Why no EQ?

I like the ‘Iron Sky’ joke about USB

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So it’s been a year i have my Rytm , i’m a lot more fluent on it but i still miss an EQ per track.

Although i have a Presonus that can record multitrack and even Overbridge can do this nowadays, all of this options apply only when in studio.

In a live situation, unless you have the hassle to use separate outputs for each track and bring an external mixer, you can’t EQ a track. Let’s say you have a closed hat with lots of low end and you would like to cut the low and increase the high frequencies : the filter can’t do that. A simple 3-band EQ would be an awesome start, please make it happen Elektron <3

12 analog EQs is expensive.

Even a single digital EQ let alone 12 is against the concept of the AR.

Doubtful.

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Turn up the pitch :stuck_out_tongue:

I’d like to encourage you to consider an idea I’ve been playing with lately: That if you need to reach for an EQ, there is something wrong with the arrangement. I recall a story from a famous Steely Dan mixing engineer who nearly refused to use an EQ. The arrangement and the right microphones were of utmost importance to him.

Also bare in mind EQ is the attenuation of volume. Does your hi hat have too much hi end and it causes ear fatigue? Try simply turning it down a bit. Is your low end muddy? Try a different kick sample or a different bass part.

This being said, I still reach for eqs frequently, but it’s a nice challenge and it gets you thinking differently

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Yeah simple eq per track could have been cool. I use the filter cutoff and resonance to get me in that direction. But it’s not the same.

But Man O man if this missing element would motivate a person to get an analog heat, I’d consider them very lucky to have such motivation! It’s not per track (unless you fed bass or snare tracks out etc) but it’s so dang amazing what it does to any and all audio.

Sam

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That technique can be applied to pretty much every element in the mix.
Actually I don‘t know where I got it from and at first it felt kinda weird to change the bass patch when I was struggling with a muddy low end in a track or to load different hi hat samples in my OT when I just could‘t get the drums sit right in the mix, or another kick drum when there wasn‘t enough oomph - I mean, those are my precious synth patches/my secret sauce drum samples and changing stuff would alter the overall feeling of the track, right?

As the saying goes: „a good song can be played with guitar only and it will be still a good song!“ or smt like that^^

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One of the nice features on the DSI Tempest, is the high-pass EQ per patch. Really useful at times, to get sounds out of the way of the kick - especially snares which can have a cancelling effect on the kick, depending on phase.

On the Rytm, I normally take kick and snare into separate mixer channels to deal with that problem. …or I use a high pass filter on the snare. If I’m using a DAW, I might use Fabfilter’s dynamic EQ with a side-chain to filter some of the low-end on a snare, whilst a kick is playing.

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One of many good reasons to use a solid analogue mixer for each individual out. I very much prefer it this way due to eq quality, and the possibility to add other outboard gear as inserts or sends, to be honest.

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Yeah, nice story bro, but a mic in a room IS effectively an EQ.
He uses EQ, its just acoustical and not electronic.
:laughing:

Another important detail is that acoustical instruments are build to sound in a particular way that allows them to be mixed easier. The body of the instrument is also effectively an acoustical EQ. And in the case of steely dan the guitar amps also have an EQ which was definitely used.

With synthetic sounds you don’t get any of that and so it makes perfect sense to use EQ on them imo.

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With synthesizers and samplers we usually have pretty much full control not only over the frequency spectrum but also amplitude and it can indeed make sense instead to reach for an eq or fiddle around with a compressor to change the synth patch and thus tackle the problem at the root.
Imho.

Sometimes simply turning down the decay time of the amplitude envelope might clear up a mix much better and much more easily then a little eq here and compression there.

Sometimes all it needs is a simple shelfing filter or low cut eq.

Both valid approaches imho.

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Of course you can and should go back to the basis of the sound if possible.
But i don’t agree that you get full control over frequency with synths and samplers.
Usually you get a LPF and HPF and maybe a BPF. But as a specrum control tool these are pretty darn heavy tools, even at 12dB/o. Good luck adding a bit of glistering to your synth part without any eq.
And the typical waveforms you find in a synth are no help either. They usually encompass a large spectrum from the root note up. You can cut the top off, you can cut the bottom off, but what about control over the frequencies in the middle. It gets better when you have multiple oscillators and you can octave them to get more frequency ranges, but still, there is a limit to what you can do, frequency-wise.

With samples, sure, you can go through loads of samples trying to find the one that fits in your track, but that is stupid and boring if you can fix the problem in 2 seconds with an EQ.

There are simply a lot of very good reasons why EQ has been a staple of music technology for over 70 years. They are very useful and practical tools.

Besides all this, i have a rytm and it turns out its analog engine sucks ass when it comes to frequency control. It sounds pretty muddy overall and i can’t make it sparkle. External EQ is the only option or the analog engines become pretty limited in how they sound and form a mix.
And i guess this is why people are asking for an EQ.

Yeah, well, that would be ideal to fix the sound of the rytm imho. :+1: :laughing:

Layer multiple engines and distortion.

So give up voices and make it sound the same with distortion? :smiley:
I’m looking for separation of sounds in the mix, not for mooshing them together into a distorted mess. (Well, sometimes a distorted mess is nice :wink: And in fact, i usually add some distortion, but it’s not the same as eq, i hope you agree).

Its range of sound/tone is limited a lot by the lack of eq.

I can make it sound like i want if i use individual outs and external eq, but then i don’t know what the final result will be when i make a track on the box itself.

All fair points–hence why I said I still find myself reaching for EQs

My intention though was to encourage OP to work with the limitations he’s given and to introduce him to ideas/workarounds that could help–you know, instead of wishing for something that doesn’t seem to be happening any time soon :stuck_out_tongue:

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Nah brah. A BD and noise is a crispy kick (add a tom and you’ve got pork knuckle). A 12 part drum track is too much already. Less is more.

Sure, limitations can be good. But i feel the rytm would be 3x as usefull if it had EQ on board. I know, i’m whining at this point. :slight_smile:

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I was talking about the analog engine. That’s more like 8 than 12 channels.
You suggest to bring it down to 5 basically (just to get a kick! :face_with_raised_eyebrow:) and i think that can be quite limiting.
The amount of tracks is maybe not so needed for the beat itself, but more for the sparser accent sounds and variations.

But of course it all depends on what you’re trying to make and i guess that’s my main complaint. The lack of EQ limits what kind of mix you can get out of it. Especially if distortion comes into play i really want to start shaping those new harmonics because they all start stacking in the high freqs. But in general i often feel some eq is needed to get good separation between sounds because a lot of the analog engines sound very similar in tone.

Sorry, but that’s what the individual outs are for.
8 channels in a digital mixer means 8x eq 8x comp + Xx FX plus the main LR routed in a stereo mixer channel for rytm’s fx.

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I don’t dare to use Overbridge yet. Maybe it’s a solution to get EQ via Overbridge?

But just in the box EQ for the analog engine’s looks like it’s not possible.

However on the sample playback engine maybe. If EQ in the sample playback engine ever going to happen we have to lookout if the Digitakt will get it first?