Pattern change one bar late issue

That’s a great response imo. They’ve understood your frustrations and gone to great lengths to explain the situation. All that was said by the support team makes perfect sense to me.


If you create a midi track for your Program Change channel, you can use the jog wheel to flip between programs on MPC.

For the above photo, I have programs on #’s 48-53 on Elektron sequencer, and I can flip between all of them manually without using step edit. As long as you turn before the end of a sequence, it jumps to whichever pattern you want. JJOS might be slightly different but it should work the same way.

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What gears are you use, A4 have song aranger too. why you dont use A4 as master and other gears as slave ? I have Octatrack as master and other gears Slave - Digitakt, Digiton and Akai MPC live… All work perfect and all machine use own sequencer.


I have used the Analog four as Master program change and the Digitakt as master clock for the past years.
I prefer much more having the MPC live as master PC and clock for all my gear because it’s more convenient for me. The MPC has 4 midi outs and with the JJOS it is an absolute beast that make it obvious being the brain of the set up.

I know that I can PC with the A4 and that’s how I’m doing it but it’s not the purpose of this thread. I want the pattern of slaved elektron gear to change right on time when it is asked by another master machine which is not an Elektron. Just this.
I prefer to do it with the MPC because it is the brain of the set up and I’m always using it. I’m always in front of the MPC and if I want to jam only with the MPC and Digitakt/Digitone I would have to connect the A4 just for the PC ? Come on… this doesn’t looks like complicated to integrate an option.
Also the song mode on the MPC is much better to organize

@Kpucski If I understand correctly you change the number of PC everytime you want to change the sequence on Elektron gear ? I have tried this and yes it work but I find this a bit disconcerting.
I just want to change my pattern from Sequence 01 to Sequence 02 on the MPC and all the Elektron gear to follow right on time !!! Not having to change the number of the right settings at the right bar so the Elektron can follow :tired_face:. Morever this way I can’t properly use song mode.

For such machines it’s not a crime to ask for a direct pattern change or a way to make this work when it’s slaved.
If it’s not a bug that a slave machines pattern change one bar late then what is it ? Just integrate an option to direct pattern change when PC is received. :pensive:

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If it’s not a bug that a slave machines pattern change one bar late then what is it ? Just integrate an option to direct pattern change when PC is received.

damn. drops mic


Couldn’t this potentially risk changing patterns out of sync? A midi message can’t always be send/received perfectly on time. It’s a serial protocol, so it depends on what else is being sent, right? Also the device that receives the pc has to process it.

Cueing pattern changes work, but making sure a pc message will always be spot on, is that really possible (without cueing a pattern change)? Or would that be negligible?


I know this doesn’t help when using hardware only, but I created Pattern Clips to solve this exact problem.

It only solves the problem if your using Ableton Live and Max to send the program changes though.

It seems fitting for someone who comes across this thread who is using Ableton Live.


Yes. I do this while I’m building the sequences I want in my song. Afterwards, I’ll organize them and arrange into a master “Song Sequence”.

At this point, I insert all the Program/Patch Changes for my Elektrons and whatever else is being used. It takes a bit of planning but it’s not too much hassle when you get the hang of it.

I agree with you that it would be nice to Direct Jump. I think it would probably get pretty choppy with multiple sequencers running.

Just hooked up the rytm to DN for the first time. I had hoped I could utilize song mode on rytm to make a full track with just these 2 boxes and have the patterns change at same time. This doesn’t seem to be the case - DN is changing late.

Is this really “just how it is”?? :frowning:

Do the pattern length settings of the patterns on both machines match (M.LEN / CH.LEN)?

If there is a mismatch they will schedule the change at the same time, but they will not change at the same time.

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I had another look at the lengths of the tracks and possibly it’s a bug or possibly I’m misunderstanding something. My intention was to have a pattern that would change after 64 steps, however potentially have infinite loop so that polymetric stuff would never reset.

So I had

CHLEN: 64.

This didn’t work

However when I change it so that
LEN: 64

M. LEN: 64

It now seems to work, but of course the polymetric stuff will now reset after 64 steps too. I think I can live with this :slight_smile:
thank you!

I would at least submit a support ticket @ to inform them since this behavior is definitely not correct. With the same CH.LEN both devices should switch at the same time, of course.


Still nothing… Very disapointed…
I’ve been changing the midi routing of my machines to get everything working right but I can’t get it right because of this issue and the ‘Live record mod wheel PB data from external keyboard?’ issue… Both issues are very crippling.

The problem is that they developped an internal MIDI processing that is working only for the Elektron gear which is cueing the next pattern. But they absolutely missed all the other possibilities of using MIDI including with their gear.

For example now, I’m using:

  • The Digitakt as MASTER, send program changes
  • MPC as Slave, MIDI IN: Arturia MIDI Keyboard AND Digitakt; MIDI OUT: Digitakt (MPC has 2 MIDI IN, 4 MIDI OUT)
  • Analog four as Slave, MIDI IN: MPC

The Digitakt start and send the clock to all the machines, I can send mod wheel PB data from external keyboard as it pass through the MPC to the Analog Four (and Digitakt). The digitakt can’t send mod wheel PB but the MPC can. This is why I want my Analog Four to be followed by the MPC. Also because I can resample MIDI sequence into the MPC and then mute each A4 individual tracks… but I also want to use the A4 sequencer if needed… in short this is my workflow…

But if I pattern change on the Digitakt, the MPC will follow nicely but not the Analog Four ! Two elektron machines that can’t sync correctly, so frustrating !

Indeed, the MPC will pattern change right on time with the Digitakt because when it receive a Program Change (or Pattern Change in Elektron jargon) it changes immediatly. The MPC also send a Program Change to the Analog Four but the A4 will cue it instead of changing immediatly. And that’s why it change one pattern late.

Why don’t they put a checkbox option like ‘Direct Program change on Program Change receive’ ?
That’s all I’m asking and I know it is absolutely possible to develop this because it receive a Program Change detection as it is shown as ‘cueing’, why not change directly ? Is it because the Elektron gear is made to be working only with other Elektron machines ? Why there isn’t any update about this ?

In short, if the master device can’t send the program change a few ms before the pattern change is supposed to happen, an Elektron device will always change too late

The problem is not the MASTER, it’s the SLAVE !

When a program change message is sent to an Elektron device, the corresponding pattern is cued for change. This means that the program change needs to be received a few ms before the pattern change is supposed to happen.

Make a checkbox in the settings to disable the cued for change and make it change instantly please ! The cue is interesting when it is synced between two Elektron devices, but if I put a device (here the MPC) on the middle of Elektron Master and Elektron Slave or a non-Elektron device as MASTER it will always change one bar late !

This makes me crazy, I’ve spend hours trying to figure it out and make it work just as expected. I’m a developper as full time job and music producer as passion and this makes me want to develop something just to make it work! I will try to investigate as I see Elektron isn’t very responsive sadly…

The Elektron device can not foresee the future.

Indeed, a 1980’s MPC can do what your gear can’t

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I have finally found a solution using a MIDI merger.

Digitakt MASTER settings: send clock; transport; prog chang
Digitakt OUT -> Kenton Thru IN

MPC SLAVE settings: Sync In: 1; Out On
Out A: Off

MPC IN 1 : Kenton Thru 1
MPC IN 2: Arturia MIDI Keyboard
MPC Out A: MIDI Merger IN 1

MIDI Merger:

  • IN 1 -> MPC OUT A
  • IN 2 -> Kenton Thru 2
  • Out 1 -> Analog Four MK2

This way, the MIDI Merge can merge the MPC pattern change AND the digitakt pattern change (going through the Kenton Thru), as it receive both time the pattern change message, it will change for sure the Analog Four pattern which is connected FROM the MPC :slight_smile:

Kind of abusive they didn’t implement anything about this and for sure won’t as they developed it for Elektron only. It says a lot and I take a big consideration on this for futur purchase.
I’ve found a solution and I’m happy with it. Not to forget that this solution cost me more than one hundred euros.

Somehow, my DN and DT have suddenly gone out of sync. I have master and channel change lengths the same, (256 and 16) but some tracks have different tempo multiplier/divisors. Up until I tried routing everything via usb midi on my iPad, the patterns changed fine with regular midi din. Now they’ve suddenly gone out off sync with the one pattern late issue. Bah.

I just wanted to add that this is still an issue even though I have found a work around.
Why do Elektron is the only company that ‘cue’ a pattern change ?
I mean all the other gear, racks, effects, synths instantly change the pattern an not Elektron ?
Why isn’t there an option for this ?

When for example sending a program change from Ableton, you will need to use a negative track delay for the track/clip in order for the program change to be sent early enough for the Elektron device to have time to cue the pattern.

I call this a bug

When PROGRAM CHANGE SEND is enabled on an Elektron device that acts as master, the program change will always be sent a few ms early so the receiving Elektron device has time to cue the pattern. That’s why it’s working in an Elektron ecosystem.

And this is a shame that it only works between two Elektron devices

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Yeah, it’s the only thing that really gets me down with Elektron, it’s only in the last few years they’ve implemented both LSB & MSB for bank changes, for years it meant the Octatrack couldn’t send bank changes to gear unless it only used MSB. That used to drive me mad…

Since getting an MPC as my main hub, the pattern change problem has become a lot more significant for me. If using the program change box on an MPC track or automation the Rytm starts 1 step late for some bizarre reason. I think it’s pretty shocking they keep making new devices that inherit this atrocious behaviour. I have a lot of love for these machines but this issue always feels like they’re just taking the piss out of me. It’s such basic midi stuff…

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Syntakt released but still nothing about this, ew elektron

Isn’t the ongoing issue that other devices send pattern change instructions “on time”, too late to be followed up on when the pattern has already started repeating?

How is this handled better in other pattern-based sequencers if you can’t look ahead?

I’m not saying it hasn’t been handled in other, more controlled ecosystems between devices of the same manufacturer (Elektron obviously sends the change request earlier in the process.)


Don’t plan on hearing anything about it. It’s been an issue for many years with many different types of MIDI controlled sequencers. If you dig you’ll find threads from years ago.

I even made a software solution for Ableton Live to get things to sync.

You absolutely have to send the program change early.

You best bet is to look for an outside solution.

I’ve had thoughts about a master control box. One that could send a set of user defined program changes to multiple boxes at the user’s request.

Only a thought though, I have no plans to make one currently.

Get creative. Maybe you could use something that already exists to send a bunch of program changes when you want?

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