Pitch matters too, every time I hear beats from an old MPC or sampler where every single drum hit is pitched the same, like finger drummers on instagram or whatever, sounds sooo stale and weak. That’s why the DT benefits so much from a keyboard!
i’m thinking I’ve picked up an awful habit of playing stuff in live, but then too often quantizing it to get to that initial ‘sounds tighter’ correction - beats and melodies, but ultimately ending up with lifeless mechanics.
I’ve began recording more live melodic instruments lately and have been holding back a bit more on hitting the quantize.
When it comes to rhythm though, I must take a look at some good live drum loop samples on a grid to see what they are doing; if there are any rules of thumb about what real drummers might relax or tighten on; that right amount of sloppiness and little rushes. Melody I find easier to ‘hear’ when there is no need for quantization and let it more freely roll along. Beats are trickier as I’m not a drummer, nor even rhythmically blessed by any stretch of the imagination.
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You mean like “tuning” your drums? Agreed.
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Not pre-tuned drum samples if that’s what you mean, although those are cool too. I mean p-locking the pitch for each step as desired for drums. I suppose with real drums the pitch stays pretty similar as you play but it’s so dynamic. Like, the drums people program into their DAW in most Against the Clock videos sound TERRIBLE! No variable pitch or variable anything, just the same samples sounding the same on every hit, copy and paste until it fills the timeline UGH!!!
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Yeah it’s just awfully boring. Everyone should have a pad controller and beat those in. Even 4-to-the-floor. One way to learn to keep time.
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Pads are cool but I like a keyboard better, pitch AND velocity at the same time. I guess you can’t finger drum multiple parts with keyboard unless you’ve got one that can do splits, but it’s a trade-off. I guess some pad controllers have scale modes too so that would be equivalent! All kinds of ways to go but duplicating hits on the grid is the lamest. I’ve had some solid beats come out of drumming in a 4 on the floor but screwing it up, and then rolling with it! So yeah I agree 100%
my trawl on the internets often discusses use of pitch - not just the drums themselves but to incorporate or detach the bassline as an integral part, also a little off the grid. So microtiming the drums is just the start …
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I mean I can understand programming some inhuman sequence but if we’re talking a looping simple 4-note bass line just play it. Guaranteed you’ll come up with even more by doing it.
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The elektron sequencer function to nudge an entire track sequence forward and backward using the func + <> arrows … that can’t be reduced to micro-timed steps? back and forth? would be nice to see what that sounds like.
Unfortunately not.
Yeah that would be neat, unless you’ve got a huge number of trigs on a track though it doesn’t take very long to go in and do some microtiming. I wonder what button combo would be best for that?
…micro nudging a whole track at once is just around corner…no worries…soonish they gonna make it happen…
should be part of the swing option then…
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Even so if everything were microtimed the same it would still sound rote.
Just get in there and get dirty.
I play the drums.
Acutally the pitch does change, depending on where on the head you play a note. Playing acoustic drums is super dynamic, the way to replicate that in sequencer world, is to vary pitch and velocity. But subtley.
As for groove, perfectly quanitised patterns sound lifeless. To get good grooves, there needs to be push, pull or both. Combined with pitch and velocity variation. The whole thing should breath and pulsate, sing even. Sometimes using a swing preset can sound lifeless.
The thing about real drumkits, is they do actually sing, (providing they are tuned properly) the snare will affect the bass drum, toms, and those drums affect the snare, the bass drum will bite into the cymbals, hihats can cut through almost anything.
Also… call and response…
Anyway. Huge topic. Long story short, yeah ‘microtiming’ matters.
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For me it all comes from grid recording mode without any swing. I don‘t like swing, it does a thing that I‘d like to feel out myself with microtiming.
Sometimes it‘s also nice to have two triggers on the same step; one accurate with a 50% condition, another microtimed with a /PRE. Even nice and funky non-quantized sequences lose their groove when they‘re looping into sameness.
edit: also interesting to read above thoughts on tuning - I find varying tuning also very important, it not only adds „liveness“, but also counters some resonances building up in the reverb.
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I like to set an LFO on my hi hats to sample start and mess around with the depth and speed and all that until I find something I like the sound of. Also, locking in slight differences in pitch, overdrive, and reverb on toms and the snare. The more I dive into programming on the DT the more I find that I can do to make my drums, and everything else for that matter, sound more human. I really love these instruments.
I play drums too, for the last 25 years.
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On the octatrack I’ll almost always set the free lfos to random and have them manipulate volume, pitch, balance, amp attack. This together with only quantizing what needs it. If I don’t play the trigs in I’ll often nudge the trigs on 2’s and 4’s in some direction.
As the rytm does not have so many lfos I’ll randomize the volume mainly if the lfo is free. If not I’ll record some movement live just turning knobs slightly.
My goal doing all this is effecting until you hear it, then nudging back a bit. Unless the funk wants it.
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Microtiming on Octa
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I try to always use microtiming and velocity in most beats.
But I guess it‘s not always desired in dance music. Drummachine beats like a 909 techno beat often should sound machine like. That‘s just another type of character of music.
Anyway, imitating a real drummer is really hard, that‘s why I still love slicing snd rearranging breakbeats. Human feel already included
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