Theorie : Modes / Scales

The Lounge General Discussion
#22

Yes it’s what I mean. I just read one time about tonal / modal and what our thread neighboor said about tonal and/vs chromatic but do not know many things about and yes this is a notion I do not have.
I try to be really mechanic and maybe here is the moment to change my point of view :slight_smile:

The fact is that I’m progressing with some Elektron devices, which have KEYs/root selection capabilities… It has advantages but maybe inconvenient to use them. So I’ve to know where I want to go :slight_smile: Thank you very much for the link :sweat_smile:

Edit I don’t understand so much but I’ve to take some time on this… Makes my practice english :sweat_smile:

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#23

When you say

Functional Harmony does not take modes into account,

You are saying, the root key stuff are not important If I want to use modal harmony ?

#24

Here’s a jazz standard whose chord progression was written in Phrygian Dominant modal harmony - very different harmonic flavor than functional harmony (harmony in the key of some major or minor scale):

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#25

If you really want your music to have an E Phrygian sound, the root should be E, not C, and you should make sure to emphasize the b2, b3, b6 and b7 notes as much as possible as well as the root. Thus use these notes the most:

E - root
F - b2
G - b3
C - b6
D - b7

Oh and use the E7sus4(b9) chord a lot. sus4(b9) is a well-loved chord for Phrygian modal music.

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#27

Oh and use the E7sus4(b9) chord a lot. sus4(b9) is a well-loved chord for Phrygian modal music.

Allright I’ll try :joy: :slight_smile: (I hear some really nice chords at the end of this song)

So for example… In the really nice “Nardis byBill Evans Trio”… We have different Phrygian from different “Phrygian roots” ?

#28

technically, scale is a collection of notes, but modes are derived from scale.
if we start from the scale root, we derive itself, and it’s the 1st mode.
if we start from the 2nd degree of the same scale, we get another intervals pattern, and this will be the 2nd mode of the scale.
etc etc.

this works not only for diatonic scales. for instance, phrygian dominant is the 5th mode of harmonic minor, hungarian minor is the 4th mode of double harmonic major, etc.

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#29

Yes Sir !
Personnally I see this a bit like this yes …

Because you are on the fact maybe you have great ressources on internet ? Boards/website to share me :slight_smile:
Maybe, not lol, anyway I have to take a look on those other modes.

#30

i don’t know where are you from, but what will work for you the best are educational resources in your native language.

but since we all speak english anyway, one of my favorite youtube channel is this one:

helped me a lot to learn music theory.

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#31

Yeah I agree, he’s a great teacher. I have his "Modes of Major" poster up on the wall of my studio. It’s really handy if you want to experiment with different modes, and stops me from being so lazy and just sticking to scales and keys that I know already.

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#32

I don’t know if this is of any interest to anyone but I translated some modes to mod12 for a Quizlet set (0 being tonic) I can’t seem to easily put it into text so here ya go:

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I find this a much easier means to explore.

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#33

Assuming you are talking about the modern Western modes, that is one way to derive modes from a “parent scale”.

The other is to alter the degrees of the parent scale - see earlier posts on Phrygian vs. Major Scale. This is usually what guitarists learn next - well the 10% that progress from the 1st approach (start on different scale degree, get different mode). Being well versed in this 2nd approach is necessary to understand harmony from a modal perspective.

#34

I would recommend avoiding lessons on modes taught by guitarists. Few guitarists ever learn theory beyond what they can see on the fretboard. There is a tendency to mix modes with functional harmony - which doesn’t buy you anything and just confuses anyone trying to learn.
Those very few that are well-versed in theory tend to have some background working with piano. I play guitar, so that’s the source of my bias. :sweat_smile: If the teacher is a pianist, you have a better chance of learning something useful.

Rick Beato’s Youtube channel is one of the few exceptions - although I have no opinion on whether his book (not cheap!) is worth buying. His other instrument is keyboard and does a fair amount of teaching off of that instead of the guitar.

A good lesson on tonal (functional) harmony vs. modal harmony.

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#35

:+1::+1::+1:
The Jazz Piano Site dude is a national treasure

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#37

I’m discovering it… Yes it’s really really good… Thank you guys !