Load kits from other projects (Rytm, AR) (solved)

Elektron Gear Analog Rytm
1

TL;DR: load kits (with linked samples) into new projects - works with copy/paste function

Hi,

recently I was very much into sound design and created a lot of kits in the AR. I just started with the presets and it went from there. Then I came to a point where sample slots became scarce. So I decided to make a new project and load in all my new kits and also hoped the samples would be ordered that way if I did it consecutively.

(I had assumed a function like in the old E-MU samplers which AFAIR allowed to import programs and samples from other projects into the current one, which would be saved as one file, terminology might have been different.)

Thenā€¦
I found out that on the AR:

  • kits donā€™t live outside projects
  • projects are parallel unverses that only allow sounds/samples to enter from the meta (+ drive)
  • there is no function to save kits outside projects (except via SysEx externally), esp. not on the +Drive
  • and: there is no function to load kits (and related samples) from another project (although kit data are only a few bytes, seem to have pointers to sample slots, which themselves should have pointers via project to the +Drive samples)
    • when saving a project via transfer, it also saves the linked samples on the computer
      .
outdated, ignore

I found a very cumbersome workaround: https://www.reddit.com/r/Elektron/comments/b2tsrh/rytm2_copy_kits_with_samples_between_projects/

  • from what I understood:
    • kit data can be copied with the copy/paste function
      • assume that would require un/loading projects each time
    • all the nec. samples have to be loaded into the sample pool manually (so you have to know which samples are used in the projects)

Since sound packs are in circulation, I assume (hope?) there must be a way. An easier way. I mean, the whole advantage of kits is that one doesnā€™t need to load single sounds one by one into each pattern and that one can change the sound of a pattern/have variations just by changing the kit.

Theoretically it should be possible to create a new project outside the AR by using transferred project data which include the samples (and links/hashes). Maybe such software projects exists already.

Maybe the SysEx functions not only allow for transferring kit data but also samples. I will try using two AR units, but my hopes arenā€™t high.

Summarized:
Is there an easier way to load kits (with linked samples) into new projects?

Edit (solution):

  • at least in 1.70 the copy/paste kit assigns all nec. samples and samples are loaded in consecutive order into the sample pool :star_struck::blush::+1::+1::+1:
    • old project - kit view - navigate to kit (I used load kit menu) - FUNC + REC (copy)
    • load new project - kit view - navigate to kit slot (I used save kit menu) - FUNC + STOP (Paste)
    • results:
      • kit is copied completely with all settings and samples!
      • all nec. samples are available and have been loaded and packed next to each other! (have been scattered all over sample pool before)
6 Likes
2

Thanks a lot for sharing, itā€™s quite encouraging !
Iā€™m in the same situation (or, was) of creating lots of kits but at some point having the machine full of kits, some that I currently use, and some that I donā€™t want to delete because part of another Ā« identity Ā». And they all heavily rely on samples.
I never got the guts to actually try to manage, reorder kits into clean and coherent projects. I might go back to it since I read your post !!

1 Like
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so the samples change slots? like if a sample on project A is on slot 60 does it change when copied over to project B?

if you have lfo/mod on the sample slot it will sound different loaded with other samples around, something to considerā€¦

4

Yes.

I like that behavior, because it sorts the samples. If I load kit 1 this populates like the first 12 slots, then kit 2 the next 12. Very neat.

I donā€˜t use LFO sample slot magic so far. Maybe this is also included somehow. If you use this, your samples are already in a row (as opposed to my chaotic state in the kit dev project), so maybe it works automatically, maybe needs adjustment, maybe it doesnā€™t realize the kit covered more than one sample per instrument. Could you test it?

5

I will try testing this in the near future but I donā€™t think it will copy the samples included, just the mod valueā€¦

6

That would be my guess, too. But one never knows what the OG designers put in the code :wink: They certainly act in mysterious or at least highly ideosyncratic ways :smiley:

7

Today I was testing this function further and I think it is a little bit buggy.

The first kit is imported as I described. The second kit too, with samples going from 13 to 24.

Bug description: However, if I save the project and reload it, the second kit doesnā€™t find its samples because it then searches for them in the original sample slots. :roll_eyes:

This is a little bit strange because directly after copying the the kit, it works. :thinking:

Edit: (solution, hopefully)

  • directly after pasting and loading the copied kit in the new project,
    • I altered the kit minimally and
    • saved it again.
  • Result: seems like everything stays put when reloading the project then :smiley:
3 Likes
8

Thanks for posting. Iā€™ll definitely try on my side as well when I can .

1 Like
9

I did some quick tests, got weird resultsā€¦ Looked fine at first, then re-opening the project I got wrong sample assignments.
Iā€™ll try to dig further, but I fear that there will be no real acceptable solution. By ā€œacceptableā€ I mean reliable, not too complicated so the workflow donā€™t get brokenā€¦
I really hope I could integrate Rytm in my workflowā€¦ I love how it sounds with samples, and Iā€™m not aware of any other machine that can load 12 sample kits, and have performance tools as powerful as Senes and Perfs.
Digitakt 2 is probably great, but to me it lacks the performance aspects. Rytmā€™s Scenes and Perf just rule.

3 Likes
10

Did you:

  • 1 - alter the kit (minimally) after copying and
  • 2 - save the kit a second time? (I gave new name also, perhaps important ingredient)

That worked for me.

additional long and verbose STT version

Additional description. When in the new kit, paste the copied kit with func plus stop into a new slot while in a kit view screen. This results in correctly working kits in the new project even if itā€™s the second kit you copied. If you would now just save and reload the project, the samples would be in the newly assigned sample slots in consecutive order, just as the new kits have been copied to the new project. However, after reloading, the kits would search for their samples in the old slots where they had been in the old project. I had played around with this a little bit and found out that very probably this is a working workaround: After copying the kit to the new kit and while everything is working as it should, alter the kit a little bit and save it again. I also gave it a new name, perhaps this is also an important ingredient. And then after saving and loading the new project, in my case, everything was fine. I must admit I havenā€™t copied all my 30 kits or so I wanted to copy to a new project as of yet. I will see how this will turn out.

Perhaps just a lucky shot, will try again :slight_smile:

I am glad it works at least for:

  • all settings incl.
    • filter,
    • FX,
    • synth parameters and
  • loading in the right samples in a new order (that alone saves a lot if time :slight_smile:

reassigning the samples (12 samples per kit, easier with double tap in sample button than encoder F) is tedious but seems much less frustrating than the need to recreate everything from scratch (or copying each sound to each pattern as in ST)

1 Like
11

Proposal for kit use in current and coming Elektron devices:

TL;DR: more stuff on the +Drive

  • Save and load kits, patterns, tracks, and songs from the +Drive.
  • Enable partial pattern loading without destroying unselected parts in the existing pattern (kind of merge patterns and reuse standards)
  • Load multiple songs into a single project for live sets or albums.

Introduction

I think it must have historic reasons, but itā€™s not so easy to understand why all sounds can live in the meta universe which is the +Drive but not kits.

With drums itā€™s very often about kits, because itā€™s a lot of work to make sounds sound good together, and in many cases it just not a useful approach to load sounds from different machines, projects, days, etc. into into one new kit. And then thereā€™s also the fact that the general settings of the kit or pattern (depending on the machine) have huge influence on the sound.

Imagined functioning and use cases

That said, I propose that not only samples and sounds are allowed to live in the meta-universe (+Drive), but also kits, and while we are at it, we should also add songs, patterns and tracks.

There is a foundation for it in the existing machines, and it would be just great to load in (or exchange on the fly) bass drum patterns, hi-hat patterns, or some simple baselines, melodies etc.

With that feature it should be optional if patterns also load their respective kits, or just add the pattern to the kit thatā€™s already there, or to the kit of the last pattern.

With an option for partial loading patterns (like track 1-4 or track 9-12) it would also be quick to exchange basic rhythm etc. (quasi merge function)

Next would be tracks, it would be good to have options to load in a track as is, like on a bass drum track, or hi-hat track, or bass track. And then it would also be great as an option if the track could bring its own sound with it, like if a track has lots of modulations.

With an ability to load songs from the +Drive it would be easy to build a live set or album with different songs in one new project, including all used samples, sounds, settings, patterns.

And this would open up a whole lot of possibilities for interchange between projects.

1 Like