I dunno, maybe cos it’s a forum?? 
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Person 1: guitars are better than pianos because they have more features, and you can bend notes!
Person 2: no pianos are better because the layout is easier to understand and the sound quality is better!
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I know you don’t want the debate, but I both agree and disagree with you. Yes, a DAW is a must, and to be fair, the MPC is a DAW too, just a bit more limited (mainly no parallel mix channels, limited mix buses+inserts+sends, and inferior effects).
It’s the “if you need a hardware instrument” part that I’m not sure I agree with 100%. Because if that’s what you need, I’m not sure the MPC would be the first pick unless you’re very much into sampling and finger drumming. To me, an instrument invites you to perform on it live, and I’d say that there are many other grooveboxes that are more oriented towards live performance compared to the MPC (the Elektron Digi trio, the Roland MC-x0x, the Novation Circuits, to name a few).
It’s even in the name: the MPC is a Music Production Center. That’s also why I personally bought (and loved) it: my goal was to make full tracks outside of the DAW (not really reflecting much on the fact that I just switched to another DAW). I wasn’t necessarily into hardware instruments at the time, I explicitly wanted a production device and the MPC was the obvious “one box to rule them all”.
Today, however, I explicitly want hardware instruments that inspire me in non-linear ways. That’s why I no longer have an obvious use for the MPC, even though it’s an excellent device, because it’s not my primary DAW anymore, and it’s far from the most immediate instrument out of the ones I own.
All this said, if you’re happy with the MPC sitting in that middle ground of a DAW wrapped up in an instrument-like control surface & audio interface, then it’s one hell of a device to own that could end up being the only music making device you ever need.
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countless tracks (many great ones) were produced just fine long before DAWs even existed. there are no “musts” other than the notes
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In this context I think we’re talking about one-man-show productions. Those famous tracks you’re talking about surely had some form of team of pros that helped with mixing and mastering, presumably using some studio equipment, for it to end up on pressed vinyl etc. So, a bit more than just the notes. 
Edit: but you’re right, there are no real musts here.
there were production teams to be sure but so much of dance music pre-DAW was just a man/woman with their gear in a room working out the sounds and notes
Right, but that’s a proper mixer in that home studio. I think the ‘must’ here is at least a rudimentary mixer. That’s the minimum use case of a DAW.
the whole thing hinges on personal preference. so why care how someone wants to approach it. do what werks best for you, and encourage the other person to werk the way they want…then…you can both show up at the battle of the bands and rock out. in your own way of course
just please, no decor around your setup. fuuuuuuu 
Software vs Hardware, round 1450405920354378450, Fight.
In the meantime we are on the MPC Live/X/One thread so “Muh DAW vs groovebox” is off topic and unnecessary.
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Exactly my point. If you truly need a DAW, use a proper one. Producing and mixing albums makes for half my livelihood; and I can tell you, for certain, the MPC simply doesn’t cut it in that regard.
And yet, as a touring musician—and I do mean instrumentalist—who is charged with many tasks onstage, including playing and sequencing live percussion; the MPC is the only tool that can facilitate all that I require of it, without being tethered to a computer. I wouldn’t even consider the other boxes you’ve listed, for a dozen reasons, ranging from interface to I/O.
As for any perceivable middle ground, whatever compromises one chooses to endure, should the tools they use prove less than adequate, that is up to the individual. To which end, I already addressed that when I said the following.
I’m not here to tell you what you need. But there are absolutely situations wherein hardware is a necessity; and just as many wherein a proper DAW is the only way forward.
The in-the-box/out-of-the-box debate is only ever the result of one person not trying to understand what the other needs to accomplish and why.
Cheers!
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Took my MPC X apart tonight to replace the play / play start buttons, since when I bought the machine used, it had one button missing (had broken off).
Man this fucking thing, I had to disassemble the whole freaking thing to get to these plastic buttons…changed them out with my replacement buttons, then put it all back together then closed the MPC X and tried the device…all worked fine, except now the meter & display below the meter weren’t working anymore so I was like “fuck it, let’s disassemble the whole thing AGAIN and make sure all connectors are in properly”…
Well opened the thing up a second time but it’s so damn cramped with all the connectors and cables running from the bottom lid to the main board…ugh.
Long story short, one of the flat connectors came off (from the screen), tried to put it back in, but upon reboot the screen only lit up but no image. So I tried it again, carefully disconnecting the other pin connectors to gain some room to make sure the aforementioned flat connector was in place right, because, you know, the fucking thing is SO cramped…
Anyway, now nothing works, lol, pads light up then go dark, q-link screens show the usual stuff as when in main mode, but they don’t respond to any turning of them.
I’m so bothered with the way Akai put these together, cramped and to get to a piece of plastic for which I can buy a replacement, I have to disassemble the entire machine…the dudes from MPCStuff warned me, they told me (after selling the buttons) that it’s really not worth it considering what needs to be done to do it, but I thought tonight “ah I’m in a chill mood, will take my time and go slow…”
Whatever. Thanks for entertaining my rant, going to bed now.
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Ya, I entertained upgrading the pads on my Live, till I saw what that entailed.
You have my empathy. Here’s hoping you get it working again.
And if not, whisky usually works for me. 
Cheers!
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Yeah I won’t bring this up again, sorry. In my defense, I didn’t start it, I felt it started with MPC vs Force, which turned into “why Force when I have Ableton” and it spiraled down from there with my +1’s.
In the end, the MPC re-opened the world of music making for me and for that I’m very grateful. I’ve made some of my best songs on it.
Not sure what you mean with that?
Good point, I’m sure there are more than legitimate ‘live instrument’ reasons for picking the MPC. Pete again uses the Machine+ for the same reasons, I’m guessing. The MPC can definitely be a form of instrument for many use cases.
Same here.
Blaming me then? 
I don’t know why people insist on being offended at talk of DAW’s in relation to the MPC/Force, especially when it’s coming from users who are informed and descriptive. (talking about you specifically here @djst btw).
I get this… and can understand why you’d use the MPC for this purpose and not a DAW/laptop.
The MPC/Force are standalone sketchpads/starting points for me, that I’ll usually move into Ableton to develop or finish.
Interestingly (well, to me at least), the Force is way more susceptible to my ‘why aren’t I just using Ableton’ mindset than the MPC is… that’s probably because the Force is designed to be Ableton Jr… the MPC is its own thing, and I like that, I like it’s workflow, and being made to think/work within it’s structure.
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Haha, blaming unintended!
I agree, it shouldn’t be controversial. But I can also see how it could be a little tiring to read from others elaborating on why they don’t like/need a device you personally love to use. So, even though it shouldn’t be controversial, I don’t have a strong desire to repeat my point of view anymore here.
And clearly there’s a strong market need for the MPC, otherwise it wouldn’t sell as much as it is. Wasn’t the MPC One the most popular synth on Thomann in 2021?
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I would love a battery powered Mpc one…
I’d sell my live ii for it.
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Yeah, I think I wrote about my dream MPC above. An SP-404-sized MPC Mini with built-in (replaceable) battery, mini pads, and a slightly stripped down version of the OS without all the soft synths. Just a very good sampler and keygroup player with a suite of effects and a great sequencer.
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Succulents…Lego 
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Why not the Sp404 mk2 then?