Digital or Analog Patchbays – what are my options in 2021?

Don’t see why you couldn’t do what you want with an analog patchbay combined with an audio interface + good mixing/routing software (ex., analog bay + RME +Totalmix)

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I think with half-normal mode you can duplicate the signal and with a bunch of cables you can route 1 inputs to many or all output.
Ok it’s a bit tricky but worth 3000€

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Okay, you got me. Changed thread title and added analog as well.

Can you MIDI control analog patchbays? What I’d love to have: a digital matrix – I know MOTU has a nice one

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I don’t know if “smart” analog patch bays are even a thing that exists. All I know is, using an audio interface, once the signal is in, the mix software can be used to mix and match whatever combo of inputs to whatever outputs. Outputs then go back to the patch bay, and there you have it. Not sure what software supports a matrix interface, but don’t you want to be able to set individual levels? A matrix without levels could lead to a channel overload very quickly.

From the 3000€ Flockaudio digital (??!) patchbay: https://www.flockaudio.com/support

Is PATCH really 100% analog?

Yes - Because PATCH doesn’t ever convert your audio signal path from Analog to Digital, the system is truly 100% analog. The PATCH System does not have any form of A/D or D/A conversion built with-in it.

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I’ve actually have a relevant question about RME Totalmix FX:

I’d need to check this, not sure. It’s possible the pops are masked by some kind of automated volume fade. I’ll try it tonight.

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Cool. Whatever tech it takes to actually do that in the analog domain is probably why that thing costs so much.

Ok duly noted; thank you so much. :slight_smile:

I was referring to digitally controlled analog patchbays in the other thread…

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/StuPatch9625--switchcraft-studiopatch-9625-96-point-tt-db25-patchbay

You your showing is just a physical interface instead of software.

And honestly in this day and and, you’d be better off with 3-5 interfaces like a MOTU 16a and using what you are showing above and using AVB which will give you 1000s of audio channels to route over Ethernet.

I have MOTU stuff, unfortunately it’s not midi controlled

Edit: and to. E honest…the hardware of MOTU took a step forward, but I’m about to sell my MOTU stuff as I most run an iOS central rig, and that routing matrix is web based, which means on an iPad I can only access it via WiFi…which sucks when you’re trying to use it in a live mixing setting

if you need more than the ~24 inputs something like a RME/Motu would provide you can look into starting a Dante network. You can add multiple soundcards that can be routed in any way between different computers if needed. Not sure what’s the max channel count but it’s a lot.

And you can control the routing on your computer using Dante controller

Ok, I just tried this. RME Fireface UFX, latest drivers, Mac OS Mojave. No drop outs, popping, or clicking for me when switching between snapshots. Audio is continuous. Pretty cool find, seems like snapshot switching could be used in performance, no problem :grin:

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Could you record a snippet? :sweat_smile:

Reason I ask is I’ve been using a few recently acquired CVilization modules + an Ebtech LLS-8 for this popless functionality —Though they emit slight fades which is a tad irksome, but yeah

You’re the first person who’s been able to get back to me about it. (Not even RME has)

I’m not entirely sure if I can still return the CVilizations, but it would just be nice to have absolute certainty that it’d meet my needs before going down that route (heh).

Many many thanks for checking it out in the first place tho. :heart:

How to select on an analog patchbay which sound goes to which Machine ?
Can I organise a patchbay to have different rooting with my elektrons machines and some FX pedals ?
If I sometimes want to have different signal chain

This is where normal, half normal and thru come in.

sounds pretty basic / limiting to use an analog patchbay tbh. I want flexibility and not patching cables all the time. RME and Motu seem to be an okay‘ish alternative. Still waiting for other digital options! Preferably standalone (I think the older 828 MOTU have a menu/interface to do routings without a PC?)

Sounds like what u are after is AVB/Dante stuff.
You’d probably be better off with a bunch of 16a’s and an AVB switch

I recorded a couple snippets at your request. First is Digitone, 8 bars of a full mix getting routed and rerouted by my selecting a couple different snapshots in TotalMix. Second is a 6 bar Digitone sine wave so you can really listen for any drop outs. For both samples I switched between snapshots maybe five or six times. I can’t hear (or see) any glitches or drop outs. Couldn’t even tell you where in the sample I switched snapshots :grin:

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Thanks, man :heart: — so was the Digitone tracked to different audio tracks, or did it remain the same? There aren’t any fades on CVilization when the particular connection doesn’t change; it fades only when a change to the output is made.

Also, am I correct in that there are only 8 snapshots per workspace and workspace changes can’t be remotely controlled?

So what you’re talking about is a digitally controlled analog crosspoint switch.

Analog Devices (AD) the integrated circuit company makes versions of this some going into very high frequency ranges often used for video signals. To make stuff with them you’d need to make the digital control system to tell the AD device how to connect all the analog connections inside the chip, and you’d need some analog circuitry to process your analog signals so that they behave well going into and coming out of the crosspoint switch.

Here’s the data sheet for a 32 x 32 crosspoint switch chip:

They make these chips so you can string them together and make a larger system.

One nice thing about this rather than processing things digitally, is there is virtually no latency. The signal goes from A to B at analog speeds.

Not sure why these aren’t more common. They exist for signals other than audio.

Vermona showed a 16 x 16 virtual patch manager in Eurorack at the 2018 NAMM. I don’t think it ever became a real product.

There was a company Anatal, who tried to launch a 64 x 64 crosspoint switch on Kickstarter but it failed to fund. They were working on really massive connection systems too, with built in analog synths, and analog processors, that could be patched with digital commands.

The development of this sort of technology goes way back to analog telephone connection systems, Bell Telephone days.

EDIT: Fixed bad link.

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