Struggling with Syntakt

Elektron Gear Syntakt
#21

I’ve found that while pattern chaining does work for me when im using the digis, I was surprised at how much the song mode on my Tracker changed my creative perspective when fleshing out a tune. I’ve found it difficult to make varied B sections of a tune on the digi boxes but it came very easy to me when working in the Trackers song mode. I think its the way that everything is laid out and can be seen all together, it helps me realize what could be next rather than being stuck in a loop.

I’ll also add that I am not someone who enjoys arranging and tweaking something in Ableton (for better or for worse) so its nice to keep everything in the box so to speak.

3 Likes
#22

No worries, and given I no longer own a Syntakt the original question is now irrelevant!

The point is for me is I either want to use Bitwig because it’s super powerful and flexible, or a groovebox because it’s extremely focussed and productive.

I don’t want to sit with a groovebox and a PC because it seems like the worst of all worlds.
If I’m making the track on my Polyend Tracker I want the song to be represented in the Tracker without having to make paper notes about turning a knob, or hitting a mute button otherwise the arrangement isn’t programmed it’s just manual.

When I did the track for the Hiphop challenge competition it was done 100% in the Tracker and then bounced down with nothing but a mastering Compressor before I submitted it. I couldn’t have done that with the Syntakt.

On the flipside I’d be happy to work on a very simple drum loop, or synth arpeggio and then take it into the box, but I think it would be more like an hour messing about with the synth or drum machine for inspiration and then into Bitwig for the rest.

#23

I (and I imagine most folks) generally tweak a couple patterns on digi boxes to ‘perform’ a song, but I keep forgetting to try to program/automate/an entire composition in a digi sequencer like in this:

#24

I’ve never understood song mode. Why take away the dynamic aspect of the instrument? Doing this stuff live is what makes it special.

#25

You still can… you just are tweaking stuff over a more complex and longer arrangement. Song mode doesn’t take that aspect away.

3 Likes
#26

I use song mode so I can tweak parameters live while recording it all in. Makes it a lot smoother for me. Or I can just cue up patterns, either way I get the live feel which is what I like.

Also making house on an Elektron box is what its all about for me. I treat the Rytm like an MPC and write most of the tune on it and the Octatrack. Lethal combo for house music or really any electronic genre.

2 Likes
#27

I think it’s cool that you’re an Elektronaut without an Elektron box. It would be boring if everyone had the same taste and same experiences

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#28

That’s what I’ve come to realise, but that’s not what I want to do which is why I’ve come to realise Elektron boxes aren’t for me.

1 Like
#29

Song mode is part of it. If you dial in the arrangement how you want it, song mode frees you up to do more interesting stuff, like tweak sounds.

More than song mode is the kit structure and performance tools of the big boxes. Kits mean your tweaked sounds persist across patterns, so a change in Pattern 1 doesn’t reset when you move to Pattern 2. That’s the biggest advantage IMHO

6 Likes
#30

Circuits are just wayyyyyyyyy more user friendly and faster to use than Elektrons, period. That doesnt mean Elektrons aren’t cool, i kept my Syntakt, and a Digitakt is on the way. I went right into the Elektron trap!

5 Likes
#31

I’ve found the Syntakt to quickly become almost the centerpiece of my writing rig. It’s got enough stuff to write full songs, or just get out ideas that I can then bring into the studio and flesh out with other stuff.

My method of working is to start on pattern 1 of a bank and use all 12 tracks to write parts that all fit together. Then I copy and paste that across a few more patterns and mute/unmute certain parts, tweak things, slowly build transitions, and basically go from there. I’ve found it to be insanely quick.

The big thing is to get your head around HOW Elektron boxes work. It’s gonna take some time, but once you get it down, it’s so quick.

5 Likes
#32

Ohhhh, nice! Can’t wait to hear what you make with it!

2 Likes
#33

Precisely. When I’m doing drums on my MPC, I’ll put the finalized arrangement in song mode and then live-perform the XYFX as it records into the DAW. This frees up so much mental energy and keeps me from having to interrupt myself every 8-32 bars to change patterns and I can just stay in the flow.

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#34

It would be neat to be able to hit record and have Overbridge record all the automation and mutes etc. into your DAW as plugin automation data then you could go back and tweak it. That’s kind of my dream workflow for techno, primarily live jam but with the option to go back and tweak stuff without starting from scratch (although I do find repeating the same take a few times often results in better arrangement ideas, so there’s a balance).

In practice, when I tried this, the problem is that the start state of the pattern isn’t captured in the DAW, so if you jump around the timeline you get unpredictable results. You can maybe make it work by doing a “func-no” before each time you play the DAW, but what a hassle. Would be cool if they could figure out a way to make this work more smoothly!

2 Likes
#35

I agree, this would be a cool feature. With OB it should be possible for the VST plugin to listen and capture the mutes (at the very least).

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#36

Some people do things differently in a live setting. I used to think pretty much what I’ve quoted from you and was fairly vocal about it. I think it was @Meriphew came along and straightened me out. For a person who performs live with a guitar or bass or any more ‘traditional’ instrument which requires near constant supervision/input to be making music, song mode is indeed incredibly important. I do not do anything like that and continue to not care at all about song mode but I definitely get why others do.

6 Likes
#37

I agree with you, however, song mode is a way to program your performance, which is just as fun for many people :grin:

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#38

I thought on the Syntakt that you’d be able to record your tweaks across all the patterns in a chain, but unfortunately you get the initial parameter jump when it switches patterns. If they could make this work smoothly then creating songs in the Syntakt would be much easier.

#39

You probably can, but each Pattern has its own pseudo-Kit so there’ll always be a continuity jump. The Sounds used by each Pattern are copies of whatever original source sound they used. Even if you use a preset from the +Drive in multiple Patterns, you can make changes to each copy independently, and without altering the one in the +Drive.

When you record sound tweaks across multiple Patterns, you’re laying down p-locks. They’d be the same p-locks even if you changed the Sound assigned to that Track.

#40

Little update on this thread as it still seems to be running.

I was initially unsure if I made the right decision without really giving it a chance, but having switched it for an MC-707 I’m really delighted that I did.

I’ve clicked with it in a way that I didn’t with the Syntakt. it feels like fun rather than work.

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