How to save songs in DAWless setup

The Lounge General Discussion
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Dear Elektronauts

I recently got back into music. This time with a DAWless setup:

OP-Z (step components)
OPSIX (keys/sound generator)
Blofeld (keys/sound generator)
Squarp Pyramid (my part-time sequencer)
Deluge (usually my sequencer)

However, I have a hard time getting around a proper system of saving my songs.

Usual workflow:

Recording midi events from a synth and recording its midi to Deluge or Pyramid - playing back the midi notes/events in a loop, hearing it on the synths.
Doing some edits on Deluge or Pyramid
Sending some of the midi to OP-Z and working on that.
Saving the song after a while on the Deluge, with the correct midi channel and program change number.

On the next day, wanting to open up the song on the Deluge or Pyramid but what did I call the song? Which version was the best and the one I want to continue working with?
With my new “save with date, name of gear used” song name, found the correct song. Just unsure which version I liked the most.
Opening up a couple of versions and deciding which one to go forward with.
Wanting to change something on the OP-Z - but which pattern did I use, was it saved like the midi I recorded on the Deluge/Pyramid or has the OPZ auto-saved to something else before I turned it off?
Finding the “propably correct” pattern with the “propably correct” version and doing some edits.
Hmm… I’m tired - I’m not in the mood today anyways.

On the next day - which song was it? Ah, created two days ago - so the 22/3 :slight_smile: And the name indicated that I used the OP-Z? But what pattern? Ah, I remember :slight_smile:
Working on the OP-Z and now it sounds nice for now.
I need another track on the song, or perhaps another midi track sending to the same synth.
Working on the Deluge, finding some good notes to add.
Now that track sounds quite good, but I want to try it with another synth. Copying the track on the Deluge to another track and muting the first one.
Changing the midi channel on the copied track from OPSIX to Blofeld.
Playing around with the different of my presets and finding a good candidate. Doing some edits and saving the preset to a new place. Adding the Blofeld PC to the Deluge midi track and saving - version propably 11 or whatever.
Listening to the song the rest of the evening looping.

Starting on a new track the next day - doing kind of the same thing.

After e.g. two weeks, looking through the songs on the Deluge and Pyramid with the names like “DDMMYY OP6 OPZ Melody, 11” and not remembering anything anymore. So happy that the Deluge now can save to folders instead of one long list.
Opening some random song - was it correct, did it really sound that way? Or wasn’t the delay sounding a bit different? Maybe it’s because I opened the last version and not the best version :slight_smile: Trying some different versions: 9, 10, 11…16. Well, the 14 was the best.

Thinking: “why don’t I have a playlist on my phone with all the different songs and a full description on how to recreate them?”. And “what would actually work for me, since I don’t have any overview of what I’m doing”?

Ok, that’s just an example :slight_smile: When I also use the Pyramid and mix in between the two sequencers because they can do stuff that the other one really can’t do it’s getting even more complicated :slight_smile:

But seriously, how do you manage songs on your DAWless setup?

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I was in the same boat as you for a long time, until I just embraced the thing I didn’t want to for a long time. Printing everything to audio.

I’ve tried physical and digital notes, naming frameworks, taking pictures of analog synth settings, you name it. It just killed the initiative for me. Recording either full songs, stems or loops and then arranging them is the way to go. Just remember to name stuff properly and build a framework. Bpm is essential.

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convert them to a Wav file. :wink:

srsly though… you can save all the patches of gear that has memory. sysex dumps, samples etc… and for analog things w/o memory you just have to learn them really well so you can get back to any sounds you’ve made.

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This a real problem.

I love my Deluge but it’s problematic going back to old stuff.

I will say the Hapax has made it a whole lot easier. Still takes some organising though!

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I will add that the other way to go is using just one device per song (the sketch). This also helped with my GAS as I swore to myself to only buy gear that allows for at least moderate full song creation on that one device. I still have a permanent desk setup, but it is limited to two hardware devices, a keystep pro and an ipad where i print to. I then mostly arrange the song on either an M8 or in Koala on my phone, and then if I want to, I sometime finalize in Live.

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Oo-eeh that was long. Sorry I didn’t read it, but based on assumptions of what the content is, I would write down things, make note of things, keep all info pertaining to what machine, patterns, banks, presets, etc, belong to one song. Use a physical notepad to easily edit with a pencil and eraser, transfer to a note app or text editor. Be consistent with that, make it a habit. Be free to use your gear any way you want and not strictly use gear A for drums, gear B for bass because that’s boring and predictable. Just record information about what it is that you are doing. Journal that shit down!

I like the advice of “one machine/one song”. Now that I think about it, it is what I do most of the times with hardware gear. Good one @Gral_Kerkila.

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Why is that ? Because the Deluge was sequencing other things?

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Yes. Sequencing a lot of stuff, also before community Grid mode, so a large project from a few months ago seems like a confusing mess of colour.

Obviously half an hour with the song and its playable again. But I wanted to play songs back to back quickly.

The tracks-horizontally paradigm is far better imo, as I then keep the same structure of tracks every time, and all tracks fit on one page (if I stick to 16).

Grid mode on Deluge didn’t exist when I bought my Hapax, and to be fair the Deluge has had some stuff added like automation view etc.

However its far easier to organise on the Hapax.

Btw, @feldman, thats my advice on your OP, the answer for me was have a fixed structure to my setup, and have a good sequencer that sets up as much of my equipment as possible automatically when it loads a song.

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Make audio recordings of the mix at the end of every jam. Listening to these away from the synths can give a different perspective.
I enjoy having these ideas (even little ones) in audio.
I also prefer to sample the separate synthparts so you can always proceed with less gear. I use SP-404 or MC-707 for this. MPC is good for this.
Write notes down in a notebook. Physical writing is a skill that is good to keep.

Audio was always the way to go before midi and I love capturing sound into an audiofile, because that is how I started to get serious with music. Midi is nice to chain stuff together and work out a song but it should not stop at that stage imo. Just develop the notion that you are not finished when it’s not nailed down into an audio file.

And when you really want to expand the track into a full production I would go to a Daw.

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TLDR: Stick to one main sequencer, work on only one song at a time. Record three versions. Move on.

I also keep a list of what equipment is in what midi channel and try and keep that permanent, using programme change on that channel to bring up the right sounds. Using multiple sequencers does mean things get more complicated quickly, so having one consistently used as a master helps. I’ll take notes too.

There’s no right way to be creative, but @Feldman, what you describes sounds complicated and like creating loops rather than songs.

Sure, I’m mainly polishing turds, but having committed them to audio, I’ve finished the song and can move on, so it’s a fun and pretty productive way of working. When I return to the recordings, months later, I have better perspective and can go on and further spoil them with my inept ‘mastering’.

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