers :v:

45 Likes

I am mightily impressed and you have convinced me to get an OT even though it goes against my principles of buying old tech!

2 Likes

You wont regret it! Octatrack is timeless :slight_smile:

2 Likes

It’s old tech, but so is pretty much every vintage synth. Still sought after.

Yeah and I don’t buy vintage gear. Lots of problems and I don’t like the time sink.

1 Like

You can record CUE internally, and play it with a FLEX instead of a Thru. That way you benefit from SRC parameters like pitch, rate, len, retrig…

8 Likes

Yeah this is amazing! Thanks for the idea! I made an alternative setup using separate buses for left and right so you can have pingpong with different lengths and different effects on each side.

T T: C panned right, D panned left
N N
N N
T M: input from A B or any other static or flex sample here.

1 Like

That was very cool. I love feedback.

Hey, what was the thing in your left hand in the video?

And thanks for the write-up. That was very clear.

Hey, glad you like it!

Hey, what was the thing in your left hand in the video?

ah it’s nothing just a dumb cigarette thing… irrelevant

1 Like

You can record CUE internally, and play it with a FLEX instead of a Thru. That way you benefit from SRC parameters like pitch, rate, len, retrig…

That is true, 2 reasons why I chose to go out with a cable:
a) My incompetency when getting to the record functions of Octatrack, haven’t yet found the time to explore and add it to my thoughtflow :confused: Also, I mainly use the Octa to perform live and I haven’t really felt the confidence to use the record functions on stage, but again, haven’t spent the time…

b) I deconstructed the main idea of the dub loop so I blindly/dumbly connected the output to the input but another aspect that led me to this is that you can still connect your favorite delay, filter, chorus whatever in the loop. So with the cable, I think there’s more freedom instead of staying 100% in the box.

But yea, of course if you want to stay 100% inside Octatrack this makes sense! Great idea :slight_smile:

3 Likes

T T: C panned right, D panned left
N N
N N
T M: input from A B or any other static or flex sample here.

Umm that’s a good idea but I didn’t quite get the routing, could you explain it a bit more? :smiley:

Basically the left tracks are for the left feedback and the right tracks are for the right feedback.
T4 is for input or sample playback.
T8 is master.

It works pretty much the same as your setup.
T1 listens to input C and pans it right so next loop it goes to the opposite side.
T2 listens to input D and pans it left.
The neighbour tracks are just for FX and T3 and T7 send the feedback back to the cue outputs and to main output too so you can hear them.

1 Like

That make sense and I do it sometimes.

Yes, I especially like to use analog distortions. But you can also use Recorder + Flex instead of a Thru track.

With sampling the feedback loop can be repitched, reversed, so you can get very interesting results like these :

Some other feedback ideas.

Anyway, thanks for feedback ! :wink:
Feels like I gonna kill my ears today…:content:

5 Likes

Ah I get it now, yea great, I maybe would also mono that so that you use the different timings in the same channel it’s dub after all, mono is still good! :smiley:

Hahah this is sick! I have to find the time to dig that, very very interesting!

Yea, for no-input, what I figured is that if you use T7 compressor from my setup and you just smash the nothingness you get a lot of Octa noise while staying in the loop! (utilizing all the modulations etc…)

Haha, take care!

2 Likes

Thanks for the great ideas! What USB to midi -host you are using for the LaunchControl and does it get it´s power from the host?

Hey!

I’m using this:

It needs external power! Has never failed me fwiw :slight_smile:

2 Likes

If you put 2 cables between CUE LR and CD, your setup is stereo. :wink:

Interesting, I used that principle to get a true stereo reverb (OT reverbs sum LR before processing, as most of reverbs).
But I prefer to keep a single stereo bus.

Yea sure, I mean in case you don’t want the ping pong (which I kinda find gimmicky to be there all the time) you can sum to mono and just have the different timings on the Center channel. I might not be right cause I didn’t set it up to see how it works, just an idea. Now that I think of it though u can just not pan, anyway, I’ll have to test it to be sure.

1 Like

Example with CUE recording + Flex. Basic loop at the begining, then feedback loop.
T1 : Drums
T2 : Chords

T6 : CUE rec + Flex, pitch +12, lfos on filter, balance, delay time
Filter + Dark Reverb
T7 : CUE rec + Flex, a random retrig pitch +12, lfos on filter, balance, delay time
Filter + Ping Pong Delay

T8 Master : Compressor

5 Likes

What are you using between the OT’s Midi DIN input, and the Launch Control’s USB Midi port?