Analog Rytm is at the top of my wish list as my first bit of Elektron gear - I’m waiting for people to start getting theirs and then posting their thoughts/videos etc so I can decide if I should splash out on one.
My first question is about how the +Drives work on Elektron machines - please can someone explain if it’s possible to back up data from the +drive (copy it to a USB stick, for example).
What happens when the drive is full of samples and tunes? If you can’t back up stuff do you just have to overwrite stuff?
I have tons of samples which I am intending to stuff the Ryhm with so I imagine it’d get full up quickly (1GB I think it is?).
If I create a tune with, for example, 30 specific samples then it can all be backed up somewhere other than the +drive? So I can store it for years if need be and then reload it into the +drive at anytime in the future.
From the Analog Four manual is it will be similar but the numbers may vary:
Q1: The +Drive is a non-volatile memory capable of storing up to 128 projects (thousands of patterns, kits and songs) internally. The +Drive also gives access to the +Drive Sound library, with the capacity of storing 4096 Sounds. Every project has access to these Sounds. You will access it with C6 I image like the Analog Four.
Q2: I think it may be harder to fill up than you might think. But if you did fill up, yes you would have to over write. If I understand your thinking you expect to not need to interact with a computer, I would save work off your machine regularly and clear you device even format the device prior to a new project. (Not required just a recommendation…)
Q3: You should be thinking about using your AR in that fashion. It sound like you are trying to shove an Octatrack into the small feature on an Analog Drum machine.
Q4: I would expect if you can still read the media and talk to the device in sysex. Yes but you need to keep things tidy…
You are talking a lot about samples… Think hard as to this is the right device for you…
I’ve been thinking pretty hard about this since the Namm videos
I have ruled out the octatrack due to concerns about its complexity. I’ve ruled out the machinedrum due to concerns about the 12 bit nature of samples.
I know what sort of music I want to make - techno and electronica using a mixture of my samples created in FL Studio combined with the in the box solution and instant hands on fun and playability of of the Rythm as demonstrated in the Leaked video.
Samples are more important to me than the analog drums to be honest although I am also very much looking forward to using the drums so I’m sure they will not be neglected.
Because this device is expensive I do need it to meet my needs/workflow.
I am a big fan of Spark Le but, sadly, that requires more time in front of the computer. I also like Geist but, again, I’m tied to the computer still.
I would assume it would have at least the same features as the MD if even done in a different method.
For the MD you can use the C6 program Elektron provides and back up everything or do a sysex dump of specific banks and/or patterns and kits. Then later on you can load back your saved data and it doesn’t need to be to the same location.
For example. MIDI send patterns A01 to A16. C6 will create a file of your choosing for that dump. Then later on you can send that bank back and you can select bank D01 - D16 to restore the dump if you chose to. There are similar options for the UW samples. I can’t imagine an AR being different in basic options from this and with any luck will have an easier method of organization (Overbridge maybe?).
The +Drive ultimately gives you 128 snapshots (I think this works differently in the A4 which should be the same as AR) and each snapshot is a complete new image of the machine. So for an MD there are banks A through H. If I load up a snapshot then it will be a whole new set of banks A through H and I won’t be able to access the other A through H without reloading the other snapshot. It is as if I had 128 MD’s at my disposal but I can only use one at a time. Maybe someone else can chime in on how the +Drive works on an A4 and that should give insight as to how the AR will work.
Long story short, based on old products I see no reason why you can’t back up the whole unit as well as single patterns.
For samples I completely agree, do not go with an MD-UW. The MD is great but simply not enough sample space for anything beyond some basic drum samples and if the bit rate is a concern for you then that too.
Do you have any specific complexity concerns regarding the Octatrack? Yeah it has a lot going on and many tricks that it can do but really the basic operation of it is not complicated or at least not more than their other boxes. I really don’t think you should rely on the AR for samples. Looks like it has 1GB of sample space and you said that is mainly what you want to use one of these boxes for. The OT comes with a 16GB card and there are 64GB CF cards out there. You can stream any size sample from the card if you wanted to.
Edit:
It’s stuff like this from the FAQ on the AR that makes me feel the sample management is more complicated than the OT because this sort of odd limit isn’t an issue on the OT thanks to the CF card.
What is the difference between Sounds residing in the Project Sound Pool and those in the +Drive Sound Library?
Sounds can be loaded to a kit from either the +Drive Sound library or the Sound Pool of the active project. The difference between the two is that the +Drive Sound library can consist of 4096 Sounds, available to all projects, while a Sound pool is a part of a project and limited to 128 Sounds. The major benefit of Sounds loaded to the Sound Pool is the possibility for them to be Sound locked, meaning each step of the sequencer can trig a different Sound. This feature is not available for Sounds located in the +Drive Sound library.
When the Octatrack was first released it went straight to the top of my wish list and before Namm it was still on my radar but since Namm and the Rytm videos I’ve become more and more seduced by that machine.
I am used to step sequencing in FL Studio but watching videos of the Rytm pads being hit has got me quite excited about actually playing a machine rather than using a mouse.
My typical tunes consist of a 4/4 beat with one shots, vocal snippets, drones and pads and synth loops so I’m assuming Rytm can handle that sort of thing with relative ease.
As long as I can back up stuff off the machine it means I’m not limited by 1 gb and forced to over write samples I like etc so that’s cool.
Honestly you are gonna be happier with the octatrack. you can do the things you need. and want from the AR upfront and to a great degree. the OT is slightly cheaper, while out of stock maybe there is a used one, better on the wallet.
Remember the reason the Octatrack is too much is because people don’t focus. once you focus the device becomes like butter.
I am not 100% sure but willing to bet the AR is not enough in the direction you want to go.
watch a few video of OT performances and see if sound right to you.
Seriously you will accomplish so much and have more fun with the Octatrack (given what you said you wanted to accomplish). I think trying to use the Rytm as a sampler and neglecting the drums would be a bit strange. Rytm is geared towards one shots whereas the OT has endless manipulation qualities. It seriously is not really harder to learn than any other box. It’s the endless creative possibilities that take the time to learn but that’s the fun part.
Thanks for your input everyone. I’ve taken onboard what you’ve said about the Octa.
I think I’m probably going to buy the Rytm this year - something about this thing means my gut is telling me I’ll absolutely love it (I’ll wait for the reviews to come in) and then get the Octatrack next year so I’ll have both
I will use the analog drums for sure - certainly interested in creating synth kicks and snares rather than hunting through my sample library.
Some of the Rytm demos on Soundcloud really capture the vibe of the electroinica I’d be wanting to create in particular the 'Dumb n Baus ’ and ‘Patience’ and ‘Messy Cheese’ tracks all of which I suppose I could create in a DAW but I’m a bit tired of working on computers all day.
Rytm also has Overbridge coming which solves some of my concerns about going OTB too.
Yes it sounds like the AR will be perfect for you. The only concern you might have would be the fact that loops are not auto tempo synced like they are on the octa or in say ableton live. But outside of that I think you are going to seriously like playing with real hardware, its just so much more inspiring and fun than a DAW.
With loops you’ll have to actually either set the pattern temp to match the loop tempo manually or alternately tune the loop tot he correct speed for the pattern (Like we used to have to do back in the day before real time tempo sync became a common DAW feature ) Old school for the win!!!
Also regarding backups, yes you can save each snapshot to your computer for backup via the c6 software (and probably overbridge too when its released I imagine) and later recall. But in honesty you can probably go out and play a whole hour long live set using a single snapshot anyway and in reality it will take you many many years to fill the entire 128 snapshots on an electron machine.
Yep, I have tons of one/two bar loops I’ve created over the years with specific tempos so times stretching is not really an issue for me, most of my stuff is 128bpm or 130bpm and if I deviate from that in the Rytm then I’ll just create new loops to fit.
With a 40 hour working week in front of a computer I don’t get enough time to ever finish tracks in my DAW with it’s infinite tweaking possibilities so I’m hoping the more immediate playability of the Rytm and even some limitations will help me get entire songs finished instead of just having loops and sketches.
I’m right there with you on that. I love drum synthesizers. I first started on a Korg ER-1 (still a great box) and now have an MD-UW. I have started to use some drum samples on the OT so I can get more of a natural rock style drum vibe, but it is nowhere near as satisfying hammering out some new percussion sounds when working on electronica projects.
From what you’ve written, I agree with others that say you will probably be happier with an OT. I think you might actually be really disappointed with the AR as a sampler. It doesn’t really have much (if anything) in the way of sample editing, EQ’ing, etc. And if analogue drums aren’t what you’re really after, then you’ve picked an odd machine to use as a sampler!
Just saying, if you’re going to drop that much money, you may as well spend it on gear that actually does what you want.
If you were scared off from the OT due to it’s complexity, then you’re might also find the rest of the Elektron gear frustrating. All of their boxes are head scratchers at first. It’s a unique work flow shared by all their machines. But that said, I think you can learn to use any of their machines with great effect, if you give yourself time to learn them.
Getting into hardware is going to light your musical fire! It did for me, and I know it’s the same for lots of other ‘new to hardware’ users. Good luck!
Yep, sounds like Octa that your after…The MD UW is pretty good with audio but still difficult for using loops with…I’d wager its got more options for handling audio than the AR though…and even though it’s 12 bit it still pumps and it full of character.