theDAW - Sir, a second AI DAW has hit the floor

It´s sort of a DAW with integrated generative features, but it´s also a two deck DJ thing and whatnot.

Highlighting the generative features here:

I think @waftlord was right on the money…

How will software like that change the landscape? Seems like they could have quite the impact, drawing in especially people who want to make something quick without actually making something. Or maybe it´ll be just a side note in music history and most people won´t even remember such a thing ever existed…

Edit; So obviously there´s a difference between a DAW with generative AI features and a DAW that was built with the help of LLMs/coding agents.
And while I don´t know if “theDAW” was built with LLMs/coding agents, seems very likely to me.
So there´s two different topics to discuss here…if anyone even has the nerve for that type of convo that is…

Part of the reason I use Ableton is that every time Apple force some next fucking OS on me, I can be reasonably confident that Ableton will still work.

I am confident using Ableton because of their 20 years of work and experience supporting their software through 12 major iterations.

I am confident because Ableton projects I have created today will still be usable in the future and most of the instruments and effects I am using won’t just stop working one day.

All these vibes coded DAWs coming over the horizon can’t promise any of that and until any of them can prove any sort of long term reliability (which we all know they can’t) then they are nothing more than a novelty.

We live in a world now where anyone can pretty much make anything.

But vibing something like this into existence should be the start of the journey, but for most of these guys it’ll be the end of their interest in it.

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So true.
I only do things that I understand (mainly in Max MSP) because whenever it stops working, there’s a good chance I can fix it.
For instance I just upgraded my Mac OS, and it turns out that the buttons on my USB Joystick have been renumbered (once again) so my joystick controller patch doesn’t work anymore. Happily, I made the damn thing so I know of to fix it. Just an example.

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Happy to stick with engineered stability over a wish list from people Ive never heard of

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This is the crux of it for me. I won’t get into the artistic, ethical and environmental impacts here because that’s a huge topic of its own.

I’ve used AI tools for projects in the past with mixed results. I’m not trying to be some arbiter or gate keeper of the “Right way” to do things but in my experience it’s best used at the very beginning stage of something to get jumping off points into subjects I might have less knowledge on. A fancy interactive version of JGL (just google it.)

Then I have a good list of subjects to read real technical documentation on, and search for first hand sources I trust. That last step is being lost from what I’ve seen.

I work in an RnD engineering field and being able to quickly spin up some stupid file management powershell script has genuinely saved time and effort towards very specific needs. I’ve learned enough about powershell and python to know how to steer it towards what I want and it’s faster than me having to remember the syntax and specifics each time as someone who doesn’t need to interface with code often. I know enough to skim the structure and make sure it’s doing what I want for these simple applications.

I don’t want to make this a generational thing but I’ve seen a few younger coworkers who are actual software engineers go to AI as the first step to solving a complex problem before they even understand it

Without going into specifics, I interface with a very specific and bespoke piece of industrial testing equipment. It was having some issues and I’m generally a good trouble shooter from my years of breaking shit on my own.

Software is not my wheelhouse or responsibility but I was there with a pen and pad, writing down the architecture of the setup as I learned about it and poked at the edges. Narrowing down the problem to one specific region of software and even getting it to a point I could reproduce the issue reliably, which nobody had attempted before I got there.

That software guy I mentioned said “he talked to chat about it and it said his code is fine, so the problem must be mechanical.”

He hadn’t even attempted to understand the structure of the process as a whole before brining his small snippet of code to AI for a pat on the back. The problem was of course something in software that I ultimately guided him towards with real poking and prodding the conditions of the system in meat space.

I lost a lot of faith in the future that day.

Those guys were always around but I feel like there was a stronger filter when you had to at least partially know how to walk the walk.

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looking forward/shit pantingly terrified to see where we end up.

why would be buy software any more when with our LLM subscription we can have a verbal interaction with a computer, requesting creation of something entirely usable and specific for that given moment. “make the kick thumpier” “rewrite my RYTM firmware to have a control all function”. :frowning:

a 2008 Ableton project convertor into that system will be no sweat, if you have all the original data/media on hand. “make it less shit.” :frowning:

most humans are time and cash poor.

a friend of friends teenage son has an AI girlfriend.

action-jaxon-fire

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I was previously thinking hardware must be such a tough business compared to software, with all the extra headaches it can potentially bring. manufacturing, overheads, returns etc etc. now I’m thinking software companies might be screwed too.

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Indeed. Except it seems to me that humans are shit at time management, easily distracted, easily overwhelmed, make excuses for themselves, and spend frivolously on wants instead of needs when the cost of living should dictate otherwise, then complain about being poor when they can’t afford what they need.

Ai? We are well on our way to being the humans in Wall-E:

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I´m still waiting for the handmade revolution, people en masse rejecting AI generated stuff. At least from what I see online, there are a lot of people who genuinely dislike anything AI for all kinds of reasons. I mean, there are so many…environmental factors, how companies are constantly pushing AI into every nook and cranny, ram prices, ethical and medical concerns, we´re surrounded by slop etc.
There are studies being done and the effect on the brain seems terrifying. So I´m basically counting on overall fatique across the whole spectrum to just do its thing.
Maybe we just have to wait for the bubble to burst…
Ok, I know I´m an optimist and usually when it comes to societal issues, I´m wayyy to optimistic and things usually turn out not like I thought they would, but so many companies are losing money (I know, some are generating billions in revenue), so doesn´t seem impossible for the bubble to burst.

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Homer’s DAW. Got it. :wink:

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Sorry OP.
Mods can we get an AI sub category, so it’s easier to just mute all AI related threads entirely?

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probably not ..

that’s the rest of the internet ! … but maybe there could be a single mega topic for AI created software “SLOP SHOP” … anyone needing to make sense of it could parse it with AI … it would ideally operate flag free

In all seriousness, it’s a tiresome headache to process the fallout of all these topics springing up every five minutes

They all get multiple repeated flags … the unavoidable comparison to politics is growing daily; it might be important but it simply cannot be hosted here because a moderate discussion is clearly already impossible


What might work would be a single topic where AI ‘wares’ can be linked, but any replies to those posts would be discouraged/removed - it would serve just as a signpost to potential tools and this would remove the inevitable copypasta discourse and flags

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I do not envy you mods! AI makes folks lose it, quickly!

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Where did you find my diary?

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I’m not sure giving Ai threads a subcategory (safe space) is the best move anyway. Let them post amongst us old fashioned types. That way we can always remind them they’re not much different to folks hanging out on gaming forums bragging that they conquered a game so easily when all they really did was use cheat codes.

Obviously, there are some folks who use Ai that don’t brag like that, but they really seem to be few and far between, in my experience.

I’m sure that will happen at some point, just like Behringer threads. It just gets old arguing about it. But I’ll still check in to Ai threads periodically to observe the alternative universes that people live in because it’s comedy gold.

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Nope. :-1:

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The reason I started to engage with AI topics is mostly, because I thought that negative voices should be more visible. People thinking about investing in AI, implementing it or using it to build software will hopefully run into threads like this one where they do not find a single postive view about it.
If we ignore it, our voices will basically be lost in the void.
Not sure if that’s a sound strategy…but I’m pretty sure that beutral voices will probably be counted in the ‘potentially interested’ bin.

Maybe shouldn’t have posted this on Elektronauts…I’ve only read one AI thread here and didn’t really know that it’s such an issue. I figured the people who don’t want to hear anything about AI would just not read the thread.

Lol, I was trying to figure out what the greek poet had to do with it. :joy:

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It will be brief and eventually become a niche and forgotten as the newer generations come who never knew any better. A kitschy farmers market curiosity or fringe subculture interest but I don’t see it being substantial enough to matter.

It would be kind of like “minimal / no waste” lifestyle is currently. No offense if anyone subscribes to these traits. I’ve been part of some adjacent groups but it ends up being a lot of people feeling really good about themselves for turning their paper towel rolls into cable holders while being completely ignorant to the larger systemic issues at play. Through no fault of their own, I’m not trying to assign fault to any individual.

I don’t like it any more than any of us but the future just won’t care. I’m also into photography and I’ve seen people just totally cool with generatively changing the sky if the conditions weren’t right.

Having a photo be an objective slice of reality is a value I hold dear (and I’d also argue it’s the definition of a photo but I digress.) But I can take a step back and accept that my perspective has been shaped by the time I was born into and the experiences I’ve had. These were never universal and I’m going the way of the dinosaurs in the grand scheme.

The companies really want to force this crap on us and that machine is more finely tuned and all encompassing than ever. We can and should speak up and continue voicing our dissent. I’m not saying otherwise.

Aside from the artistic implications, the biggest issue I have with the direction of all this is what I see as a move to gate knowledge behind a pay wall. Why take the time to learn anything? Think about a future where knowledge, education and the foundational spirit of reaching for greater things is filtered down and spoon fest to us by SoAndSo Corp, with filters to give us only what we need and not much more for 29.99 a month, provided your social tokens indicate you’re a well adjusted and agreeable citizen.

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Right! We get it, you don’t like it! That’s cool! Maybe keep it for another forum. I’d much rather enjoy life than be mad at the world!

Edit: And this is coming from a Browns fan!

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