To Rytm or not to rytm

Elektron Gear Analog Rytm
#1

Hi guys,

I’ve been thinking about making this topic(and about the subject) for a few weeks now and I finally decided to get some advice.

I’m undecided, on one hand I’d like to sell my Rytm to get some other drummers(possibly euro rack) because I feel that I cant get the definition out of the rytm I’m looking for. Dialing in the rytm can be quite fast (and intuitive) but the sounds miss a certain definition, its quite clean and within the lines so to speak.I must admit I havent fully masterd it yet but i’m not sure it will be worth it, maybe I will feel the same about the sound after a few months? I believe that the initial sound should be perfect instead of trying to process it to your liking.

I work intuitive and fast and I’m considering getting some more immediate and and possible simpler machines. For example, If I sell the rytm I could get the DT and the nd2/tanzbar/eurorack next to that. That way I could sample my one shots, have the elektron sequencer and the sample capability but use engines from other sources.

Dont get me wrong I love the rytm but I think i mostly love the elektron way of doing things rather than the sound. But it’s probably just me not willing to put in the work, I just dont want to look for sweetspots for 5 minutes, i need to get a move(groove) on. I’ve read that the rytm really comes to life with the compressor, maybe thats my issue, I dont understand shit of that thing. besides that i multitrack via overbridge so it shouldn’t be the main issue.

Any tips, people on the same boat? What did/would you do?

Thanks:)

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#2

Hello @Alume ,

To get good advise and not “air advises”, especially on stuck state with one gear. What genre and kind of sounds would like to getup from your RYTM ? Do you want to use the RYTM mainly for Drums purpose ? Are you tried to achieve some drums with Synthesis only or Synthesis + Sample Layering method ? Can we hear some things you achieve, done yet with the RYTM ?

Next and because you speaking about some gear replacement :
I can tell you yet already that the Digitakt will not give you better drums (I mean personal ones) than the RYTM. You will have to select finest samples or design it elsewhere, process it and import in the DT. And this drums will have to be perfectly processed to get the most of the DT.
ND2 is very nice it’s based on layering concept so basically to get the most of it you really have to understand layering principle and sound design, to me the ND2 is perfect for membrane and exotic percussions, very well for hats and ride… not so much for clap. Good also for acoustic reproduction.
Tanzbar is a bit difficult to handle, sounds good (but also very limited in timbres you can get) but you will not have the possibility of the RYTM, easier for the synthesis (because less range of timbres and parameters) but more difficult to program and get that groovy parts… it’s also to me, not built like a tank (opposed to the RYTM) main master is noisy, pots are very closed to each other, it fill cheap but it’s a good drum machine if we compare to the others…

Eurorack modules : yeah you can get whatever you want with that thats just the bill at the end can be huge and high amount of money. Not sure it worth the price for drums only…

If you are after 808/909 actually the MIAMI and Detroit are very good OR good sample collection if you’re on a budget. But if you too much infected by 808 and 909 don’t run after something only the original or clone will gives you directly. I’m not very fond of with the new version of Roland… I prefer ACIDLAB clone.

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#3

Sounds to me, that you want either a good sample pack (for your Rytm, or maybe the Digitakt, if you don’t need the synthesis options) with sounds you instantly like, or another drum synth, where you like the preset sounds.

I don’t think Eurorack is a good idea for you. It certainly can be awesome and fun, but as @William_WiLD said, it’s very pricey to build a drummachine like rack. And I guess not as instant as you are looking for.

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#4

Sell your Rytm.

Use the acquired headspace to feel what you’re really after. It’s clearly not the Rytm. But you don’t have to sell and buy at the same time. The two aren’t related, though we’d like to think so.

So sell. Feel the void.

Then you’ll know.

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#5

Thanks for reminding me :smile:

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#6

Sell AR, I do with mine and I live happy, no tears.
Good gear, but I think as you that It has not the better sound you can ask to a modern machine.
And lot of limitations.
With ND2 you can create crazy sounds.
Synths, acustics, abstracts, crazy machine.
If DT will be a good gear (I’m waiting to see It on work) the couple DT-ND2 will rock.
Synthesis, sample, sequancer, all you need for a big range of music from classic house-techno to noisy ambient, glitch abstract and more.

#7

I’m pretty sure it will

#8

This! I think you and I have basically agreed on this line of thinking about half a dozen times but genuinely do agree.

I’m struggling for time and my Rytm was just sitting there gathering dust so sold it the other night. It’s a fantastic instrument but in truth I thought the analogue side was a little dull (happy to accept user error on this!) but I did like playing samples through it. Point is, I feel quite good about selling it. I do have a bit of space and I’ll give things a think. I’m actually tempted to revisit my Maschine days in the hope I recapture the magic that got me right back into music some years back. A Jam to go with my MK1 sounds like a nice way to splash the cash.

Not sure eurorack is the answer. Is something like Maschine completely out of the question? Or how about DT and a Drumbrute? That’s actually a pretty tasty sounding combo… So too does DT and ND2! I hate this place sometimes - really doesn’t do my GAS any good.

#9

I owned a Machine for some time. If you don’t have a problem being dependent on a computer, it’s an awesome groovebox in my opinion, with great quality samples included, as well as a good sounding drum synth. Sometimes I miss it for getting instant results.

#10

I’m moving soon. My Rytm is boxed up at the moment. Trying to decide if I want to sell. All I have on the desk is a TR-8 right now. Instant fun, instant sweet spot. All it has is sweet spot actually. I’ve learned I need multiple instruments for different moods, energy levels, purposes, etc.

Tired, not much time, just want to jam - TR-8. Simple, no menus, all sweet spot.

Energetic, Saturday, want to delve into sound design - Rytm. Powerful, endless options.

Layered together on a track they can be nice. Different textures.

Something to be said for that though. Even though the Rytm is very deep and you can dial in individual sounds to whatever style drums you want, I always seem to find the overall sound kind of muffled or behind gauze. You could say it’s operator error, sure. But I also feel this way when I listen to demos or other people’s songs. Not to say it sounds bad at all, just perhaps not my favorite. And therefore, I wonder why I’m hanging on to it ($$$) when I tend to like the sounds of other drum synths and samplers better, even much cheaper ones like TR-8 and Volca Sample. Probably because it’s fun to program the Rytm when in that kind of introspective rainy Saturday “sound design” mood.

On the other hand, if playing live, or wanting a DAW-less setup, well then, Rytm is very hard to beat.

Decisions, decisions…

What about a Digitakt and PO-32/Microtonic combo? That sounds great to me. Very portable and small footprint.

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#11

[quote=“Alume, post:1, topic:37882, full:true”] I believe that the initial sound should be perfect instead of trying to process it to your liking.
[/quote]

Understand you very well and that’s why I have a less-deep machine too.

But there is a second side to this coin. From my experience I can tell that good initial sound is combined with significantly less flexibility often. Maybe a bad example, but get a Mini-Moog to produce an aggressive harsh industrial tone or try to convince a MiniBrute to whisper a creemy soft flute-like sound … without the help of FX of course :wink:

#12

I extend my precedent reply. To me there’s nothing on the market to beat the RYTM (I mean something new with warranty) of course there’s plenty of second hand machine drums to get. Maybe the new Jomox Alpha when available will get close to something nice too.

the sounds miss a certain definition : [ you ] shape the definition !
I must admit I havent fully masterd it : … :joy:
Dont get me wrong I love the rytm : we don’t care about emotional aspect, you need to be satisfied about the sound you can get with it… Love/Hate is not the point.
I’ve read that the rytm really comes to life with the compressor : Not true I don’t now how to demystified compressor but a lot of people seem to think that’s where the magic happens but it’s not. You will have to shape your drums according to your taste first. The compressor will only tame or enhance transients and/or glue sounds together better… but that’s just a final touch / a final makeup… like a cherry on a cake. But if at first your things is not in place … actually the compressor can enhance the bad sounding and result of something worst at the end.

To use the compressor you have two options :

  • You need to use the onboard compressor to extend your sound design on some voice ; ok but you need to route all the other things on separate outs and process it externally if required. There’s no rules of this use it can be drastic to suit your taste, it can be to fixing problems on release, it can be over-compressed a kick or a snare… it can be to shape transients to be reveal better through your mix…

  • You use the Master compressor as a Bus compressor which is the most logical use of the onboard compressor so you need to watch tutorial on Drum Bus compression. in this case the compressor settings is subtle … it’s just there to polish your sound and get that general dynamic in regards of the other machines or melodically content in the DAW itself… (that’s easy isn’t it ?)

There’s a lot of people who don’t use compressor at all. They want their sound RAW and Full of frequency…
If they mixing well generally speaking and use other tool (transients shaper, volume curve shaper) who done the same job as the compressor without the frequency loss especially in the bass frequencies. And then the magic happens because your arrangements are super nice and the sound engineer on the mastering stage make a very great job.

A lot of people use the compressor as a gain utility which is the worst side effect on how to use a compressor. My advise if it’s the case is put your headphones in the trash, switch on your monitoring, find THE sweet spot in your place I mean THE good place or the BETTER place to work and get a good sounding spot to work… and stop to make mash potatoes with sound
A good sounding is Headroom + a lot of fine touch-layers and subtle processing additionally on top of each other who results in : a good mix.

Force yourself to work on mixing eq-ing at low or medium level (the morning is the best moment for that) You can put things higher in level to feel better but always come back to a low or medium level to going further.

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#14

I tend to think you should go with your feelings, sell the rytm. But in case you hold on to it for awhile, I’ll say that I don’t like the sound of the default kit so much, but it pretty easily turns into something better, and can be coaxed into sounding great to my ears. I also would suggest to not use the compressor for a bit just to hear the original source sounds, if not set right it might make it sound not as good…

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#15

Eurorack is literally the exact opposite of this. Going modular for drums is also super expensive.

The Rytm absolutely comes to life with the compressor, so +1 to that. I was initially intimidated by the compressor, but after spending a couple hours dedicated to experimenting with different settings (and continually resetting them back to default) and taking careful notice of what i was doing vs. what i was hearing… i can now quickly dial in what i want there.

Also, have you ever played a machinedrum? Might be worth checking out… definitely the most immediate of the Elektron machines and the sound definitely gives lots of “definition”

btw, the Tanzbar and Tanzmaus are both excellent machines :thumbsup:

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#16

Hey man,

Thanks for taking the time to reply. You’re right I meant to add some sound aspirations etc (https://soundcloud.com/alume-music) I’m into deep ambient kind of music with a touch of techno(or whatever kind of beats). I guess you could say my main genre is techno yeah. I love organic sounds, lush hand percussions and that kind of stuff. More of an ethnic sound i guess. hence my interest in the nd2.

(good point on the tanzbar, there are enough alternatives indeed)

I’m aware the DT wont give me any kind of drums but it will give me easy intuitive sequencing. I’m intrigued by the idea of having a blank machine that I can fill up with my own tailored samples.

As for my rack I’ve got an MI peaks which has some awesome deep kicks in it (together with some hats/snares). The kick has way more depth that i could ever achieve with the rytm(deep 808 stylish)

Its just that I might have the less is more syndrome when is comes to the rytm, as for claps I’m not to impressed by it(rytm) i can get way more interesting claps out of the md.

I’m a drumfreak and i dont see the rytm do some real characterfull stuff for me atm. I bought it for good deep solid analog(sounding boomers) until now I’m only impressed with the toms tbh. The claves dont spark, the hats, wel we know the hats. the kicks are decent but sound to same as i use the filter peak trick to much and only like a certain specific cuttoff setting. Its cool for basses and stuff and ive got some really weird stuff out of it but it misses some soul? I dont know, it feels like work instead of intuitive music making, improvising and that kind of stuff. I know that will grow the more i use it but if the default sounds are meh its kind of a buzz kill.

(sorry for my rambling, im at work and if i try to structure my thoughts and this text it will take to long haha)

#17

I’m into eurorack already and i dont like buying presets. Tried the 808 pack and it was basically an 808 pack hahaha.

Thanks for the heads up though.

#18

Sold my RYTM and replaced it with a ND2
No regrets and heaps of money in the old sky rocket. Win win

#19

Yeah good point on the eurorack, I’m aware of that.I think it was just on other option to mention as I have a small setup going that’s really gels with my workflow.

#20

Ok, didn’t know that. If you’re already into it, it’s another story.
Do you have a sequencer? How about a great sequencer (as there are so many in euro) and some modules you’re really fond of the sound. Of course it’s pricey, but you could build an awesome drum machine with modules for sure.
As for presets, I don’t like them too much either, but as you were talking about things should sound good instantly, I thought you don’t want to spend much time on desingning sounds yourself.

#21

hey man thanks for the reply, maybe i wasn’t clear. I think because the music thing is so saturated with kids that want quick and easy tracks with help of presets and stuff we sometimes tend to forget that quick and easy doenst always have to pair up with lazy and presety.

When i work I can work though maybe 10 ideas in 10 minutes, it all surfaces and gets deleted if its not good enough. I think thats how i can achieve a strong sense of place and time in my music. or something like that haha

Yeah i’ve got a MD that i can trigger my modules with. The idea behind the modules though is to get a modular use it, sample it while using it and replace it when i’m done with it.

/think the rytm should go yeah, I’m still a student and maybe i just cant justify a 1k+ machine on my desk that i give to muhc thought and to little time. In time, I’d rather have 2-3 dedicated machines which I know when and where to use.

Its funny because all those options dont seem to bother me on the md. Maybe becasue i know what kind of sounds the md makes and i still have no idea what the rytm is actually good at.