Investigating OB and reaper with Digitakt : notes for new users

Elektron Software Overbridge
#12

1 - No, I never new this could be a problem. A thing here could be that it may take away the
possibillity to put in notes via a connected keyboard. I am pretty sure that the sequencer does
not accept notes that are put in via usb (maybe wrong - will try).

2 - I use a Behringer XR18 as my studio mixer and also audio interface. My latencey (output) there
is about 6ms. I never run into problems when playing e.g. VSTis in real time

3 - you see me baffled. I didn´t even knew that there was something like this panel.
I do not use the Digitakt as audio interface, though.
Would you recommend to match the latency settings with the ones in my audio interface?
Note: I do not use Digitakt as an audio interface.

4 - Yes I have. Ableton does not have these problems at all right away. I did not know of the control
panel, Digitakt stayed in sync. I always thought Reaper is the on to blame.

You mentioned that strange behavior where the Digitakt was in sync, when you play a song from the start, but not when you jump in somewhere in the middle of a song.
This is what I am facing constantly. Digitakt is in sync when I start from the beginning.
As you might understand, this is not a good way for producing, tedious and time consuming.

Reaper is my DAW of choice. I am so used to it when it comes to composing/producing.
Ableton is more of performance/jamming tool at least for me.

Thank´s again for taking the time to answer and keep this thread alive.

Seems I could update my forum-settings. I was notified via mail that there have been replies. :smiley:

1 Like
#13

1 - No, I never new this could be a problem. A thing here could be that it may take away the
possibillity to put in notes via a connected keyboard. I am pretty sure that the sequencer does
not accept notes that are put in via usb (maybe wrong - will try).

You are wrong (and that’s good news I guess :slight_smile:). Precisely, when using digitakt (or other ovebridge device, you have 2 choices to send midi via usb:

  • Either by sending midi to the track where overbridge is, which is not really good in my opinion. Notably midi can be sent to digitakt or played back from daw/reaper, but not recorded in digitakt with this method
  • Either by using the other way, which is better in my opinion and which is to directly use the out midi port : in reaper preferences > audio > midi device, first enable midi out (normally you did it already if you are sending clock to the digitakt), then create a reaper track, go to routing and add an hardware send, choose digitakt. This way, using reaper track will work as if you were using the midi din (but via usb).

2 - I use a Behringer XR18 as my studio mixer and also audio interface. My latencey (output) there
is about 6ms. I never run into problems when playing e.g. VSTis in real time

Me neither, I am using a basic audient ID4

3 - you see me baffled. I didn´t even knew that there was something like this panel.
I do not use the Digitakt as audio interface, though.
Would you recommend to match the latency settings with the ones in my audio interface?
Note: I do not use Digitakt as an audio interface.

Yes, you should give it a try. You should lower the plugin latency and set also the driver efficiency. Don’t worry, if it is too fast, you will be notified by the overbridge engine

4 - Yes I have. Ableton does not have these problems at all right away. I did not know of the control
panel, Digitakt stayed in sync. I always thought Reaper is the on to blame.

Reaper is definitly to blame (more precisely, my guess is it is difficult to make overbridge work with all daw, and they chose the most populars) But what solve the issue of “good sync at the beginning of the timeline” is these 3 things :

  • no sync on overbridge plugin (otherwise digitakt doesn’t use midi clock as sync)
  • Midi clock
  • No SPP ! this is very important IMO, the song position seems to give a bad time to the digitakt/overbridge thing

Doing this, it works fine for me, as long as the audio interface latency is quite low, otherwise, I have to manually nudge the whole record.

2 Likes
#14

@TheWhistler : Also and once again, have you tried to sync digitakt and reaper Without overbridge first ? I know you want to use overbridge BUT if the clock without overbridge doesn’t sync, It won"t work with overbridge either.

#15

Very, very much thank´s. :smiley:
I am still trying to get all this information to work.
You see me corrected. My Digitakt get´s the note information via USB for the sequencer on autochannel.
It´s good to be wrong (good news :wink:).
I am still trying to find the right settings in Overbridge settings.
Lowering it under the audio interface range seems to make things better.
I have to investigate on this tomorrow when I habe a bit of spare time.
I will once again give your recommendation another try, to not sync via Overbridge.

I will report back.

#16

@TheWhistler : You are welcome and also I am still trying to figure out the best way to use overbridge too.
Currently, I start jamming using digitakt and a few soft synths or external synths controlled via midi only (via usb or midi din, with no overbridge). when I am done jamming, I use overbridge to “print” the pattern and further arrange (I could even use the standalone application, it would’t change much for this use…).
Ideally I would have prefered being able to sequence the overbridge track with midi items only (triggering patterns via Program Change and midi notes ) as if it really was “real” vst.
But unfortunatly, I still feel overbridge is a bit “too” heavy to be used like this. It works but it is not as smooth as using a vst and tends to kill my creative mood (even in ableton live or else).

I am hopping that elektron might improve the overall integration in a near future.

#17

Update :

I have no idea why, but I don’t have much problems with overbridge anymore in reaper including with sync. Here are my settings :

  • OB 2.0.60 and DT 1.30
  • DT is not used as main interface, my audient ID4 is used
  • I choose 128 samples as asio buffer, and the same values on the overbridge control pannel. As said in a lot of post, it works better with low buffer values.
  • Sampling rate of 48000 seems to be a bit better (natural sampling rate of DT)
  • the track where overbridge is put on has to always be armed. I disable record on that track.

Total recall seems to work quite well too.

Overbridge ASIO settings
#18

Hey Dissofiddle,

Seems they have sorted the hickups with sync.

Sadly I ran into another problem, this time with audio routing.
I have a track-template that I start when playing with the digitakt.
In Reaper you can get 10 stereo (20 in mono) channels for the Digitakt with 19/20 handling the master.
This is the track that does not work as intended/before.
I routed my sample tracks to have one channel/fader each.
All the FX are sent to the master out ot the Digitakt. This worked quite well in the past.
I could pick up the bare FX on the master out just like it was an FX-return on a mixer.
This does not work anymore.
I have been through the rounting menue up and down, back and forth.
When I set “Int to Main” to position “auto” nothing happens.
When I set it to “off” nothing happens (as it obviously should).
When set to “on” I have double the loudness and phasing.
As mentioned in the manual, when overbridge is active “auto” is the way to go.
This just does not work. I think this is a bug. I don´t know on which side, Overbridge or Digitakt.
It is not so much a Reaper topic (I first thought I had my routing messed up, but i didn´t).
Interestingly it works as it should on my Digitone, so maybe the firmware 1.30 on the Digitakt is the one to blame.
Do you think I should open a ticket?

EDIT: Sorry for being dumb. It WAS a routing mistake and my own fault. :flushed: :laughing:
I thought the main channel is 19/20 in fact it 1/2. Now it works. :grinning:

#19

As for the recommendation to let put the track that holds the VST for Digitakt in record mode.
This is true to drastically reduce latency when playing sounds on the Digitakt live.
One thing to keep in mind is: If you put a track in record mode - it does just that, it records, or is open for incoming data/audio.
As Reaper is so wonderfully adaptable (some may say quirky and convoluted) just set the track to input “none”.
So you have both. Low latency and no unwanted data or recording.
I learned that the hard way when searching for a strange pattern jump I thought I would never have progammed.
It was just notes that I unintendently record while playing a VSTi.
Because I have my Digitakt track unvisible on the TCP I wasn´t aware of the notes I actually recorded.
Maybe this helps someone.

EDIT: Once again, firing too fast.
I learned that Reaper (and I would myself consider rather advanced) has surprises for me.
I never knew there was a way to put a track to input monitoring only while having it in record armed mode.
Means, there are two options for accomplishing this goal. Record mode on for lower latency and NO actual recording happening.

#20

Hello @TheWhistler,

About Routing : Happy to learn that routing works, it does work for me.
Another trick about this : you can change the routing on a global basis or on a per-pattern basis. This is very cool as it allows you to dynamically decide for every pattern what should go to the master and what should not. To do this, you have to go in the pattern export menu.

About track arming : Yes I actually always disable recording on the track that holds overbridge so that I have no latency but no recording either :slight_smile:

A last trick : I think you know that feeding midi notes on channel 16 to overbridge, allows to command pattern change to digitakt. It is almost perfect to arrange a song with midi notes BUT the pattern change often occurs too late compared to what you would expect : you would expect the pattern change to starting exactly at the beginning of the query note. An easy way to solve this is to open reaper routing menu of the track, and request “playback time offset” with a negative offset. From there the digitakt pattern change is going to be “visually” aligned with the midi notes :-).

#21

Hello @Dissofiddle ,

thank´s for your reply. Yes I know about routing on a per pattern basis, but I could not think of any use for that, at least till now.
Track arming works for me with input set to none. (Just another method :wink:)
I tried the negative delay in the past for the midi track that holds my pattern change notes.
I remember it not working so well in the past, but I will give it another try now.
Will report back.
As a workaround I placed the the item that holds the note for the pattern change in the measure before the actual change should happen.
Having it on the measure that the change should happen is of course better organised and more clear to see what is actually happening.
As you already mentioned visually aligned.

#22

About routing : I often plays with p-lock on pan and LFO on pan. In that case, I keep the track on the master in order to keep stereo and only uses multitracking for “constant panning” tracks (kick, snare, loop/long one shot samples ) for further process.

The negative delay works for me :slight_smile:

#23

Just wanted to share another observation of oddity on the Digitakt/Digitone in my setup.
Yesterday I had both running in idle mode. The where just left running but weren´t really needed or did produce any sound.
This workd for abaout an 1h or so. After that one of them went to power saving mode (display shut down).
My DAW Reaper lost contact to all the connected midi devices. All midi port sent error messages.
I had had that for quite a number of times now.
Windows tells me that there is a problem with the USB connection to the Digitone (and blieve me, USB is well prepared for music making in my system).
My midi keyboard, my X-Touch (fader unit), all the other USB synths,…gone.
This is frustrating because I have to restart the whole computer to get everything back to work.
Does anyone else have similar problems?

#24

Just for the record: It seems that the problem I ran into was produced by the Midi-echo I had on my midi-interface/patchbay (which is a iconnectivity mioXM).
I had a lot of things connected to each other (e.g. letting the midi tracks of the Digitone control FX on itself) which led into hickups and hangs.
I went through this back and forth with the very friendly support (thank you Patrik :smiley:).
The Digitakt does not want to get start/stop/continue commands twice (buttons + midi).
I have now blocked this in my patchbay and it seems to have it cured. No more freeze and loss of my midi setup in Reaper. (Yay… :grinning:)
This is crucial to me because I love the mioXM as it combines the function of a midi interface and the patching.
This makes it possible to fire up all my Elektron stuff without the need of a computer.
Without any routing of midi cables I can then turn to my DAW and record and further develop.
Having the Digitone freeze made this nearly impossible.
There seems to be another bug in Digitone that causes freezes when it receives an all notes off command. (Patrik told me that it occures seldom and random)
I sometimes use this in Reaper and I don´t know if this was also causing my problem

As I like the idea of Dissofiddle to archive these experiences for other users (and myself) I thought I ´d make a note in this thread.

As for Overbridge, I have to say that since version 2.0.6 it works pretty well in Reaper. It does not always sync when I start playback spot on the start of a measure.
It plays perfectly in sync on the next bar when the playback starts 2 quartes before the actual pattern begins.
Chapeau…now it is really usable in Reaper.

Edit: If start playback shortly before the actual bar (a quarter note e.g.) all Elektron devices go along in sync at the start of the next measure.
I made myself a marker that I switch to on my X-Touch.
This is a really convenient way of jumping around in a bigger project.
I have 8 markers right at hand. That´s way enough for a good workflow.

#25

Hello,

Thanks for sharing.
Indeead, sync is working better not too badly, but I experience some jitter.

So for now, as I don’t wanna spend much time on this here is my "old school dj " workaround :

  • no sync on overbridge
  • set digitakt and reaper bpm at the same value
  • In digitakt > midi sync : ENABLE transport receive but DISABLE transport reiceive
  • send midi clock from reaper to digitakt

So now,ONLY transport start/stop are synced, but not the clock.
It works pretty well for recording a few bar loops and make music production (then reaper and digitakt clocks starts to drift, but it lowers jitter).

Otherwise, If I just want to record a performance, I don’t use any sync at all.

That is a stupid workaround, but I am fed up with trying to make things work, I prefer making music :slight_smile:

#26

This is not about sync. As I understand, the track which has Digitakt vsti can receive midi data and send it to Digitakt. However, I cannot make it do so. Even the virtual piano on the Digitakt vsti doesn’t do anything. It seems the midi isn’t taken into the vsti.

If I insert another track and send midi to Digitakt midi port, it makes sounds.

What am I doing wrong here?

Update: I realized that this issue happens irregularly. If I restart Digitakt the device, it starts to respond to the midi. However, there is still one issue. I can record my Digitakt, that is pressing buttons of Digitakt, onto the Digitakt VSTi track as midi and they are on channel 10 – that is auto channel. However, when I play the track, the auto channel midi messages aren’t recognized by the VSTi.

#27

After too many freezes on almost finished tracks in Studio one I installed reaper for a try. Used Reaper years back before i owned Elektron’s gear. My first impression is positive, just drag and drop Elektron’s VST’s,
Expand all individual tracks and it records nicely without additional doubling of track (which I disliked much in studio one) . The first 16 bars record a bit messy but after that it’s reasonably solid. I really like the way how Reaper is handling VST’s . Happy so far

#28

It is nice to hear this !

Reaper has some nice features and is my favorite daw by far.

The only thing working not to well for me is the sync actually.
However my trick is to use no sync but only transport (play/stop) sync using midi port (I wrote this in a my previous post).
It works nicely this way.

1 Like
#29

hi,

A few new discoveries about reaper and overbridge :

  • the render ahead value in the buffering preferences of reaper seems to have an influence on how stable the overbridge sync is racing at the beginning. The longer this value is, the racy it is when playback is started in reaper.
  • Using Count-in (right click on metromome/click icon to access count-in) of 1 or 2 bar improves the synchronisation start
1 Like
#30

Just wanted to say thanks in advance for so much detail on this setup. So far I’ve only recorded into Reaper from audio out on the DT but really keen to be able to mix tracks separately and this super detailed thread gives me loads of things to try out. Thanks for sharing your convo lovely people! I’ll report back if time allows.

#31

hello, is this problem is still accurate?