RYTM & OTO Boum issue

Elektron Gear Analog Rytm
#1

Hoping that one of you geniuses can help me as I’m tearing my hair out.
I have an issue that seems to be related to the pairing of my RYTM Mk1 and my OTO Machines Boum.

My setup is a Cirklon driving the RYTM over Midi Din.
The RYTM main outs go via a Samson Patchbay to the the stereo line in on channel 1 of my Xone 96 mixer.
On channels 2, 3, and 4 I have synths.
The Boum was patched into the master insert, but I noticed that whilst things sound fine in bypass, when the Boum is engaged, nothing sounded right (distortions not behaving as they should, some unpleasant additional, digital sounding noise).

After a bit of troubleshooting, I have traced the issue back to the RYTM. If I had the volume fader down on channel one on the mixer, the Boum sounded great on the insert (all the right kinds of distortion), but as soon as I started to bring in the volume on the channel 1 fader, it sounded wrong again.

After some more playing, I have found that the issue seems to be the main outs on the RYTM and the Boum not playing nicely together.
If I take the mixer out of the equation, and patch a synth or the Polyend Tracker straight into the Boum, it sounds great.
If I patch the RYTM main outs straight into the Boum, however, it sounds terrible.
The distortion sounds completely wrong, and worst of all, if I crank up the Level pot on the Boum, as I get to about 2 O’Clock on the dial, it suddenly emits an ear destroying, digital sounding high pitched distortion. Awful.

I thought maybe it was a strange power issue (as both were on the same plug extension cable) - but I separated them and the result was the same.
The results are also the same with or without the patchbay in the signal path.

If I patch the individual RYTM outs (eg. BD/SD) into the Boum it sounds fine.
The RYTM main outs on their own sound fine with the Boum on bypass.
All other synths I’ve tried patched directly into the Boum sound fine.

What could be going on??
I can’t work out if its the Boum that is the issue, or the RYTM.
They both seem to work ok in isolation. Just not together.

Anyone using these two together? Any similar issues?
Would be very grateful if anyone has a potential solution!

#2

Is the Rytm applying reverb and/or distortion? Is the compressor’s output set too hot? The individual outs would bypass these. Reverb into an overdrive is typically very unpleasant and noisy, and overdrives also respond differently to input level signal.

Also, the main outs essentially have all of the signal from the individual outs all on the same set of outs, so is your general output volume too high? What happens if you use mutes to make the main outs as close to the individual ones?

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#3

Did you try connecting something else than BOUM to mixer insert just to confirm that insert is passing signal as expected ?

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#4

This sound like you’re getting feedback somehow?
Any way there’s audio being fed out and back in via the RYTM? Overbridge? Audio input?

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#5

Thanks so much guys.

Good thoughts. Compressor was set to mix 0. Just tried with the reverb and delay both set to 0 volume - still the same.

Fiddling with the volumes mutes gives the same outcome.

Yeah. The issue persists even if I take the mixer out of the equation completely.
I guess the reason I kept the mixer story in my original post was to highlight that even if I include just a small amount of the RYTM signal in the mix feed to the Boum, it messes up the entire output signal.
Like there is something in the RYTM signal that sends the Boum haywire. And it sounds like digital distortion.

Definitely sounds like feedback!
But OB not connected. And nothing going into the RYTM ins.

Just can’t get my head around it.
Again, thanks so much for the suggestions.

#6

Last recommendation I can think of… if you start a fresh project with default sounds, apply a few basic trigs, does it happen? Change as little as possible for the test.

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#7

Well the TL:DR summary is that this worked, but I have literally no idea what was going on.
I traced the problem back to the CH channel on the RYTM (channel 9).

I unplugged everything to leave just the RYTM sequencer driving the sounds through the main outs to the Boum.

If I placed trigs on all tracks and cranked up the distortion on the Boum, it all sounded great, except when I placed trigs on the CH track.
These trigs would essentially choke the Boum effect (as if it each trig was sending a CC to the bypass switch on the Boum, but no midi plugs were in either device!?)
The choking/bypass effect was directly affected by the Hold length on the amp page of the CH, and occurred even when the volume of both the sample page and synth page were set to zero.

I no longer got the digital high pitched noise without the cirklon driving the RYTM.

Starting a new project seemed to fix things.

I honestly have no explanation for what was going on. It’s almost as if there was bleed of midi data though the CH channel to the main outs. I don’t know.
Very strange, but it seems to be fixed for now.

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#8

For the distortion problem it could be that the headroom on the Boum inputs is exceded. So when you have a high level out from the Rytm it overloads the inputs and starts to distort. Your mixer might have a higher headroom as well.

For the high pitched whine it could be a groundloop. Check what gear that has a ground connected, or is in “contact” with USB and a computer. Might be something there.

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#9

I just saw that the inputs on Boum are rated as +20 dBu. That should be enough for most things. But it seems to have an input gain. If that is set too high it might mess things up.

Another thing is that compressors can give some ugly sideeffects when attack is too fast. Specs on Boum says it can do half a millisecond of attack time. That can distort things quite heavily. But it will be in time with the kick of bass for the most part.

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#10

Cheers dude.
Thought about both of those.
Tried with varying input levels, but as I say, the choking effect on the Boum bypass even happened when trigs were firing but the volume on the CH synth/sample pages was set to zero!
Meanwhile, I could fire all the outputs at it from all the other RYTM channels with no issues.

Re. the ground loop, I tried to take all possible ground loops out of the equation, and even tried with a ground loop isolator in the signal path. No joy!
To be honest though, it sounded nothing like ground hum. It was harsh bursts of ear splitting digital distortion. Very bad for the ears!

Also, I tried reloading the RYTM project that was causing the problems, and the same thing happened. So it is obviously something about the settings in that project that have caused the issue. Really have no idea what though.

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#11

Glad it is just a setting issue and not a hardware problem! Another thing I would check is the release time on the analog engine of the problem track. If set to infinite, it could be building up noise on you. This can happen even when primarily using samples.

Another potential is that you have some human-inaudible noise, such as having a filter with high resonance outside of human hearing that, while you can’t hear, may be exciting the Boum a bit much.

#12

Very strange. I dont own either products so cant do some testing. Just answered on a more general basis. But it does seem like the CH channel is sending out something that the Boum picks up, but you cant hear. Try different sounds on that channel. Maybe there is some DC offset or low frequency content comming from that channel.

And try increasing attack time of the compressor. I was surprised of how nasty compressor distortion could sound when i abuse mine with fast attack times.

#13

Boum has some… unusual parameters.

What do you have the compression knob set to? Are you familiar with how it will provide negative compression when compression knob is set past (if I remember correctly) 12 o’clock?

Also since there is no threshold setting on the boum it is quite sensitive to incoming volume levels.

My wild guess is wide band noise hats + higher input + negative Compression ratio on boum

#14

Try plugging in 1/4 headphone jack, into ext in… Could be feedback, I get this with my Deluge, leave a Jack in the back, when I sample into it.

#15

If I had to guess it sounds like a sub-bass issue which would eat up headroom on a compressor - I would apply the LO CUT on Setting 1 and use parallel compression (MIX at 50%)

Come on boys and girls it’s been 2 years let’s fix this.

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#16

Reading this makes me wonder if the CH sound had loads of hidden energy, perhaps sub-bass, or possibly even energy in the region over your hearing ceiling. If there was a lot of energy in either region, the Boum’s distortion and/compressor would start working on it, and the distortion would definitely introduce unwanted frequencies; the compressor would start behaving very strongly, and in sync with the CH track trigs.

Did you try aggressively LPF or HPF-ing this sound? Did it make any difference?

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#17

OK that kills my theory.

#18

I think the Boum has a midi sidechain. Maybe the CH channel is sending a note or CC message on a specific channel that is triggering it.

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#19

But you’re sequencing externally right? Do you have a MIDI cable plugged into the Boum? If so this sounds like sidechain, which Boum can react to over MIDI.

@HoldMyBeer Jinx!

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#20

I’ve just come across this thread, and having similar issues with the OTO Boum running through RME Totalmix.

If I set up the Boum as an insert in Totalmix I get far more distortion at the slightest turn of a knob, especially with the drive and level. It feels a lot more muffled and wooly sounding and feels very much like what @dcsux was experiencing.

This happens when running the Syntakt in Overbridge mode out from Ableton, routing to Totalmix using the Boum as an insert effect. I’m not running hot out from the channel or anything unusual. It even does this when you reduce the Syntakt channel output level (both in Ableton and RME Totalmix) and even the in gain in the Boum.

The Boum works fine using the exact same settings when not running in Overbridge mode, and going direct from the Syntakt outputs into the Boum and through Totalmix. I can’t even replicate the issue that I experience when using Overbridge when going direct from the Syntakt.

I’ve tried swopping out cables (unbalanced), and also tried using different channels on my Ferrofish Pulse and the same thing happens. I’ve also swopped out the Boum for the OTO BIM/BAM on the same channel, and they seem totally fine, which seems to rule out an issue with my RME Digiface/Ferrofish Pulse.

The Ferrofish has a max I/O of +20 dBu which equals the Boum’s Output of +20 dBu which I’ve made sure I’ve accommodated for in the settings

I did come across a thread on Gearspace, which the OP was having a very similar issue, but there didn’t seem to be any resolve in that thread.

So… :slight_smile: I just wondered if anyone was having a similar issue, or if @dcsux managed to sort the problem with the AR as this feels really similar? Thx :slight_smile:

OTO Machines FX - BIM BAM BOUM