And if anyone at corporate Elektron is listening, stay away from politics and divisive “social issues” such as this. You’ll only piss off customers or would be customers, you won’t gain new ones. Your userbase is not homogeneous in their thinking or life experiences, as evidenced by this thread.
Do good without alienating your customers and you’ll be around for awhile. 
Dude, my drum machine drifts like Lars.
I was very Lars this Jamuary, trying to make a OK performance with a gear i barely Know…
Man if I were Elektron I’d very much want to distance myself from people whose philosophy includes defending nomenclature derived from such a power dynamic.
Good riddance.
Hell yeah brother. and Elektron, while youre at it, stop using sustainable materials and paying your employees a fair wage. Those are just divisive social issues.
FWIW in this context (midi sync) Elektron already use clock send/receive so no change needed there.
In pickup machines they use master/slave.
There you go. Point out where a single person here has suggested Elektron switch to child labor and dirty diesel generators powered by baby seal fat.
Just stop.
That is all it is, not defence of actual slavery, this is where I think people are getting wires crossed.
I’m not sure anyone here claimed anyone else was defending slavery, so no wires crossed.
However it is the language of slavery; its relationship is that of a abhorrent power dynamic, a system the vestiges of which we still dealing with today. It’s offensive to me, a number of others here on the board and at least to a good many others in the music community and further. There are living people who take offense to it and that should be enough reason to change it. That you don’t take offense to it is beside the point as a small change would not seemingly affect you in any way (I assume you don’t still use nor would defend terms that were at one time considered perfectly acceptable but now are repugnant)
It comes off to me that you would prefer not to be inconvenienced than ensure others are not made upset. And that to me is kind of sad tbh.
We can walk and chew bubblegum. They are both problems. We can improve language and combat inhumane mining conditions. The existence of a worse problem doesn’t mean we shouldn’t also try to solve the lesser problem.
Also, this is Elektronauts - it’s more relevant to discuss midi than mining, here.
Not in so many words, but the expressions “racist”, “support racist speech”, and recently “good riddance” have been used because some people think that referring to a tape machine is as “slave” is not racist and not hateful towards anyone. That’s the only actual hate speech I have seen in this thread (towards people rather than tape machines). This has been directed at people who’s race you don’t even know, and about who’s racial ties and behavior you have no clue. “Slave” isn’t even race-specific, it denotes social-economic class.
I do not believe that upsetting no-one is feasible. I also don’t believe it is anyones god-given right to never be upset by anything. The call for some imaginary form of speech which is 100% “inclusive” of everyone is in itself exclusionary of many who have a different opinion on speech without being an inch more racist than you are. Puritanism and moral absolutism have their own dark past. When you declare “good riddance” of these people you are being offensive, exclusive and rude. One more time, I am not specifically for or against replacing “slave” with “Rx”. I am firmly against labeling someone as a racist based on their opinion on such a matter.
Its not about me being inconvenienced at all, most of the gear I use does not use master/slave anyway for midi sync. I think that having lots of different terms for the same thing is impractical, especially for newcomers, there is enough confusing terminology already when starting out. Earlier in the thread examples were given where it had been changed, and different companies already using different terms than each other is pretty daft.
I think that offence is a different concept for different people, and no doubt people are offended by different things, I don’t think it is realistic or in my power to ensure that people are not offended about something.
I would not dig my heels in about it being changed, but I also think that if we were to censor and change everything that anyone got offended by then where does it stop? Who gets to decide? What about when people start saying something offends them that does not offend you? What qualifies offence?
I think that if I were to design a product I would use clock send/receive, but I would not actively avoid a product that used master/slave because I can separate the distinct meanings.
First off I want to be clear that I personally never called anyone a racist.
But it’s very simple: There are people who will happily change their behavior if it upsets anyone. There are those who won’t. People who defend master-slave are the latter
On the other hand, I personally couldn’t give a rats ass about the feelings of people who defend oppressive-system mentality. Again: good riddance to all l that.
Good night.
Just to start, you’ve been one of the more reasonable voices here who is skeptical of the name change. I think it’s important to point that out because I disagree with your point of view but dont want to be hostile. I agree that there are already lots of confusing terms in electronic music and computing in general. However the goal isnt to introduce multiple new replacements for Master/Slave. We’re trying to discuss all the options and then hopefully come to an agreement about what the best replacement is which would then eventually replace M/S universally. So the issue of confusion becomes moot. I also don’t think anyone has proposed boycotting any brands that use M/S. These are sort of strawman arguments.
You’re right that there are questions about the “slippery slope”, and others have brought up some good points about other types of language that may need to change. However the scope or difficulty of a problem shouldn’t be a reason to avoid it.
As for “who gets to decide”, we do that through conversation and consensus. Obviously, whoever makes a product gets to name it. And if enough people at Elektron agree that Master/Slave is problematic and that it’s worth changing, then they will. That’s why it’s worth having this conversation here.
I try not to upset anyone on purpose, and I’m not defending it.
I even said that it was not a good choice of terms in the first place, but it has been used for decades now and has other meanings due to this.
This was what I meant about wires getting crossed.
The only current Elektron product that uses it is the Octatrack in the pick up machines, TX/RX won’t work there, nor would send/receive or leader/follower.(which itself could be objectionable to some people)
Edit: Ok seems master isn’t objectionable (inconsistent to me, but whatever) so master and ?
how about just A & B or 1 & 2 / Teacher & Student, Master & Apprentice ??
dang, they unlisted my topic
guess some were rubbed the wrong way by it
ah well
what topic shall I create tomorrow?
probably none - just gonna make some music for a while
talk to you guys later
stay safe - be well!!
x1212
Synced?
Normally after a nights sleep I can usually move on from threads like this that flare up via some strong opinions. But no, still shaking my head that Midi terminology and words like “blacklist” are being cancelled/censored due to some perceived offence.
I’m not passionate enough to go marching the streets if any of these “offensive” words were to change but I’m not going to be able to stop myself expressing disappointment and from holding a stance against this sort of thing. I still believe this forum is open to expressing a difference of opinion after all (most of the time).
Opinions are like arseholes - we’ve all got one. So listen, I appreciate where everyone is coming from but (in a wider language sense) this is one of those lines I don’t think I will be voluntarily crossing.