Exactly and that’s just not fair … but it’s important to know that those low prices we enjoy here in the first world depend on low wages in other countries … just a matter of fact, which everybody has to acknowledge … IMO.
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Countries with low wages also tend to have lower housing costs, transport costs, socialising costs etc so the wage is not necessarily as low as it seems to a person from another country.
Of course this will change as a countries inhabitants get richer but then manufacturing will simply move to a different country.
Better … know some people from China and then …
BTW did you ever question, why people are trying to escape China, or other “socialistic” systems all over the world to get asylum or a living in western countries? The only other way around are such cases like Snowdon … and this casts a very bad light on our governments as well. But the majority flees socialistic systems and not the other way around … and that has a reason.
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Countries with low wages also tend to have very poor working conditions, few if any worker’s rights, widespread corruption, massively cramped slums, poor access to health care and often limited access to clean water.
But yeah, the beers are probably a bit cheaper, so…
Anyway, back on topic.
Behringer make cheap clones and bad mixers. People seem angry about this. I don’t really get all the fuss, it’s not like they’re the only company who’ve made their money making clones, they’re just going big. Really big. So big that it seems a bit silly, but who am I to judge?
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That’s just a fancy way of saying GAS 
As long as people are getting paid (and of course treated) fairly, and the company has good ethics I don’t care where something is made, I do think that most of us try to resist buying more than we need, but I’d also be the first to admit that temptation can be a tricky thing to avoid.
I have nothing against cheap gear, but I am also conscious that a race to the bottom is never a good thing, not for workers, not for consumers.
I have nothing against cloning old gear either, it can certainly be done well, or badly. I believe that owners of their creations should be afforded the same rights as I’d expect of my own work, I think as creatives ourselves that is a given.
The environmental impact is something that bothers me not just with Behringer but with pretty much any man made products, I want stuff to be well built to last, and I don’t mind paying a bit more for something better. I like things that are designed to be fixed and repaired easily. I don’t want to support planned/forced obsolescence and I do my best not to. (Note, again I’m not just talking about Behringer here)
So when looking at price we should also try to look at cost in a wider scope, “it costs the earth” used to be a saying for something expensive, today it means thinking about environmental factors.
I won’t even go into the conditioning that got us to this place, but I think with diligence and self discipline any of us can do better without much real negative impact, but with a bit of positive impact.
I’m definitely not saying I’m great at this, but I reckon my carbon footprint is lower than most due to how I choose to live my life, I can definitely do better and it is something I strive to do. It can be easy to get caught up in the futility, given that individuals, individually don’t count for much when compared to corporations, but without the individuals patronage of those corporations the hope is that their hand will be forced to do better too, rather than just virtue signalling.
And finally I have been enjoying slimming down my setup, too much gear (for me) is stressful and a creative hurdle, it feels good to declutter, and it also makes me much more critical of future purchases.
Of course there are certain functions and capabilities that I deem necessary in my creative endeavours so I don’t want to cut my nose off to spite my face, but what I try to do is ask myself how much do I really need something, and can the job of a few things be replaced by a single thing etc.
I was gonna delete this post, but ah fuck it take it as you will. I don’t mean it to come across as holier than thou, because I’m not.
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Great post and very honest 
Absolutely agree …
Irrespective of its political system, China is a modern country with cities that can rival any western city.
In the news reports I saw, which showed how China was handling the Covid crisis, it looked to me that the health care was pretty good.
Because China does so much manufacturing it is a country that is rapidly becoming richer and therefore, like any other country, you will get the rich, the poor and the middle class, and it will be the number of the latter that is expanding.
Good example … the Covid-19 crisis:
China is a beautiful country with a rich and ancient history. I’m sure most Chinese people are as warm and interesting as anywhere else. The problem is that China is currently being run by a bunch of nasty gangsters who are using global capitalism to expand their own interests whilst shitting on most of their own people. Yes, their middle class is getting bigger, just like it was in the 80’s and look how that decade ended.
I hope you’re right, and that China and others will follow up economic development with political and social liberalisation. The problem is that all the evidence I see suggests the very opposite is happening.
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Did you ever question why 95.5% of Chinese people are satisfied with their government, vs 38% in the US? Could it be that western press and institutions have a vested interest in demonizing any country that threatens their global hegemony? Nah, must be that 1.4 billion people are just brainwashed.
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93.4% of statistics are made up.
Statistically, I probably made this statistic up too.
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They claim something like this for Angela Merkel as well. Thats simply propaganda.
The study is from Harvard…
Propaganda from a university that is privately funded from whoever, stays propaganda. I fully agree Here with Jigs.
So the survey basically interviewed the Chinese middle class and some of the rural poor. It even admitted to not including migrant workers. I wonder how many Uyghurs they surveyed?
Also, if I lived in China and someone asked me if I love the guys with all the tanks who have almost total power over every aspect of my life and people everywhere I’d be inclined to avoid being too negative.
I’m guessing a similar survey taken in Stalin’s Russia in the 1930’s would have produced a similar result. How awesome was Stalin (winning WW2 for us notwithstanding)?
Who obviously don’t have any vested interest in keeping the CCP happy…
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What interest would that be? I must have missed the news of Harvard being bought out by the Chinese government
You can go to Xinjiang tomorrow and survey as many Uighurs as you like. It’s not off limits. 54 countries, most of them Muslim, have done just that and found no evidence of wrongdoing. Weird!
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An Observation:
We have a topic here known for hijacking threads. And what happens — it gets hijacked !
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Not questioning whether or not you can, I was questioning whether the surveyors did. Because I doubt they did.
Saudi Arabia are currently bombing the shit out of plenty of Muslims in Yemen. Just because a country is Muslim, doesn’t mean it is immediately against killing Muslims. When that same country fails to condemn China’s treatment of Muslims, I don’t see it as evidence in favour of what China is doing, more as yet another example of rulers putting their own interests first.
When you’re in the company of world leaders like Lukashenko and the Ayatollah, you’re probably in the wrong club.
Anyways, this has gone wildly off topic and you’re clearly pretty entrenched in your beliefs so I’m gonna stop wasting my time.
Behringer.
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I’m ok with clones but would be happier if credit / royalty / agreements were in place with the original developers.
The recent hires with old synth developers is a step in the right direction, hopefully they’re getting paid in addition to the exposure. The synths are ideally getting some modern enhancements.
They’ve made a few hiccups ( rd8 needs a rewrite and the 101 wasn’t quite nailed ) but the quality of most seem ok , they’re certainly not the only company making the occasional faulty item that needs to be returned.
A lot of their upcoming clones don’t interest me but my synth list is more from dance music than 70’s synth world.
Machines like wasp seem very niche to me , so an unusual release for a big synth producer.
I have a few of the clones which otherwise I wouldn’t have bought due to the prices. The original prices seem to be holding too, I haven’t seen sh101 drop in price despite ms-1 coming out.
Regarding China, I’m not a fan of their politics but USA is quite fucked up right now, every country has bias within media and use the plight of others to portray themselves in a better way, we are all manipulated( much bigger discussion for another day )
Quality control wise the decision if things get released is down to the company not down to where it’s built. If QA dept pass the devices it’s their responsibility, whether they’re actually in China or in France , Germany , uk , USA and ultimately down to the price of each component , tooling and quality of software. The various actual manufacturers ( some factories make devices for multiple synth companies ) make stuff based on the spec and what they’re told to do.
Basically to me ‘ made in China ‘ is purely that , it’s not the full story on the end quality of a product. Designed in Germany / QA in France / software in xxxxx , choice of component etc are all key factors.
I do prefer to support smaller companies such as dreadbox as I think they design and make / produce synths in house.
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Interesting debate … and I hope we will not be banned for hijacking this thread … so I try to be very short …
No … I don’t question it and I believe it’s true that Chinese people answer like this if asked. Just two examples from the recent past of Germany …
- Who would stand up in Germany during 1933 until end of WW2 against Hitler?
- Elections in the former GDR had about 98% voting with about 97% supporting the ruling party SED.
And another fact, which should not be overseen in a “modern” society is this:
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