New workstation: Roland Fantom 06/07/08

The Lounge Other Gear
#21

Sonic superpower

The FANTOM-07 synth engine is based on Partials. Each Partial comprises a discrete synth voice, complete with oscillator, filter, amplifier, dual LFO, and effects. You can pack up to four Partials into a single Tone, and up to 16 Tones in a scene, which makes for mind-boggling complex layers, splits, and sequenced parts. With all this firepower, you can focus on creating music, not conserving processing power; you won’t have to concern yourself with how many effects you can use or if you can change sounds seamlessly without affecting complex patches. With the massive power available in FANTOM-07’s engine room, you can run all 16 parts concurrently with all available effects and full patch remain.

Blockquote

They do a lot of talking but do not say how much polyphony it has.

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#22

I had a Fantom 6 but only for a short period of time. I loved the sequencer but was not sure if you could use the sequence with external synths…I cant imaging you couldnt but I need to make sure the 07 I might order in a few will do that.

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#23

Fantom SuperNATURAL appears to be similar, at least in concept, to Yamaha’s Super Articulation technology

This demo on the Fantom 0 includes a SuperNATURAL trumpet

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#24

I’m unclear on exactly how V-Piano and SuperNatural stack up. IIRC, there were one or more top-end “V-Piano” products, but SuperNatural seemed to show up in more synthy products.

I lost interest because even PianoTeq doesn’t seem to allow Cage-levels of “preparation”, and multisampled pianos generally sound good enough to my ears.

Hopefully there are Elektronauts who have more experience with V-Piano or SuperNatural pianos that can help clear things up.

I know I can get a nice Casio digital piano with a decent hammer-action keybed for about $1k. I think if I was going to get serious about learning to play keys by taking piano lessons I might prefer to spend $2k on the Roland 08 to get the sequencer, sampler, much deeper instrument models, and of course all of the classic Roland samples, patches and sound design tools.

#25

According to this, V-Piano and SuperNatural are two different engines.

V-Piano - Piano Component Object Sound Modeling, or Piano COSM
SuperNatural - Sampling combined with modeling (borrowed from V-Piano for SuperNatural piano)

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#26

Agreed on the polyphony question. The MC’s run out of voices very quickly using some patches. It would be good to know if this is exactly the same engine, or has been upgraded with more processing ability.

#27

The Fantom platform is different in that it also has the SuperNatural engine and the Virtual Tonewheel organ engine in addition to the ZenCore found in the MCs. The MCs have ZenCore only.

I guess Roland will eventually update the website after enough peeps holler at them for omitting oft-requested specs like that.

They do have an article that says 256 note max polyphony for the full Fantom - no mention of Fantom 0 because the article is too old:
https://rolandus.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360039197611-FANTOM-6-FANTOM-7-FANTOM-8-Maximum-Polyphony

#28

I have a Privia that was pretty decent for the money (about $600). The lowest 2 octaves of the keyboard were damaged by a visiting pianist from Finland - just not designed to handle his intense, heavy-handed style. I had it repaired but it was never good as new.

After several years of not really playing keys, the CT-S1 has proven to be adequate for my use, which is taking the Jazz Chords for Beginners course on Open Studio, learning the main piano part to the Roy Ayers classic “Everybody Loves the Sunshine”, working out bits I want to enter into a sequencer later, etc.

That all said, the larger Fantom 0s do have undeniable appeal for those who do need more than 61 keys.

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#29

Indeed, but I’ve never found it to be as good as as dedicated device. And the issue of having a bunch of cables, a USB hub, the audio interface, etc, still remains.

I’m not saying it’s not good. I have Logic Pro and a midi controller and like it as well, but personally, I realized I gravitated more and did more music using my MPC just because it’s much simpler to get set up and going.

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#30

I enjoyed the Fantom that I tried out a while back pre pandemic at Guitar Center. One of my favorite new wave bands OMD used them live.

#31

The issue I have with Roland is that they are constantly using samples and sounds you can find in all of their other old and new gear.
I own an Integra 7 and I really like it. Many of the sounds you can find in the MC series, Roland Cloud or JVs and XJs or Fantoms, Jupiters and Junos. In one or the other alternate sounding patch name.

It is just nothing new. I think they are the masters or sound reusing. And I say this as a person that owns old and new Roland synths and likes all of them.

If of course you don’t own any of the above mentioned you will enjoy the new Fantoms.

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#32

I have both MC-101 and MC-707.

What interests me about the Fantom 0 series:

  • Sequencing experience looks like an upgrade over the 707, from the perspective of UI/UX
  • SuperNATURAL engine, which is not on the MC series
  • Virtual Tonewheel, also not on the MC series

If an old sample was good, I have no problem with it being reused over and over. Same with old synth presets. People in 2022 still obsess over recreating old Roland presets/patches like the ones found on Jupiter 8, Juno 106, etc. Hell, even JD-800, D-50…

OTOH, I did go through the trouble of creating a Tone preset on the 707 that relies on aftertouch and the Fantom 0s do not have aftertouch.

I’ve had my eye on the Yamaha YC series for the clonewheel and 8-op FM sounds - does not bother me one bit that the FM sounds are not editable to a deep level. Fantom 06 is quite a bit less costly than the YC-61, does not have any FM, but has the SuperNATURAL stuff and option of loading Model Expansions.

So, no immediate plans to buy, but will keep an eye on how they evolve as OS updates get released and such. I have a bunch of workarounds for the no-aftertouch situation.

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#33

Have tried it now. Won’t buy it. But it was pretty neat :slightly_smiling_face:

#34

It’s less of an easy sale for peeps who don’t have previous experience with the MC or Fantom sequencer. As with any sequencer, some people take to it like a duck to water and others go “WTF”

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#35

I see this as the two edges of the Roland sword. The classic Roland sample library and much of the synth and FX stuff that has been associated with it all in one box.

The Integra-7 is on my to-buy list when the closeout sales start, but I could see paying full price for a Fantom 0 series instead because of the (presumably) better interface, sequencer, sampler, and keys. The Fantom 0s remind me of the XV88, which I passed up when I bought an XV5080 (on closeout, naturally :innocent:). The 5080 is long gone now, the Jupiter Xm was supposed to be its replacement. But the Xm is cramped, and I have an easier time justifying the spend on a Fantom 0 than a Jupiter X.

I still need to get my hands on a Fantom 0. And find some additional studio space for it.

#36

I agree, the sequencing UI does look like and upgrade over the MC’s. I wonder the new Fantoms will have all of the sequencing features? It doesn’t look like it has scatter. And I haven’t seen anywhere yet if it has step probability or different track lengths.

Still, these new Fantom’s do look intriguing.

#37

Ah good catch!

Searching through the reference manual PDF, I am unable to find any mention of mute probability, mute groups, or Scatter. Also, no First Step/Last Step. I don’t there is a Looper in there either, although that is hardly the best-loved feature of the MCs, from what I’ve seen from fellow users.

So the MC-707 will probably stay even if I get a Fantom 0.

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MC 707 / 101 : Roland Grooveboxes
#39

Looks like enough squeaky wheels got Roland grease

The maximum polyphony of the FANTOM-06 FANTOM-07 FANTOM-08 is shown below.

  • This number changes depending on the processing load of the tones in use.

ZEN-Core tones/drum kit tones (common): 256

  • The polyphonies for the ZEN-Core tones and drum kit tones (including PCM/VA) are counted throughout all zones (a maximum of 16 parts).
  • If the OSC TYPE is PCM, one partial is counted as two notes, as waves can be assigned to the L and R sides of the partial respectively.

On a related note, the n/zyme Model Expansion is rumored to work only on the pro Fantom, not the 0-series

#40

I play keyboard like old people type…so 1 note polyphony for the win!

#41

So basically between 32 and 64 expected. Of course if you buy the Juno or Jupiter expansion and mainly use those then you up the ante.