Tonverk is a good indication of where they’re going, and where they’re going is nowhere new. I count 5 new keycaps on the Tonverk, that’s 5 more investments into the same way they’ve been making these. We can say the same for the DNII/DTII with their new symbols, but those will become the outgoing generation now. Elektron’s next instruments will be in the TV enclosure and we know they’re not going to want a different recipe across that new line up. Fly trap keycaps are here to stay, it appears.
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Beware the following doesnt actually help to get rid of sticky stuff but a recap as former employer (design) in one of worlds largest automotive industries, I can tell a bit about the very same problem but worse. Maybe amusing to read for ya all. So whats going on…
When silicone-modified elastomers come in touch with other materials they become contaminated surfaces which can’t be properly coated with any type of paint, not even after heat apply, not even after grinding, also not after re-ground-coating. Means removing it generates massive costs, products touched become 100% cost failures, therfor in automotive industry any silicone-modified elastomers contained material is banned from coming even close to car manufacturing.
Any automotive supply contractor signs consent to be aware that if such material makes it into their products or even just into manufacturing lines and tools they are responsible for damages in full, including removing and replacing contaminated gear. Which is why you will certainly not find such coatings on cars, it would also not make sense because cars are exposed to UV-light and heat or cold all the time, the surfaces would become brittle, melt and fall apart in short time.
The sticky effect goes so far that even private clothing from employees which almost without exception has stiches soacked in silicon for smooth sewing is banned too. Just touching a car surface with private clothing can be enough to contaminate it. This is why you see large manufacturers paying horendous sums to produce branded employee clothing (livré), just to make sure this stuff is kept far from product lines. If you ever find your way into such manufacturing you will find testing lab equipment on all entries to prevent silicon-elastomers from making it in. It is a known issue at least since 1992…1995, the time chemical compounds of car coating had to be reinvented for longevity and to limit environmental damages the older coatings could cause.
Doesnt help the knob issue, actually surprising this must have been known to the elektronic industry, in particular its designers, as this is a clear design choice. By the way the chemical compounds are still not banned in industry, and there are also no plans to ban silicon-elastomers on coatings. Just the REACH/RoHS standards was tightened a bit but that is just a self regulation. Lacking suing costumers and compared to automotive tiny sums we’d talk about it is unlikely to change much.
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I have to pay 68 euros (including shipping) for some pieces of plastic. Are you out of your minds?
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Can you post the invoice?
Yeah, it’s a lot of money, but as experience shows, most of it is for shipping and customs duties, which Elektron can’t change. So we shouldn’t give the impression that Elektron is to blame.
It’s up for debate whether €1 per knob is acceptable, though, because none of us know the manufacturing costs. It’s a mass-produced item, but it’s only made for Elektron, so it’s not really an AliExpress mass-produced item.
At first glance, a flat price of €1 per piece seems okay, especially since 25% of that is VAT.
I’m not sure what the Swedes do with it, but it definitely goes back into society (health, childcare, infrastructure).
Let’s talk about shipping. It would definitely be a bit cheaper from Central Europe/Asia.
But have you ever thought about where Elektron is located? It’s always miles away from anywhere, through forests, over the air, and across water, before the goods reach a place where a lot of people live.
At the end of the day, you’re the one forking out. Sounds logical, doesn’t it?
Addendum:
Yes, that’s a lot of money for a few plastic parts, and unfortunately the price is okay for now.
We should place collective orders, or Elektron should find a large reseller if it’s profitable for them.
It is simply not acceptable. Why? Because all units ever produced will eventually be plagued. And this amount of money, wherever it comes from is just a slap in the face of users. There should be a universal, cheap solution, it has nothing to do with the forests of Sweden.
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Do you want Elektron to just give you the new buttons for free and pay the shipping costs?
They could do that. But I don’t think they can print money, so they have to recoup the costs somehow: lay off employees, close the cafeteria, raise product prices, reduce development…
Just rub off the layer of decomposed rubber on your old buttons and repaint them. Or get 3D-printed ones. They’re great quality too.
…~75 cents per button isn’t really that much money, is it?
They have passed the cost of their bad choices to the end users. They do not even cut the shipping cost for a package that is lighter than a feather. Sorry but I cannot call this a reliable “user care”. That is my personal opinion and I will not try to convince anyone to follow it. At the end I will try to clean the unit myself and life goes on. For those looking for a used unit… be prepared.
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Sounds like Elektron is on the North Pole 
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1€ for a knob that’s not mass produced and used by several manufacturers isn’t expensive.
For example, the knobs that Mutable Instruments used for their desktop synths and modules cost 0.95€ to 2.45€ (*), depending on which size you buy.
A Shruthi XT for example needs 28 knobs (1.88€ per knob) , that would be 52€ just for those lovely rubbery stumps.
*Price is from Thonk, but they are expensive no matter where you buy them.
Edit, the knobs aren’t made specifically for Mutable Instruments gear. Make Noise also uses them and there are probably other’s. The company also has other ones, not just the black and white ones used on MI and Make Noise stuff.
Good quality knobs aren’t cheap.
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Sorry to say so, but I have the feeling you’re looking at this too much from an end-consumer point of view.
Elektron (most likely) did a one time investment in the process to produce the button caps in their current state. Namely: 3 or 4 different moulds to produce the clear base, plus the process to laser the text into the black paint, and finally the rubbery finish. All steps except the moulds are just configuration files in the same machine. I don’t see any reason why there should have been new investments been required since the first digis.
Secondly, we’re talking about industrial scale mass production. A button cap that costs more than a few pennies would be commercial suicide.
What you see as end-prices factors in a lot more costs from the production to shipping, import duties, and finally a hefty margin for the shop. Let’s take an example: A premium bakelite knob costs around 31 cents when you buy a thousand from an electronics wholesaler. And still they are making some profit out of that for sure. And the producers themselves also do.
Elektron on the other hand is buying directly from the production and way larger quantities. And you can be very sure, that they earn a lot of extra money when they charge 1€ per button cap. Because replacements due to faulty production are usually calculated into the price of a product.
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The $ Elektron invests in marketing would be better spent developing new buttons imo. It’s frustrating for people who buy Elektron products, and there’s no reason to minimize these frustrations.
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That’s true of course. Just wanted to say that 1€ per knob for a good quality knob isn’t crazy expensive. Can’t say anything about profit margins or production process.
Just from a consumer point of view, the price checks out.
And I have a couple of really cheap knobs for diy. There is a huge difference compared to let’s say Rogan knobs or the Elektron ones.
Of course the price goes down when you’re buying directly from the manufacturer in bulk and it can come down drastically if you buy really large amounts. Rogan and a few other manufacturers have price lists on their websites.
When you’re producing them yourself and payed off the molds and everything, production is probably probably really cheap.
Since I bought a Digitone yesterday, I’d love for Elektron to send me new caps for free^^
Not sure why some here are arguing over whether 1€/button is acceptable. That is not the point. Of course Elektron can’t always send them for free.
The point is: if Elektron was shipping proper buttons from the get go, you wouldn’t ever need to replace them.
The fact that the replacements are as perishable as the originals is just another nail in the coffin.
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Sure, but they haven’t, so if you’re going to pay for a replacement set, maybe you’d like to know that at least they aren’t asking some ridiculous price.
Yeah, that’s pretty wild… Also the reason I’ll simply clean the caps on my DN and not buy new ones. Fortunately, the sticky stuff usually comes off fairly easy with alcohol. I cleaned all that rubberized stuff we had at home a few months ago (umbrella handles, flaslights, handles on hairbrushs, bluetooth speakers, kitchen items…that stuff was everywhere).
99% isopropyl alcohol got it off in seconds.
Edit, seems hot water is the way to go.
Btw, didn’t Arturia pull a similar move with their rubberized knobs?
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Agreed. I’ve owned more than a few Elektron machines but won’t buy any current or future ones until they’ve replaced these buttons.
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I like dirty buttons
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someone did that and the color came off.
not too hot water and rubbing is the solution so far. maybe the user who started of the thread can pin it at the top. there are is a summary not far up in the thread. it works good but takes some time and effort.
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its not about dirty. i took my digitone out of storage and the coating was just melted
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