Subwoofer recommendation

[tumulishroomaroom]

I have the Genelecs 8010a and they are very good, but of course given their tiny size they definitely don’t have much bass going on. I’ve started collaborating with a friend who has the Yamaha HS8 and although they may not be the highest grade speakers ever, I was still blown away at the bass coming out of my kick samples in the Digi and even my modular.

Except the reason I got the 8010 in the first place is that I have a very tiny desk which is recessed into a wall; so there’s no way I can go with bigger monitors. I make sub-heavy techno and I often have to use headphones to have a somewhat accurate idea of the bass in my tracks, and even then, it’s not optimal. So I’ve been looking at subwoofers.

Genelec has the 7040a sub which is made to use in conjunction with the 8010 and is supposed to work well in (very) small spaces, plus now the monitors would only treat the medium/treble signal and the sub would take the rest. However I’m still worried that it’s going to resonate a lot and be mostly unpleasant… The room I use is totally untreated, it’s half studio, half tv room, half records storage room and I can’t really treat it. I’m certainly not aiming for professional results; when the day comes and I want to have a few tracks out, someone far more professional than me will do the real mix/master.

It’s only really for my enjoyment and to have an accurate idea of what I’m jamming as I know the current installation with this desk isn’t really conductive to perfect audio quality. However it would also be a good investment as later down the line I can set up everything in a dedicated, treated room.

I have found a online shop that allows for 60days testing, so that’s probably what I’m going to do; still, it’s quite the purchase so I wanted to gather a few opinions before; like if it’s really a bad idea, or if others have similar experiences or even experience with this or other Genelec subwoofers (or other good recommendation !)

Here’s my desk space for reference :

The sub would go under the desk.

I should add that my downstair neighbor is pretty much never here !

[Fleuw]

Hi! And nothing wrong with getting a subwoofer if ur speaker lacks bottom end.
Myself have a setup with a pair of Genelec 8030 + Genelec 7050.
I bought this when i was just djing and not making music…had it for over 6 years and is very satisfied still.
So yeah try it out is my advice

[tumulishroomaroom]

Thanks for your input ! I’ll give it a try and report back. I like that the Genelec have the bass tilt feature, quite useful in such situations.

[alfred]

I also use rather small tops together with a sub, also in a completely untreated and small room. I wouldn’t want to be without one anymore. It saves desk space and it gives me an idea of what’s going on down below.

Of course it is not a perfectly linear and accurate representation, but it still helps shaping sounds. Without a sub you might craft a sound where you feel like it is a fat and juicy bass lead when it really isn’t, or you might have a massive bass rumble going on and you aren’t even aware of it and it is really out of place. Especially with experimental modular stuff that happens fast.
Also a sub helps you emotionally connect to your music more when you are creating it.
All the fine tuning you can leave up to your mixing/mastering engineer who has a professional listening environment.

[William_WiLD]

I’m not sure about that… it’s like putting a Sub in a cabinet…
How the room is behind that ?

You know at the time you have a sub the sound will turn as hell… you need space behind the monitors and sub… preferably the workspace is not exactly in the middle of the room but you have space behind and then you need to put bass trap etc… The sound can be worst without fixing acoustic room.

If the room is as I imagine I would choose more something like that but the wearing version if you don’t work sit-down on a studio chair… :
http://subpac.com/production/

If possible try the SUB before to actually buy it…
(or maybe get at least a 30 days money back)

If you’re not mixing then… no problem at all

[alfred]

Also for “acoustic treatment” you can simply put a solid sofa chair and a book shelf in your room. It can really do wonders.

[dtr]

While my preference would be larger monitors that don’t need a sub (8040’s here), in this tiny space I think your best bet is indeed to pair the 8010’s with their intended sub. Not sure if under desk is the best position though. Follow the guidelines Genelec give for it.

But be sure to have good headphones to check with as well. And A/B with known music in the same style for reference. I find that invaluable as after hours of messing around I don’t hear anymore if my bass is way off or not. Simply playing a well produced track in the same style is my reality check then.

[theianscott]

Hey, Genelec 8030& 7050 user here. Been absolute work horses for 10 years. Relevant info though - I can’t use the sub right now at all. I recently moved into a flat and have people that live below, above and to the side. The sub, even on its lowest setting, is just too much 95% of the time. However! That is actually preferable to having some larger nearfields - because I have the 8030’s AND the sub I can flick the sub on every now and again when the coast is clear then off again and not bother people (too much). What I can say, is that when you are in the right place and let the 8030’s and the 7050 work with some proper volume they are excellent!

[theianscott]

Also, what are the stands your 8010s on?

[soundklinik]

Subs have an independent volume and they can be placed anywhere in a room, on the floor! since they are omnidirectional and if you can route the signal to the sub and then to the Genelecs, the subs’ crossover should cut the low end and pass the higher frequencies to the satellites, that should help in better sound from the 8030s.

I think you can tweak the sound to your liking.

I’d go for it.

[tumulishroomaroom]

Thanks everyone for replies ! The room is actually pretty big, there’s already a sofa and a rather big shelve full of records + records spilling on the floor everywhere, + another chair + two windows (right at the back of the chair).

I’m aware of subpac but I’d prefer something that actually makes sounds as it will be used for jamming with friends from time to time. The manual from Genelec is pretty good, actually there’s even a setting for putting the sub in a cabinet… I hope with the different settings configurations it will be possible to have something decent. I can try for 60 days with free return but of course I’ll have to pay first.

I have several pairs of pretty good headphones to do A/B checks with + big Hi-fi speakers in another room which I usually use to have a fair idea of my to be finished tracks; even if they are far from transparent, at least they have plenty of bass.

Would it be useful to put absorbent foam under a sub ? I’m not too worried about my neighbors yet I don’t want to shake the whole building.

The stands are Genelec L shape stands : https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/969150-REG/genelec_8010_320b_l_shape_table_stand_for.html
Very good quality.

[reluct]

I’m also using 8030s + 7050. Works very well. Also using the sub below my desk. It sounds better with a block of foam under it. I prefer it over the yamahas. Genelecs don’t hype frequencies when setup correctly. Which is quite easy because the sub distributes the sound for you.

[soundklinik]

A piece of carpet or a door mat should be good enough, Mr Bricolage (or a carpet place) is your friend, that’s what I use for under speakers.

Just to cut the resonance…

[4.33]

Experiment with different placements of the sub and its phase in relation to monitors - aim for the balanced sound @ the sweet spot using ref tracks. Couple feet away from it you might have a huge standing wave - disregard it and pray your neighbours will as well (which they won’t).
Only use HPF on monitors if you absolutely have to, as usually it introduces even more problems.

[cretakano]

Totally get that you would rather have a sub for all the reasons you listed, but if it doesn’t work out in there for whatever reason, I would highly recommend trying a Subpac as well.

It will give you a much more accurate idea of what’s going on in the low end, and probably more enjoyment, than a sub in an untreated room.

My setup is in the corner of a room, small monitors, I work on headphones most the time, and the Subpac is the most useful thing I’ve ever bought for the studio!

[tumulishroomaroom]

Well it’s here ! I’ve just installed it (under the desk for now as it really is where it suits me best, I’ll see if the test are conclusive or not) and I’ve been throwing anything at it from Maurizio to Stevie Wonder and it’s quite a big change ! I find the 8010 clearer now that they don’t have any pressure to handle bass duties, and the subs are subtle, but definitely there.

My aim ins’t the tear down wall although this thing seems very capable in that domain, but so far I’ve mostly been lowering the volume down : since the bass is there, no need to crank it up anymore. I’ll report back after a good week of use !

Also I’ve just played the Modular / Digitakt on it for 10 minutes and it’s incredible how much more information there is. Completely re-discovered my outboard effects for example…

Thanks again everyone for your advices !

[soundklinik]

Really happy it worked for you

Good sounding system makes things sound even better, doesn’t it…

[tumulishroomaroom]

Here is some subwoofer pressure for you gals/guys :

II’m having a blast with this thing !

[Sternenlicht]

Can you recommend me a subwoofer for my studio monitors? Would you think it makes sense to buy a more expensive one? Swissonic /Genelec for example? Have you done comparisons yourself?

[Prinzabu]

Hey all!

I have a pair of Neumann KH80’s which I am utterly content with (read: super happy).

They reach down to 50 hz but below that there’s nothing, so I would like a sub woofer to complement. Thing is, if I go with Neumann’s own, it would set me back about 1200 Euros. There are cheaper ones like Swissonics for about 200 euros and everything in between.

Now to the question: what the hell is the difference in all the sub woofers!? There must be differences right? But it’s supposed to show me the levels of a very particular region in Hz. How off could the medium-lower tier ones be?

Other than the features like connections and phase inverts and what not, are the extra 1000 euros worth it for me to pick up a Neumann Sub or should I just go for something around 2-300?

My room is quite small but it has good acoustics for mixing with slanted walls and some treatment and furniture.