Windows 'noob' : best practice advice?

The Lounge General Discussion
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My first computer was an Atari STe configured to look like a mac on screen; my second was a Compaq PC which was styled like the iconic Macintosh. Thereafter, and this was pre-internet, i have been a Mac user and lately Chromebook user for ‘home’ browsing.

Couldn’t get a deal on the right Chromebook to replace my broken one this BF, so ended up with a modest windows machine 8gb i5(12thgen). I have a few specific use cases i could never accommodate straightforwardly on a Mac, so this gives me a bit of flexibility to get some utility beyond browsing. So my questions are about pain free windows, i am not asking about audio configuration stuff and so on - i’ll use my MBP for that, although i will likely put Max on the Windows M/C and probably the Nord Modular editor and a few other windows only utilities, but i want to avoid hassles and make the experience as close to a chromebook as possible - browse quickly and exploit keyboard shortcuts to important stuff/sites and have zero bloatware woes or anti-virus nagging etc.

I stumbled across a post suggesting to do stuff on first install (i ain’t started this up yet) perhaps in terms of cleaning out windows to a pure install or for enabling a ‘local’ account as opposed to online windows one?! I am unsure of that because clearly the device has some asus stuff baked into it for its bespoke parts - but i wonder if there’s a good way to minimise the scope for being spammed by stuff i don’t need and to keep it clean and lean without using too much headspace. I also want to run it light so that if i step out of simply browsing on it, it will at least be a useful utility elsewhere.

Happy to read any useful insights so that i can avoid learning the hard way, or avoid having to reinstall and so on.

One thing i will lose out on is Linux (and android apps) from the chromebook, is there a way to dual boot for Linux on a windows machine that isn’t too hacky - i might consider that as a handy option but if it meant partitioning now it’d be good to anticipate this

I’m looking to work with it offline ideally (so no online storage, no AI features and so on and i’ll stick with Google for home office stuff) so any advice related to getting the machine to run lean in this way would be welcome.

I’m up for recommendations on QOL software that might make for a simpler experience, especially anything related to getting intuitive access to stuff directly through the keyboard - even when i jump onto a Mac it feels clunky browsing compared to the Chromebook

If there’s any Windows only ‘gold’ audio-related-stuff out there it won’t do any harm to recommend it - one other thing i haven’t nailed is finding a database with a pain free way to design a visual front end with good looking UI options - I had been happily using Filemaker many many moons ago and haven’t managed to replace that with anything, i’d imagine there’s a lot more options available on windows but then there’s more reason to be vigilant on where you pick stuff up

Basically, hit me up with any best practice advice or things for me to read up on for getting the best out of a modest Windows 11 home machine (or avoiding pitfalls), mainly for day to day usage, but any advice related to occasional audio/midi usage/configuration might be useful for others coming from Mac

Any reason to stall on initially setting this thing up, or is everything doable from scratch (like a factory reset) or can/should i back up once launched/configured before tinkering ?

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Windows 11 Home forces you to use a Microsoft account to explode the OS on the first run. Used to have a hack but it no longer works. Also, 11 Home will not work with a professional Microsoft account, has to be a home account, luckily they are free but still stupid!

If you do not want to use an online Microsoft account after the initial install, you can create an offline account in the other users sections of settings. Make sure to change to admin privileges, by default it’s standard. This is good practice so if you ever lose the online account, you can still get into the laptop.

Once in be sure to check for updates in settings It will run through an update upon the first run but it will not get them all. Also, check optional updates for any drivers.

Open control panel, programs, and features. Uninstall everything you do not need. Including the free AV, they will push on. When AV is uninstalled Windows built-in AV will automatically enable. It works well.

I also install Google Chrome and Adobe PDF Reader and set them as default. Edge, by default, has those duties and kinda sucks at them!

If it will not allow you to install outside apps it’s in S-Mode which forces you to use the Microsoft Store. You can exit S-Mode in the settings. Just search in the bottom search bar.

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Virtual box is free and really cool to use. Create a virtual machine and boot your flavor of Linux in it. Works really well and no need to boot into one or the other.

https://www.virtualbox.org/

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Advice: Uninstall Windows.

I don’t say that as a Mac Freak, Linux Nerd, etc.

I’ve run Windows since version 3. I’ve built PCs since XT 4.7 MHz :smiley: I’ve even worked for MS. :smiley:

I was still happily running Windows until early versions of Windows 11.

They’ve been slowly turning Windows into a subscription model, closed system, with zero privacy, user rights, etc. It’s not ALL the way there yet, but they are steadily approaching it.

Live ID is now required, and they keep making it harder to skirt that for a local account.

They constantly reset your privacy settings with just about every update.

They constantly push One Drive (cloud storage) at you, Office 365, etc. Just gets annoying after a while.

The introduced Recall, which basically records everything you do in the OS. They say that’s not so they can take that data and use it for things… They say a lot of things.

I’ve spent most of the Windows 10 and 11 product cycles just putting up with these things as they came along, talking myself out of doing anything about it, but I was holding out because of my game collections that were primarily Windows, and the last time I had tried Linux for general (non-IT) use at home, most of my things didn’t work or work well on it.

However, a couple weeks back Microsoft pushed me too far, I installed Linux Mint, and all of my games run on it. It performs excellently. Was easy to install and set up the way I like it. Finally free of that. :slight_smile: Quite happy to have jumped. I use Macbooks for my mobile computing, (have for years) so this transition was primarily just for my home PCs. Couldn’t be happier though now with my OSes. :slight_smile:

Now I know that may not be the useful advice that you were looking for. :smiley: More of a Windows rant from me in the wrong place. Apologies for that.

All that said though, you might want to TRY Linux. You can put it on a USB Flash drive, boot from it, and run it as though it was installed, and just see how you like the interface, tools available, software manager, etc. It doesn’t install anything, or change your drives in any way unless you then actually do a full install of it. It just runs off the USB drive for evaluation or emergency use purposes.

I recommend Mint (just search for Linux Mint). It’s about as seemless of an OS experience as I’ve ever had, and I’m really impressed with it. I always laughed at “Switch to Linux” pushers in the past (even though I’ve used it enough for work and experimenation, education etc.) But it honestly is great now. Worth a try anyway. It’s closer to Mac OS than Windows, so you might actually feel more at home with it, and it uses a lot less system resources for most tasks.

I’m not sure about Windows Only audio software at this point as everything that I run works on many different platforms. However, when I’m not doing audio on my MBP, I’ve also had a good Reaper/Ozone setup on one or two of my PCs, and it works absolutely flawlessly. You need a good audio interface though if you want decent latency. In my experience, Mac OS is a lot more forgiving with built-in hardware, lower cost interfaces, etc. than Windows is. I’ve had good luck with MOTU, RME, Focusrite and others in Windows, but some interface drivers definitely work better than others. I definitely recommend Reaper though for a good Windows DAW (that also doesn’t cost much). Ozone is my favorite tool suite, and runs great on Windows too.

If you have Mac licenses for these, you can already use them on Windows.

As far as other window managers, UI extensions, etc. I always found that running this sort of thing on Windows was a bit clunky, and actually made things more cumbersome than just getting used to the built in OS interfaces. But that’s me. :smiley: I don’t have any good recommendations for that though. In my experience, there’s nothing like say Directory Opus on the Amiga that actually improves on the built-in experience.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your initial setup settings. Just do the normal express installation, then go in and customize your settings afterwards. It’s basically the same either way at this point since they’ve been locking down a lot of the opt-in/out things and advanced options we once had during install. Also, as soon as you install a big update rollup or version increase, it will reset all the things that you had set the last time. At least with privacy settings. (which are the most important)

I don’t predict you’ll have any issues running Windows honestly. It just comes down to what you’re willing to allow MS to do before they push you over the edge like they did for me finally. It took decades, but they finally did it. :smiley:

Go Linux and MacOS! :stuck_out_tongue:

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Virtualbox is GREAT! I just wish they’d hurry up with the “secret” Apple Silicon Host. I used to use it for everything. Now I just use Crossover on my MBP though as it runs my Windows-only PCB design software, and most of my Steam games for when I want to play something away from my PCs. Anyway, agree that Virtualbox is top-notch for small scale virtualization. Definitely recommended!

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They’re making it harder and harder to avoid a Live account even on Pro now. They keep patching out many of the classic methods. The splash screens on install don’t even have the option for a local account now. (as of the last install I did a few weeks ago) which then helped push me to Linux finally. :smiley:

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  1. Get Windows .iso from microsoft.com directly (use your mac to download it, or fake your user agent)

  2. There’s no need to create online ms account - use Rufus to create your bootable usb drive (use a decent fast one, not some random branded drive you got for free) https://rufus.ie

  3. https://privacy.sexy - all the options (you’ll probably have to re-install c++ libs after this step)
    https://aka.ms/vs/17/release/vc_redist.x64.exe

P.S. Don’t be afraid to mess it up - if you feel like you need to start from scratch, it’ll only take 15 minutes to re-install everything (this is where that fast usb drive would come in handy)

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Ouch … It appears i knew far less of the potential headaches than i might have anticipated

Having read a tiny bit since posting i had established that a local account might be the thing for me, but that now seems like it might be a bit trickier than the internet currently shows - by using a bogus account like no@thanks.com to trick it into letting you go local

One thing i can’t abide is the pestering, i am getting that from google daily for everything already - they have gemini, but can’t figure out that i have refused every free offer for all their services

Hmm, i still haven’t turned this thing on, i want to avoid these exact pitfalls … i’m not going to run Linux exclusively on it, i do have a few justifications for using windows and i can probably get used to it being less streamlined than chrome os, but i have zero interest in OneDrive (even if free) or cloud backups or 365 etc - i just want an OS, no encryption, ideally a lean system not ‘phoning home’ etc - certainly no macafee etc

talking myself out of this now, but it’s a nice laptop

so am i searching forlornly for the latest advice for creating a local admin account or has that boat simply sailed now ? - what would be the best plan B whilst retaining windows

I am disinclined to clear the machine and start from windows as i don’t have the time energy to fix anything bespoke about my machine like its audio or ways that asus have configured to throttle it to reduce temps, it is thin with one small fan and minimal venting

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Oh I wouldn’t worry too much. My post was definitely a bit ranty. :smiley:

The thing about Windows 11 that IS good, is that it tends to just work. I have never had a stability issue with it, it’s pretty fast generally, and for general use is still a viable option. It does work well.

The privacy stuff is what finally pushed me off of it. There’s only so much of that kind of invasive attitude that I can take. Kind of why I’m not on any social media. :smiley:

I don’t even do anything on my PCs that I feel like I’d need to hide from the public in general, I just don’t like the whole attitude that they seem to hold that if they push it slowly enough, and keep saying reassuring things that everyone will just let them do whatever they want, take whatever data they want, operate one’s computer the way they want, etc.

Honestly, you can turn most of this stuff off. My biggest issue is that it always gets re-enabled, sometimes when I’m not paying attention, and then I don’t know how long it’s all been back on before I disable it all again. I mean if MS REALLY wants to know that I recorded some audio, played a few games, and checked email, then whatever. It just all adds up to a bad taste for me though.

Anyway, if you want to install it, you shouldn’t let me talk you down. It will in fact do what you’re looking to do give or take a little, and it will do it well, and stably. I just recommend keeping an eye on it. Check your privacy and security settings once in a while. Etc.

I will say though, you might be pleasantly surprised by Linux Mint. Give it a whirl sometime, even if it’s just on a USB stick while you try it out.

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To get the best out of your machine, use anything else. It doesn’t matter what.

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I used WIndows for music for a long time. The biggest pitfall IMHO is following clueless online guides on how to optimize/debloat etc windows. A lot of that stuff is harmful and down the road leads to problems after which people complain about how the OS is shit. I ran insider preview builds for years without much issue.

There is good thread on Gearspace about Windows 11 and it’s frequented by a guy who’s on the Windows product team and also responsible for various audio-related subsystems. I would read up his posts.

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This no longer works unfortunately

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I wonder if you could install windows 10 via usb iso over top 11, set it up with a local account then upgrade to win 11. So much work to avoid a live account it’s infuriating!

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I use a fairly popular heavily modified Windows installer called Ghost Spectre that preempts a lot of bloat and spyware. I’ve found it to be as stable and functional as any official install. There’s not a lot of hand-holding. If you’re trying to do something that relies on a Windows service, you have to manually enable that service. Updates are disabled by default as they will likely add/restore bloat and spy crap. When you perform the install, you need to have your chipset, network, storage, etc. drivers ready to go. To get the latest security updates, they’re not going to nag you. You grab the latest full release, create bootable media, and then tackle it like an OS install.

For a Linux user, it’s much easier than I’m making it sound. You’re already a resourceful self-starter type and this doesn’t require a single command line in a console. 5 minutes and you’re probably off to the races. If you do run into problems, it will be harder to troubleshoot than on the beaten path, but you get a GUI with errors you can lookup and tools like a disc utility to reformat/etc. For non-Linux users thinking about installing Ghost Spectre on their primary music computer as opposed to a secondary or tertiary machine, I don’t want to recommend biting off more than you can chew and screwing up your creative output. You might be told to format a drive, not understanding it’s where all your session files are stored, and erase years of writing beyond recovery in an instant. Hence all the foreboding. And for that reason I won’t link to it. It’s easy to track down and there will be no doubt when you’ve found the official channels.

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Do you have a link by chance?

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Username of the guy I mentioned is Psychlist1972

Very long thread but a lot of useful info and a lot of myths debunked

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where can i google the latest posts on this - i see stuff from summer, so it must be more recent ? …

i am not against microsoft so much wrt snooping as opposed to nagging and slowing a machine down from being efficient

my one genuine concern is wrt getting my machine working as it should - would having a local account affect my ability to get the machine loaded with the right extensions for the device, or is that irrelevant - i am assuming the device is ‘patched’ for whatever asus wanted to add, so it’s not a vanilla windows

i am wondering if local/ms-account would (if it even worked) affect the ‘meat’ of the install or updates so that it’s working well - asus may well have s/w to add to a vanilla install but that’s not for me

another question might be how well can you cut back on the snooping and nagging if you have to go ms-account route ?

essentially, on a mac, if i have to wipe, i know i will get it working with ease - how would i return to the ideal state on a machine which has custom bits/s-w in it - or am i missing something obvious - if a drive was replaceable and i corrupted mine, how would i get to a factory state as far as the asus additions are concerned

i won’t be booting this thing up until about 12 hours from now, so i have time to read up on stuff, but if this local config is not possible any longer then i might as well look for a plan B

would that be to have a MS admin account, then just use a local additional account for my daily browsing or will that not work out as expected, i don’t mind running two accounts, one of each … but i don’t want my drive encrypted if ms do that with the online account

this is a can of worms - if i’d appreciated this i would have just picked up a cheap refurb pc for the few windows specific roles and got another chromebook although none would be as nice as this bottom of the range zenbook

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I don’t have a link but I explode windows 11 home laptops more than I’d like to admit for clients and summer was around the time they changed it.

Then there was a cmd line trick but they took the ability to use CMD at startup.

I still get 10 home for clients and all you have to do is not connect it to the internet for a local account.

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IMO a local admin account is always better. Provided you were able to create one, then you should be good going forward. There’s nothing you can’t do other than maybe use the Windows Store (not sure on that) without a Live ID as long as you were able to set up with a local account still.

A Live ID isn’t necessarily going to hurt you in any way. It can even be convenient in some cases. However, I don’t like the fact that they went from not requiring it to requiring it. I really think the plan is to eventually provide Windows as a service and make it as thin as possible, and have users run everything from Azure. I HATE this idea. But then we in this thread aren’t your typical mainstream users that just want to browse, write a doc, check and email, and watch a funny video.

For those users, having what amounts to a terminal, and doing everything online might work just fine.

I also still like to “own” my gear and software as much as is possible. I know in most cases you’re just licensed to use software these days, but the closer to owning ANY part of it the better for me. I refuse to use Adobe products for example. (worked there too at one point right when they started going this route, and I started hating them while I still worked there).

I’m kind of weird though because I also LOVE Steam, and having my PC game library all digital. I guess in that case the convenience outweighs the rest.

Anyway, back to Windows. I think you’ll be just fine no matter which way you decide to go.

I would disable everything that you find invasive. Presonally I wouldn’t go down the road of digging through endless registry keys and that sort of thing. It’s not generally worth it unless maybe you do security work or something like that.

Just lock it down as much as you can, and get on with using it.

Like you though, I like efficiency. I can’t see how Windows can be efficient if it’s constantly recording what’s on your screen, all your keystrokes, disk writes, registry changes, web traffic, etc. Recall seems like a REALLY bad idea. They market it as a way to rewind back if you need to, but having all that data stored there with MS having access to it and having all that writing to disk all the time, just seems like a horrible idea.

They should just split their ecosystem. Microsoft Online/Live. Windows running on a terminal, all software running remotely. And then on the other side, classic Windows with all advanced features available, the ability to disable things that aren’t needed for advanced users, etc. That would solve this.

Apple requires an Apple ID for a lot of things, but even though I know they’re just one step better with these types of things, they seem to do it with some panache, with the user in mind a bit more, and still allow one to do things in the terminal at an advanced level. I have a lot more good will in this case.

And now that I got back into Linux after a few years, they’ve made HUGE strides in usability, driver support, software support, making things seamless and easy. As someone else mentioned, I haven’t even had to drop to a shell once since I installed it. Granted it’s just my main game PC on the living room TV running Steam in Big Picture Mode, but it’s absolutely flawless.

Planning to Mint up my main desktop PC soon now that this went so smoothly.

I don’t know if I’m ready to try audio work in Linux again yet. The last time I did it I had to jump through tons of hoops, compile software, edit tons of config files, and granted it worked great after I did all that, but I think I’ll keep doing audio on my Macbook for now. :smiley: Maybe once I get Linux onto my other desktop I’ll try some audio things. For science! :slight_smile:

Oh, just looked, and Reaper runs on Linux. That’s a great step in the right direction. :slight_smile: I’ll have to see what kind of plugins are available. I’m guessing there’s no Linux binaries for Ozone… (well, they don’t call it out specifically, but if I can dump the VST3s onto the Linux machine from a Windows install, maybe it will work since it’s VST3. Worth a try. Now I want to try this sooner.

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Pipewire is dope. Add the audinux repository and the cheapest bitwig license and you’re good to go.

The days of compiling stuff are long gone.
Also, modern build systems are easy and convenient in case you do need to compile something :man_shrugging:

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