If you had to start learning music production from zero

The Lounge General Discussion
1

I started tinkering with music production in 2005 after a friend showed me Logic. Since then I’ve had lots of ambitious beginnings and just as many moments where I’d give up and quit due to frustration with the process and my inability to finish 99.9% of the music I started. My stints would last between two and six months, with gaps between them ranging from months to years.

It’s now been 20 years since 2005 and all I have to show for it are a handful of mediocre SoundCloud uploads.

What’s regretful is that over these years I seem to have spent more time on chasing and learning music-making gear than on learning music-making. A lot of kit passed through my hands, but most of it I returned or sold due to guilt about not finishing music, and because creating robust workflows was too much effort compared to reading up on the latest groovebox.

A good analogy would be a painter who knows a whole lot about the abstract ideas around painting and the different brushes and paints available, but who rarely actually sits down to put said paints on canvas because the real process of painting is much more tedious and uncertain than imagining painting. The paint never responds how he thinks it would.

My recent attempt at a track remake revealed just how weak my sound design skills are and how unimaginative my attempts at crafting musical developments are. Luckily, I realize today that no amount of gear can solve the fundamental problem I have which is not actually knowing how to create interesting sounds and combine them into coherent compositions. So I know to look elsewhere for solutions.

Today all I have in my possession are:

  • Ableton Live Suite 12
  • Xfer Serum 2, LFO Tool
  • Elektron Analog Four MKI
  • Fender Telecaster

I am 20 years older and, hopefully, wiser. I’d like to give it another go. I want to do it better this time around. I’d like to not get sucked into gear hunting. I’d like to not quit out of frustration.

I want to start from scratch and unlearn a lot of the bad/lazy habits I’ve picked up. I need to develop a stronger understanding of sound and music and tenacity and focus and craft.

My goal is to consistently finish and release music. The quality of it is a secondary concern for now because I know that if I learn to finish I will be able to gradually improve quality over time.

If you were to walk back to the start line and give it another go, how would you do it better this time?

32 Likes
2

I really appreciate the openness of your post, and I am certain that many people aspiring to being better at creative expression will find a lot to relate to, myself included.

Some practical questions: what kind of music do you want to create? You have a guitar…do you want to perform? Do you want to play keyboards at a high level? Or is your interest more on sequencing, arranging?

Edit: I guess first and foremost, you’ve already nailed it in your post, the shortest answer to your question is Practice.

7 Likes
3

I think that a lot of us struggle with the concept of “setting yourself up for success”. It will be very easy for you to land right back in the same position as before, good intentions and all, if you still feel defeated when you’re in front of your tools.

I’ve been thinking a lot about the concept of having the right gear. The tools that will enable you to build. You cannot turn a paintbrush into a hammer, therefore knowing the nature of your own preferences and creative process is the key to having the right gear.

When you sit down with any of those tools you mentioned, does the interaction inspire you creatively? If not, then you may always struggle with using that tool no matter how nice it is so rather than struggle, pick the one that gives you the most productivity and put your focus into improving your actual music skills using that tool.

If nothing you have there actually clicks for you, then maybe it would be good to reassess the way you do enjoy making music and figure out what is the right gear for you.

8 Likes
4

I’m sure you don’t need anyone to point this out but this right here is an amazing toolkit for making basically anything.

Maybe the easiest way to answer your question is to work backwards from what you want to create. Sort of reverse-engineer what it is you’re hearing in your head.

7 Likes
5

One thing that helped me a lot in the beginning was doing remixes. There’s lots of stems available from remix competitions over the past 20 years or so. Dig in, twist them up.

Why? Because it does a lot of the ground work for you, you task is to transform an already existing, solid idea, turn it into something else, and then finish the piece. You don’t have to think about from zero to hero from the get go, and this makes it an easy way to build up the muscle needed for finishing tracks.

Yes you do also need to create something to complement the original and give it a new sound to your taste. Think of it as training wheels. You can use less and less of the originals as you progress.

It’s fun! It worked for me in the beginning. I did a ton of remixing before I put out any original stuff and I believe it was a great way to learn to finish stuff.

Edit: what I would do differently? I would not be afraid of using samples from sample packs. And I would have tried to remake songs as well in addition to the remixing.

10 Likes
6

Do you get stuck in the 4 bar loop?

7

I similarly had a first go at music around 2005-2008, got bogged down in Ableton and found I just didn’t have time to get lost in software back then, it would take me an age to create just one mediocre track.

Around 2020 after dabbling with volcas and little toy gear I started recording again, but this time with a lofi, DIY , i dont give a f*ck, mindset. It was just for me, my enjoyment, the roughness of the music would be what gives it character. I actually found someone like Daniel Johnston to be quite inspiring for this approach (even though i make techno/acid house).

Anyway I started churning out recorded tracks. And now after a few hundred, maybe thousand recordings since 2020, I feel confident, i’m having fun, and i’m not slowing down.

9 Likes
8

The guitar can be a key to learning the musical bits that electronic instruments don’t provide as easily. Learn to transcribe and transpose songs on the guitar and you’ll have a much better time with making harmonic and tonal material in general.

Your list of gear is nice, anything more is gravy.

4 Likes
9

Don’t dabble around, commit yourself to something early and move on. Create a persona for your humble beginnings and release your mediocre stuff into the world!

That’s how I did it, after only thinking about making music for the vast majority of my life :smiley: I created a youtube channel to upload my tracks and that’s also a great way for me to listen back to my tracks. I very rarely get back to a project that I uploaded and that’s a good thing. Instead of trying to make something perfect, I can move on to create a new track with fresh ideas.

5 Likes
10

I would start taking piano lessons and learning Ableton Live. If possible I would enrol on a music production course.

I would also try and adhere to the philosophy of creating a large sound pool for the each new song before commiting to arranging and mixing rather than my current workflow of initial sound/progression loop with mixing then adding the next stage etc.

2 Likes
11

I want to create ALL kinds of music haha. That’s one of my problems. Dry minimal techno, tech house, melodic techno, IDM/ambient, post rock, singer/songwriter type stuff… I am too scattered. And, funnily enough, none of the stuff I try to write actually sounds like any genre. More like an indistinct collage of my own weird stuff, which I like in a way, but it doesn’t fall into any clear category. I suppose it’s because I don’t know/follow the traditions of any one genre closely enough.

The guitar and keyboard I want to be able to play well enough for generating ideas and producing, but I don’t want to perform. So more interested in bedroom studio recording/arranging/production.

The guitar, for sure. The tactile, immediate, expressive nature of it and the fact that I am more comfortable with it than with keys really makes it my most inspiring instrument. I don’t know how to play any songs, I use it only to compose/jam ideas.

I find Elektron boxes inspiring, also. They, too, have an immediacy and a depth to them that is similar to a “real” instrument. But I get stuck in loops on them. How to create full tracks by stitching together patterns is still a mystery to me. By the time I have more than a few patterns, I forget which is which and in what order to play them/what params to tweak. Maybe it’s the same reason why I don’t really get how to leverage Live’s Session view. I am more of a linear timeline person.

The DAW is great but, man, can it feel tedious and boring sometimes! Despite this, it’s the tool that I owe all of my finished tracks to. It makes it so easy to make things progress with automation. Every time I use it though, I wish there was a way to make it more tactile. I’ve tried various controllers but the mouse seems to be easier and faster most of the time. Not very inspiring though. The DAW always gives me the anxiety of a blank canvas, somehow.

Exactly! I don’t even need the A4, tbh, but I like it so much I don’t want to be without it, even though I don’t use it much.

You’re right. I want to create so many different things that I don’t have a clear direction. Maybe I need to define a project in clear terms to set a guiding trajectory instead of just going with whatever.

Also, huge anxiety trigger for me, the “what it is you’re hearing in your head” :sweat_smile:. I don’t hear original ideas in my head. Ever. Makes me feel absolutely musically talentless, but I feel like I have a good taste in music and generally can tell what combinations of sounds I like/dislike, so maybe not too hopeless. So I am more about responding to real sounds and seeing/shaping what I like. I sometimes wonder if making music would be easier if I could “hear” how parts of a song should develop in my head. But, alas, I can’t do that.

3 Likes
12

Ha! I didn’t mean to make that seem as though it had some pressure attached - just simply “in my head I kind of hear dystopian disco but sludge slow - like 70 bpms” for example.

On that basis, you might take a look at some disco songs and see which elements you find interesting. Maybe there’s something in the swing that lives within the interplay of urgent hihat sitting slightly in front of the beat and heavy kick and snappy snare that live precisely on it. You could drop a disco break into Ableton and see if you can reverse engineer the swing using stock sounds and then drop it to whatever tempo you fancied. Maybe having that as a metronome rather than the uninspiring tick-tock of the standard metronome means that playing your guitar is more interesting and you can build a bass out of a transpose guitar melody - and so on

One thing that a friend of mine swears by - and which has served me really well when I’ve remembered to do it - is the notion of “build the band; make the track” where it’s simply about mixing the colours at the outset (what drum sounds do you want to use? what synth tone? what bass? etc) and then you can sketch things in and see what works (or doesn’t). There’s no rigid framework, but sometimes just grabbing a few things you like that you think work well together and building something out of them as an initial process can be really helpful

3 Likes
13

I think lots of people set themselves up to fail in music production because music remains a mystery to them. If I were you, I’d seek out a good guitar teacher for in-person lessons in whatever style of music you like. Learn the fundamentals of music, guitar technique, and a ton of tunes. After a few years of regular lessons and practice you will have skills that will last you a lifetime, and all the fundamentals you learn about music will help you create whatever kind of music you want.

6 Likes
14

  • I won’t smoke weed while I’m making music.

  • I will impose a planning with different specific sessions (free creation, music theory, sampling, parameterization, etc.) to optimize time and progress everywhere.

7 Likes
15

i would strictly limit the number of samples/presets i use. spend time selecting/making very strong ones, covering every broad function (eg. 10 kicks, 10 hi hats, 10 bass sounds, 10 lead sounds, etc). once this very limited but very strong basic sonic palette is made, stick to it (ofc you can still add fx and so on to suit the tracks). doing this majorly cuts decision fatigue and points you towards your own taste and sound.

10 Likes
16

It sounds like you’ve refound some drive, which is probably one of the most important things. Hold onto that!

I’d say just have fun, have some sessions where you just play and record what you’re doing.

Maybe don’t focus on ‘tracks’ or compositions initially - begin a material creation and collection phase - guitar riffs, leads and pads on the analog four, beats, doing things in Live.

If the drive is there, then just focus on the things you mentioned in your post and output stuff.

Soon enough there’ll be a mass of material, you’ll gravitate toward things which resonate, other less useful sessions archive away, or perhaps mangle and look at from a different angle.

Then eventually something will crystallise - a phrase, a riff, a bedrock of some recording and then when it lands… push it until it’s done. Then push it more! Then polish.

Sometimes it’s great to just spew it all out, carve out 10 to 15 minutes of material, then chisel it back to 5 or 7. Or 3.

You mentioned the painter - but painters ahead of major work will do lots of tests like this - colour palette, field sketches, basic prototypes and initial versions, and then commit to the final mix of materials and a version that becomes the finished work.

Enjoy it man! :slight_smile:

3 Likes
17

For me it was finding the correct niesche i like most. I started in the 90ties with Eye Q , Harthouse stuff, and then got into psytrance, then into Afterhour Techno, which was psychdelic downtempo, psybient.

I personally found my thing in psytechno, which combines both intrests, and allows for experimental sound design. There are specific signature sounds in both generes, which allows for a relativly broad palette. That is the thing i find quiete intresting - combining different things to something that suits you.

I picked the strongest picks, where i was most influenced by, and what speaks to me. I did struggle, untill i decided this is it. (Psytechno also often includes 60ties /70ties progressive rock elements, like guitar - its not a central element, but other stuff like violin, keys are also used quiete often.) The creative freedom is important to me, with still having focus - and its dance oriented.

So as others have said it, its good to narrow things down to something you really like, and decide about 1-2 things, that make it defined.

Serum can do nearly everything, but you need to learn how to make it do what you want. Sure there are other tools, that are better for a specific task, but imho its better to work on a single synth for a longer period to know it inside out, instead of going for multiple tools. (Even if i go for another vst, i try first in serum , to see how it goes, and if several attempts fail, i will try it with Zebra. )
Also i make a lot of sounds, that i render - if they dont work - i delete them and make another one, dont get too attached , its a part of a puzzle.)

There also different approaches - you can make quick tracks - and only flesh them out, when you see its actually working. But at a certain point, you have to come back, and do the actual work. Just creating loops, where you dont come back to make it into something is a pitfall here.

This guy made a excellent libary for OG serum:

i didnt try it in serum 2, but maybe you can create a similar libary with your own sources. Such a task can for sure improve your sounds quiete a bit. Wavetables from your guitar for example.

1 Like
18

I had Ableton first but didn’t get on with it, it felt too big and I didn’t enjoy using Push at all. bought a Hydrasynth but again, no background knowledge of synthesis so sold it on quickly (every intention of rebuying though, discovered wavetables are my jam). A few years in Modular taught me a lot. I found adding functions in pieces really helped develop a mental map of what was happening under the hood. I’m not geared towards reading in depth and found practical tinkering the best route to gaining the small degree of competency I have.

Also, less is more. Don’t try and use everything all
At the same time. A drum machine/sampler a synth and some effects is the most fun and often the most productive.

2 Likes
19

Begrudgingly, I think I’d learn how to play more songs. I’ve always found writing more fun than reciting – like you, I’m not too interested in performing. But I definitely took the long way around in terms of recognising certain patterns that occur in popular music (e.g. common borrowed chords).

(These days, I use Hook Theory to study songs. And Open Music Theory is a great wee resource for theory related to popular music.)

The other thing is just more close listening. I’m better these days at asking myself questions such as, Why is this interesting to me? Why did they make these decisions? Which parts of this are still a mystery to me? Developing an ear for craft and sound design will require a good bit of close listening, I think.

One thing I think I got right, though, is that I rarely made any of this a chore for myself. I’m still interested in this after all this time, and I feel like I’m improving year by year. Try to find a way to keep it engaging for yourself, however that looks for you.

4 Likes
20

Hearing ideas is imho overrated. I do, but my goldfish mind forgets them faster than I can get my ass down to the studio.

And once there, even if I were to remember, I’m not melodically proficient enough to put note in mind to note on paper :frowning:

5 Likes