Musical Notes For Samples Importance

Elektron Gear Octatrack
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Hi,

This may be the n00best question I have asked, I hope you’re not gonna ban me or destroy me tha much.

So, my music theory is bad (did play instrument as younger for years and could read sheet music but it was a long time ago). Then DJ-ed for many years but it ain’t the same.

So I’m catching up.

I am mostly sample based (mainly Octatrack and loops) but also do sounds on Elektron.

When I buy a sample pack, except drums, every one-shot or loop bass/synth/fx/and vocals have a note stated, like Emin, Fmin, Eb, D, F# and so on…

My question: how important is it to only choose the parts of my songs in the same note? So if I make a classic 4/4 track with chords, stabs, plucks, pads and vocals, all of the selected loops would have to be in the very same note?

THANKS

Ps.: in case I pitch the samples down/up to match the key of other parts (because frankly, sometimes you like one sample but all others chosen have another key), what’s the best method to approach it? Since you ain’t seeing notes but a value.
In case of Model:Cycles it’s easy because you get to select the note.

Thanks again, cheers!

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You’ve opened up a potentially huge topic :slight_smile:

Not 100% sure, from what you’ve written, if you get the difference between the note sounded by a sample and the key of your piece of music. (Sorry if I got that wrong and you do know that).

Once you know the key of your piece of music (that may be determined by the bass line you’ve got, or the first sample you picked) that and the scale (major, minor and more) will guide you to which kind of notes will fit. And then, as you say, if the sample isn’t playing that note, you have to adjust.

How exactly you can most conveniently adjust on an octatrack I will leave for octatrak users to answer, but for instance if you want a D and your sample is C you would increase the pitch by 2 semitones.

Maybe you should look out for theory videos on YouTube. There’s one I keep getting offered from “underdog” with a title like “all the theory you need for techno”. Maybe that one?

EDIT:

EDIT: Actually that may not be ideal, it’s kind of leaning towards “how to pick bits from the theory you already know and apply it to techno”

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If your loop is in x key, you can play all the 8 notes that belong to that key without worries. Feel free to get out of those 8 from time to time. You know, if it sounds good, it is good, right? No need to sweat. LoL imagine a song with a single note throughout. I’m sure there must exist one and it is fucking awesome made by a genius producer, but other than that: lol.

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you ignore how those samples are called and put them together so it sounds cool to YOU

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There is Jobim’s “One-Note Samba”, though admittedly that has two notes.

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the prevalent issue is harmony vs dissonance. musical notes and scales in the groupings which they’ve been given by academics mostly fall into these groups, different cultural or modal specifics may lean more in one direction than the other though. some people tune a kick drum, some people don’t, it’s really up to your ears. do you like music that sounds melodic? probably want to find or tune samples to notes which relate in a key. do you like music that’s a little chaotic or dissonant? probably want to find sounds that complement the palate of your own ears, this is in fact what you should do either way. you could try to mix the 2 but it can be difficult to convey your ideas without clarifying what you want it to sound like first.

there’s also no reason to compose music if you aren’t into that, you could just make your toys go bleep bloop and call it a day, no one can judge you except yourself. it’s not a noob question, it’s a deep question.

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Even under considering the section that has only two notes in the melody there’s a moving harmony. But good call.

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neil young discussing the one note guitar solo, but gets a bit philosophical and open about his ignorance of theory.

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Play what sounds good – if a note doesn’t sound good, re-pitch it +/- 1 semitone, change the volume, or change its length. Rinse and repeat.

Personally, theory is most useful in understanding why something sounds good and less helpful when I’m trying to come up with something that sounds good. So in your case I wouldn’t worry about it very much – your samples do not (and perhaps should not) need to be the same note. Just do what sounds good, and if its important to you to analyze further then theory might be helpful.

With that said there are a few concepts that help me get to good ideas quickly: understanding diatonic scales and the circle of fifths made my monophonic lines much better, and understanding voice leading and borrowed chords made my progressions WAY better. If you end up finding theory interesting, Ableton’s Creative Strategies for Electronic Musicians (https://makingmusic.ableton.com/) is a really good place to start. But if you don’t just keep making music and don’t worry about it.

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Just have the confidence to use your ears. Nothing else matters.

If you can’t hear it and you just use file naming as a guide then your music will most likely not speak to anyone and therefore be boring.

Imagine making a painting with your eyes shut - similar problem.

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This is the way

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There is no -the- way to approach your issue. It completely depends upon what you want achieve.

One approach is to resample your note in the 12 notes of the chromatic scale. Then you will be able to construct all the scales from the western 12 note system.

Resampling into the 12 chromatic notes will also allow you to use the hit and miss system of just use your ears as I have no clue what I am doing as suggested above.

Another option can be to resample the notes only into the scale you like. Typically this will be 7 or 5 notes for western music. This will make sure that it is easier not to hit any wrong sounding notes. But depending on the complexity of your chords and chord progressions some notes (especially in the 7 note scales) can still sound off unlike what Phillip suggested above.

Sampling only a scale can be very handy if you play pads, as you wont need to dedicate 12 pads to one sound.

Furthermore, if you are into arabic or atonal music, you might need to sample 24 notes or more as those systems are not constrained to just 12 notes.

If you are interested to continue making music I suggest that you try to learn at least some theory. As suggested above you can just use your ears, but with some theory understood you will be able to know what selection of notes over specific chord progressions will give you which feeling. Furthermore, it will be a lot easier to remember and repeat what have been playing as you can fit it into the system you have learned.
Typically, the hit and miss method will be fun in the beginning, but you will usually hit a limit on progressing pretty soon (as you might be experiencing this very moment)

So yeah, musical freedom and just doing freely is a very nice thing, but usually works far better if you have learned the traditional way first.

On top, we have not yet touched the topic of needing multiple scales when the song is transposing.

So yeah, you did indeed open a can of worms, very nice worms Id like to add as you are getting to know each of the worms in the can more intimately.

Have fun, try out a lot, and the more you know and the more you practice the more it will become second nature to play around with these things. And once you step in, dont give up, and embrace that you have just started a lifetime of learning and enjoyment once you start to learn with the right focus and energy.

And lastly, be brave and dont do stupid :heart:

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And if you like, I can help you in this topic to apply what I explained above in a more practical way. For this it would be handy if you can post a snippet of what you are trying and we go through different scales and notes to apply them in context. Which can be very fun, explanative and rewarding….

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Well, there are these two at least:

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A mixture of planning and chaos. I embrace what @Jeanne says at times. Often I’m randomising the source page and enjoying the combination of rate and pitch that can present, with no idea what the inherent notes are and tuning everything to that by ear or by reference to the rate and pitch values.

At other times (more in group sessions) the benefits of lots of adaptable sample chains keeps me moving quickly when someone calls out a particularly key/scale etc. Helpful for this was Barker’s approach, documented elsewhere here and on his website but in short, sample chains of 64 chords in a few keys so you can easily pitch up and down a semitone or two if required.

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Well for a cohesive sound it makes sense to play either the sample in the key of your song (on other instruments or tracks from the ot) or vice versa.

Some people have a natural feeling for harmony, some don’t.

For those who don’t I would simply match the key.

IMHO, matching things makes everthing sound more pro and less like a child playing random notes.

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Permanently attach a tuner to that headphone out, if you think you need to know?

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I disagree. For most of the history of composed music, artists didn’t have the technology to instantly audition sounds and textures. How, then, could they rely on their ears? I think, instead, they had to rely on their musical imagination and their understanding of music theory. Some of the old music was crap. But not all of it. And plenty of composing happened with “ears shut”.

Back to the OP’s question…some sounds contain formant, or fixed frequency elements. For example, vowels. If we change the pitch of a sampled vowel beyond a certain threshold, the vowel loses its intelligibility. Other sampled sounds may sound less “natural” when pitch shifting is applied to them. This is why instruments are multi-sampled at different registers to capture the unique timbres of those registers. None of this matters, I suppose, if we aren’t concerned with “realistic” sounds.

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Well, imo the OT is as jazz as it gets with electronic music, so a little dissonance seems fitting :wink:

A little more deterministic; I recorded twelve single notes, to always have a reference at hand to tune my sample to a scale. Obviously a cheap guitar tuner on the cue works as well.

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This may be the noobest question in this thread but what exactly is one semitone if I pitch on Elektron devices? I see the notes when on a parameter lock, but given the whole track, there is a scale of numbers. Do I understand correctly that 6 is semi, 12 is a tone?