What upgrade from the Circuit Tracks?

The Lounge Other Gear
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Hi all! New to Elektronauts and also still fairly new to electronic music production.

I come from a background mostly in metal / hardcore, but have gotten the itch to really get back into electronic production (used to make beats) after seeing a few too many ambient and noise sets live.

I’ve been messing around with a Novation Circuit Tracks for a while now as an affordable entry point to hardware. I’m finding its limitations are really push me away from creating, and wanted to see what logical upgrade path exists. By limitations, I’m mostly meaning having only two-built in synth engines - I’m wanting to do more than the unit is capable of.

The Circuit Tracks seems incredible as a dedicated host for a larger setup, with a few additional synthesizers, effects and mixer - but I’m wanting something properly all in one and incredibly portable as my work requires I’m constantly traveling.

Moreover, I really wish the Circuit Tracks had a screen of some kind so I knew what I was actually doing as sometimes I find the pad presses and shift combinations to get a little tricky…

Sequencing wise, I’m looking for something that is pretty straight forward but with solid generative, randomness and/or probability functions - or all three. Euclidian sequencing seems pretty interesting as well the more I’ve read about it…

There’s obviously the Teenage Engineering OP-XY , but it costs a pretty penny.

The 1010 Music Bento seems really fascinating, but I keep reading very mixed signals about support and development. It seems it has finally reached a “good enough” state for most people, but that’s still far in excess of the capabilities of the Circuit Tracks as-is. Also has built-in recording / looping for stuff like guitar and self-sampling which is cool…

There’s the Synthstrom Deluge , but it seems quite a bit bigger and is still as screen-less as the Circuit Tracks.

The Polyend Play+ seems interesting, but only allows for three synth engines - an upgrade over the Circuit Tracks, of course, but still…

…or I could always just get something like an Oxi One MKII or Torso T-1 and commit to a DAW-based or even iPad-based workflow.

You’ll notice I didn’t include anything from Elektron - I’ll be honest, I’m not sure which unit would be what I’m looking for.

Any input or guidance would be greatly appreciated!

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I’m going to say Digitone 2 before anyone else does.

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Dirtywave M8

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Digitone 2 or Dirtywave m8

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Synths or samples? If both in one device, your options are limited.

What sequencer paradigm are you most comfortable with, step sequencing? DAW timeline style? Do you compose loops or songs?

These are important factors to consider. A supercar can go 300 on the straights but if you don’t know how to drive stick then it’s no better to you than a lounge chair.

Is Synthstrom Deluge inside your budget and OPXY is too much? In my experience if you think a device is the right device for you and only the cost is a barrier, sometimes you’re better off saving and waiting for a better deal on the something expensive that will make your life easier rather than filling your life with less capable devices.

If it’s a “never going to happen” situation with the OPXY, then identify what critical features it has that you want and see who else offers something similar to those features but likely, some compromises will have to be made.

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MPC One+.

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Ableton Move is like an upgraded Circuit Tracks but less live performance oriented.

Deluge OLED has a screen but can’t keep up with Circuit Tracks synth engine (my opinion)

Consider an OP-Z before an OP-XY commitment (some people like it better)

Or plug a metal fetishist into your circuit tracks

Blackbox would be better than Bento according to most

I’ll skip straight to the hurdle you will eventually reach: the device you want does not exist and will not exist.

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I just sold my DT2 for a Tracks. Use it with my Hermod to sequence 3 voices in my rack and the 4th midi track for a Deepmind 12d. With the 4 drum tracks, works great.

MPC IMO for what you want…maybe a used MPC Live 2.

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I “upgraded” to a Roland 707 and really regretted it.

The Circuit Tracks is awesome.

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Well dang if RDJ himself says MPC, then you gotta go MPC!

But seriously that’s a good choice. However, If you are ready to jump in the Elektron world. maybe get a OG Digitone for 4 synths voices and keep the Circuit Tracks for drum duties. I had that combo for a little bit once and it was fantastic

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both unfortunately - that’s the main reason I’ve sort of steered clear of a sample-only based platform. mostly because I’m ignorant to the capabilities of what can be done with only samples, and I’d really rather be hands on with knobs adjusting sounds in a way I’m at least more vaguely familiar with. evolving loops, step-sequenced in.

part of the problem it seems I’m facing is my genuine need for portability - I’d love the idea of sticking with the Circuit Tracks with 1/2 other synths tacked on, but I live out of a single checked bag + carry on for work now and other things have to take priority over physical space :slightly_frowning_face:

that’s why I gave the Circuit Tracks a shot in the first place - small, contained, lightweight - just did not expect to find it limiting so quickly.

there’s stuff like the Sonicware Liven series, but my limited time behind the Ambient and the Texture Lab were actually quite disappointing and I think they’re just not what I’m looking for.

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“I’ll skip straight to the hurdle you will eventually reach: the device you want does not exist and will not exist.”

having spent weeks already trying to figure out what the online groovebox consensus was before just deciding to outline my specific wants/needs, you’re unfortunately probably right

that’s why I’m not wholly opposed to something like the Oxi One or Torso T-1 - a way of getting that hardware feel and pattern generation that I find inspiring into a DAW-based workflow through Ableton or Logic - then the sounds, samples, track limits, etc wouldn’t be a concern, but it does mean committing to a wholly different approach.

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If portability is really important, then you can’t beat the Dirtywave M8. But you may want something additional that’s small for some polyphony (Roland S-1, Micromonsta 2, etc.).

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Unless you want a tracker, I think your most portable options are either going to have no screen or be very expensive. Especially for something with both synths and samples.

The original OP-1 has both synths and samples and can be obtained for less money, but from my experience unless you want a 4-track recorder composition experience it’s not a good fit. The battery on it is great though and it’s flexible (for me) as a midi controller. I like the synths and sampling, but it’s difficult to compose on.

You need to keep in mind that the main function of these devices is composition. Yes, they can make noise, but unless you’re able to turn your noise into music then you may as well just bang on a table with chopsticks (unless you’re sequencing externally and then I’m not sure focusing on grooveboxes is appropriate).

If you have never used a tracker, try one out. The M8 and the Tracker Mini are both highly portable and very capable but may be frustrating to compose on. They are not particularly “knobby”.

The MPC is a bit heavy but does everything you want and the price is right. The feeling is a bit sterile like taking a shower in a raincoat but you get used to it.

An Elektron machine is an idea generating powerhouse but they don’t offer much in the way of synths and samples in the same device so you’d need to make a distinct choice or carry 2 devices. Also as far as bringing things to completion it really relies on your ability to use the device efficiently.

Yamaha seqtrak is very portable and relatively capable but like the OPZ and the circuit series, suffers from a fairly rudimentary visual feedback system and some people find that limiting, others do not.

The sonicware liven series are good for the price but from what I’ve read the sequencer can be a bit limited, not necessarily in individual functions but in the bigger picture sense. Would be fine for idea generation but I think you’d run into limitations in the compiling and arranging stages of composition. They also make a hard line between synth and sampler.

Synthstrom deluge has a really dedicated following and is about as portable as an MPC. People highlight that it’s easy to compose with and very fun but that sound design is tiring so a lot of people end up buying sound packs and using those. Synthstrom deluge owners and users might contest this because they’re accustomed to the device but for someone who has limited experience with grooveboxes the experience may be taxing. Speaking of sound design, not the device’s working paradigm.

I would not purchase a bento unless the firmware is improved and everyone who jumped into it early has sort of given the same feedback. It seems like an interesting device and the size and form factor are great, but it also does not have a true synth engine.

Some other devices just don’t fit for you, honestly. Maybe you’re better off looking into midi controllers and use one with your laptop. It’s a hard sell to pack everything into one device and so for those of us looking for more consolidation and variety in a single unit, you just might have to look at specifically which things are deal breakers and make your decision based upon that rather than the perfect device.

If OPXY has everything you want, I would encourage you to stick with the circuit tracks until you can buy an OPXY at a good price as learning 100 different workflows does not necessarily improve one’s creative output.

Good luck

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To that point, there are a few free software trackers that you can try before buying hardware, and see if the workflow is good for you. I used Milkytracker back in the day, but there are other options out there.

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If you know it well already and gel with it, another Circuit Tracks? Get a short midi cable and a short dual ts cable, some foam to put between them and a rubber band and you can have them tied together when traveling :sweat_smile:

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I have had a bunch of different grooveboxes and at this time have op-xy, tonverk, digitone ii, syntakt, and a sonicware 12xt sampler. I have not used Deluge but it is probably the only one besides OP-XY and Tonverk I would really suggest if you care about generative sequencing tools. The MC-101 might be of interest if you can live without that, and the dirty wave m8 would be a great choice if you can click with its workflow. Bringing a Tonverk with a charge bank is also a viable option but definitely twice the size of an OP-XY.

Otherwise, the OP-XY is the only thing I’ve used that successfully combines extreme portability, generative sequencing and songwriting capabilities, and has usable versions of synthesis and sampling. As a sequencer it’s delightful, the keyboard gives you 2 octaves of somewhat velocity sensitive keys, it has multisampling and drum sampling, and it has a bunch of pretty decent synthesizers on board. I purchased it specifically as my travel instrument and it’s outstanding and I feel good about its value for money (but I got it at about 35% discount). It also makes a good MIDI keyboard in a pinch and there’s some basis to expect it to improve even more in the future like Tonverk and bento will.

The bento might get there when they release their sequencer overhaul (timeline unknown but it sounds like they’re still defining the requirements if you read their forum responses) but is very portable, nice sounding, and has a good mix of synthesis and sampling features. The downside is that true synth engines are limited (1 granular, 2 wavetable). I sold mine to get the OP-XY and have not particularly missed it, though I enjoyed its excellent pads and looper and feel that a sequencer upgrade will really take it to a good place.

MPC’s are just really big and don’t have great generative tools. Some people love their workflow and others don’t, which is probably the deciding factor since they can definitely do it all in terms of sound design and synthesis/sampling.

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Even if you don’t consider their excellent granular engine true synthesis (which is incorrect, there is also a selectable wave shape oscillator you can mix with the two samples), the wavetable synth engine can very easily be loaded with oscillators of your choice and behaves otherwise like a standard subtractive synth. The downside in bento is the sequencer and MIDI control capabilities and unfinished modulation sources/targets but the synthesis and sampling engines are solid.

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I can’t be certain but I’m working on the acceptance stage this year. I am obsessive and probably on the spectrum, so I have issue with trying to force the impossible through sheer force of will.

I still think you are in for a very rewarding and fun hobby here!

Considering your interest in the Torso T-1 (which I share), this video just came up on my feed. Looks like a lot of fun

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Ableton Move isn’t exactly what you’re after, but it meets a lot of your asks:

  • Portable
  • Screen (small but very functional)
  • Affordable
  • Supports synths and samples, plus it can record samples
  • The included synths and samples are very good
  • You can have as many as four synth tracks, plus you can resample into drum pads and play chromatically

Plus, you can export or cloud-sync directly to Ableton Live or Note — no need to stem out your projects when it comes time to finish them

It’s not currently good for generative or Euclidean stuff, unfortunately. There are some unused buttons in the current firmware, and Ableton has been building more generative and Euclidean capabilities into Live, so I’m optimistic in the long term. But that’s pure speculation.

There are also some deliberate limitations on how far you can go without exporting to Live or Note — they are very much “part of the workflow.” Move’s four-track limitation means you can start exploring ideas quickly, and there’s a lot you can do with automation and parameter locking, but it’s intended as a sketchpad and it’s hard to push it too far beyond that.

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