and direct “DAW” bottom access to Logic or Live.
It appears the 0 Series has buttons with more direct access to some functions compared to the Fantom Series to make things bit more streamlined. So you have the “Daw” button as one example. Also if the touch screen is primarily used for tone editing then the Expansions might be less confusing to edit than say on the Jupiter-Xm where some hardware just did not work depending on the Model.
Most likely you’ll figure out the real-world polyphony when you use it yourself. My brain hurt from reading the Zendesk explanation.
And their explanation of sample memory… real world users will probably find this out the way they have on the MC-101/707, by loading their samples until they encounter “memory full” errors. This is where I appreciate the Octatrack documentation saying flat out there’s 80MB RAM - no guesswork needed.
I sold my Xm as dealing with the UI was a creation killer. This appears much better. More direct flow. The amount of menu diving and huge lists on the Xm was really bad.
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I sold my Xm as the UI just was to painful and I was always frustrated (creativity killer). I was about ready to get a MPC Live II and then this is announced. This appears to be a much more direct UI for dealing with Roland Zen Core. Time will tell but the layout appears to be musician friendly.
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After my TBI three years ago my Brain definitely hurt a lot. I can only take so much of the maze.
It seems that people over at RolandClan are not happy with the aftertouch on the bigger Fantoms:
256 % 4 partials = 64 note polyphony.
Hi guys!
How do you feel about the sequencer on Fantom/Fantom 0?
By looking at the videos it seems to have everything you wish from a sequencer, with step sequencing, tr-rec, piano roll editing.
Seems better then the one on Mpc.
What is your opinion and does it sequence externally?
Thanks!
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Super late reply but maybe you’ll still be interested. The irony of NeoZeed offering help to Shinobi is not lost on me BTW lol.
So I’ve only had the Fantom 06 for about a week but I’ve been using the sequencer heavily so at least I have some insight coming from an Elektron / DAW user. I’ll try to tackle it the Elektron angle considering what forum we’re on.
Elektron vs Fantom 0:
I’ve owned a Digitone, Digitone Keys and still own a Digitakt and A4 MKII. The Elektrons can be quicker when it comes to sound design. The mangling options and trigs make it very intuitive to shape and mangle things. Also, all the per-step features and probability make evolving sounds much more intuitive.
The Fantom is more rigid and “traditional” in a sense as it’s really great for playing in things to a metronome with expression and polyphony and having it just fit perfectly. If you need anything to be expressed specifically with vibrato or modulation all that is way way easier on the Fantom. With the Digitakt, I need to apply an LFO after the fact or ad vibrato with the A4. Much more laborious.
TR-REC is nowhere near as intuitive as the Elektron sequencer if you want to do anything other than velocity and laying down basic patterns. Because once you get into the piano roll to really tweak things it can get dicey. That said, as cumbersome as the piano roll may be, it’s there and it offers more flexibility for stuff like flams and expressive fills with drums than anything you can do with the Digitakt.
So really it’s a trade-off: If you enjoy playing synths more and would like to lay down melodies and play-in stuff with a keyboard while using expression and modulation, the Fantom offers more than any Elektron box can deliver. It just works better for these types of things. It also trounces them when it comes to polyphony so if you’re looking to sequence chords and pads.
If you, on the other hand, really enjoy the evolving / per-step craziness of Elektron stuff, you’re going to be running into walls with the Fantom. Gritty dirty glitchy stuff is just very hard to implement with it. Takes a lot of setting up modulation lanes and steppy LFO and arpeggio stuff while heavily utilizing curated samples then importing to approach the sounds you can easily create on an elektron box.
Sorry for the wall of text! To put it simply: It’s great for a particular type of songwriting and can’t replace other gear if you are looking for a particular sound. If I can figure out how to properly sync the two song modes of the Fantom 0 and the Digitakt / Analog Four, it’ll become the centerpiece of a live rig / studio… but if it can’t it’ll merely become a synth I use as a soundbox for my Elektron gear.
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Thanks a lot for the effort my friend!!
How is the piano roll editing, and also putting notes directly on the touch screen?
Also can you do long recordings?
I am asking everything more for a sequencer to use with other modules, not its internal sounds.
On its sounds I believe it s the same zencore engine as on the other Fantom right?
As a side note, how is the parameters editing for the synths in Fantom? Easy or menu diving?
Thanks again!
The touch screen experience with the piano roll is not good if you want to actually draw in something. If you want to adjust one note or something it works, but trying to draw in melodies would drive me crazy. Just imagine it as a fine tuner for all the things you play into the sequencer, not as a way to map out anything. TR-REC might be better for that, actually. Patterns can be much longer than on elektron stuff. Something like 64 bars as opposed to the 4 elektron gives you. So yeah you could do very long sequences on it. Song mode and the concept of “groups” takes a bit to wrap your head around, though.
As far as using it to sequence outboard gear, it’s great for that. No complaints, I use it as my master controller for all my non-elektron synths now. I like that I can export all my sequences to MIDI to import into a DAW, too.
As far as sound design, it isn’t that different from how Elektron handles it, actually. You have basic Filter and Resonance knobs for quick adjusting, but you need to page through and use the 6 case-sensitive encoders under the screen for deep synthesis. Which I actually like on this. All the envelopes and the mod matrix just makes sense in the menu once you get the hang of it. You even have synth features per key when using a drum kit… so I actually created a synth kit with the noise generator and wave forms combined with the envelopes just like you would with an analog synth. So yeah it’s easy to write it off as a workstation, but as a tool for synthesis it’s very underrated IMO. Not as intuitive as something like a System 8, but not far off from an Analog Four as far as interface goes (when using it as a synth)
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So how would you compare the screen editing to say the one on Force or new Mpcs?
Can’t say, I havn’t really used the modern MPCs. the One and Force seems to have way larger screens so it’s probably a better experience when it comes to piano roll. Still, I seriously doubt it would be very intuitive or come anywhere near a laptop with a DAW… or even something like an iPad with logic.
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Looking at grabbing a Fantom 06, but I have a query regarding expansions, how many can I load into it?
can I for example buy and load the 4 model expansions and have the sh101, juno 106, jupiter 8 and jx 8p, along with say EXZ015 Vintage Synth and a number of the Zen sound packs?
It really depends on which expansions… some of them are pretty big, like the supernatural pianos and stuff. I have the vintage synths expansion and it isn’t that large. It seems like there’s some compression going on because the amount of space they take up is under half of what the DL file size is on your computer.
I havn’t purchased any of the model expansions yet, but judging by the compression I mentioned I’d say you could probably squeeze all of them on there. You wouldn’t have much room for keybed samples if you plan on having all that stuff you mentioned, though.
I’ve got little need for those supernatural piano sounds that are pre-installed so those got deleted to free up space… they took up like 25% of the memory or something around there.
Same here…
Im only interested really in the synth sounds. The wave expansions hold little interest hence the model expansions and the Zen sound packs are of importance. Does the Fantom also import the drum kits from the zen sound packs when loaded in?
I’m thinking about picking up a Fantom 06 to use in conjunction with a MPC Key 61. The combo seems like a great match for a small R&B songwriting setup that can be transported between different locations, which is a present need.
I already own a MC-707. Are the Fantom sounds mostly the same?
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As far as I can tell, the Fantoms should be a superset of the MC-707, but with the option of expansions. Roland publishes sound lists for both the MC series and the Fantoms, so you should be able to download them from the product pages and compare for yourself.
Unless there are specific things you want from the Fantom that are not present on the MC, the more compact MC-707 setup may be preferable. Also consider the Jupiter Xm. The Jupiter is a bit menu divey, but I expect the Fantom will be similar. The Jupiter can host most (but not all) of the expansions the Fantom can and is significantly smaller. The Jupiter is smaller than any 61-key and can run on batteries in the park.
My impression is that the MPC has both a better keybed and sequencer than the 0-series Fantoms. The big ones probably have better Roland keybeds, but I’ve only touched the 06, and it’s keybed felt well under par for a workstation.
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Yep, I did this after posting the question. It is mostly a 1-to-1 match. Bank A and the drums appear to be different. Also, the Fantom includes some SuperNATURAL sounds. Otherwise, it looks the same and is close enough for my purpose for now.
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