If I had song mode I could dicks around on it without having to turn on other stuff and make a real song like a peice of art… I just wanna have fun!!
2 Likes
That’s similar to my experience, the day I started to compose/arrange outside of my DT/DN was the day when I started to question whether that interim step of making patterns on them was even necessary. It felt like a pretty expensive sketch box at that point.
I think the Elektrons shine when you devote a lot of attention and effort into them and treat them like your favorite instrument. I could never figure out how to use them as just a supportive role in my studio. If I were truly into playing live, I would probably use the DT as the centerpiece of the performance and practice practice practice, since that’s part of the fun for an audience to see you perform. But in the studio, I just want to make music.
3 Likes
This thread just makes my appreciation for the OT and it’s arranger mode stronger.
As someone said earlier, I just wish it was a little easier to turn on and off during a performance.
I set up the arranger so it plays a portion of songs or a set, then stops or goes into looping a pattern.
From there I will disengage the Arranger and freestyle it until I decide to start it back up.
Rinse and repeat.
It would be cool to see Elektron incorporate the arranger in newer boxes, or update it a little.
2 Likes
A blackbox pattern is like an Elektron pattern, but with 16 tracks instead of say the Digitakt’s 8 or the Syntakt’s 12.
There are 16 patterns in one blackbox project. A limitation, sure, but each pattern can contain up to 256 steps and span between 1/64th to 8 bars as time signatures.
Each track can be a loop, one shot or polyphonic multi-sample patch. So that’s quite a pattern.
Clips are batches of patterns which you turn on or off. It’s not muting, it’s launching or stopping, so envelopes, slice behaviour, polyphony and stuff react accordingly.
A clip is a set amount of bars in length. You can let it run its course, at which point the next clip activates. You can jump between them in any order, and you can set them to loop.
Patterns don’t relaunch if the next clip contains a pattern already running, which means that you can set this up as a master conductor of sorts, and create behaviours that make for very evolving and varied structures.
1 Like
Yep. OT got something that’s more than just chained patterns and mute groups. In some ways, it’s the most ambitious kit Elektron’s ever made. And it’s still selling.
2 Likes
Thank GAWD they are still current, it’s the heart of my rig.
I’d LOVE a second one!
1 Like
Say it with me:
Elektron boxes are performance tools not compositional arrangers
I get why people would want these features but it’s not what the devices are made for or how they’re intended to be used - that’s why Elektron don’t add it.
If you’re not careful Elektron will lose focus.
Monomachine and Machinedrum had pretty powerful song modes. Perhaps they’ve already lost their way.
6 Likes
I buy gear for what it can do and what was promised and then I make music with it or sell it off if it doesn’t work for me. I don’t sit around wishing a piece of gear would do something it doesn’t. If ya’ll want a song mode or arrangement mode, buy a piece of gear that has it. shrug
3 Likes
The OT seems to disagree completely
I’d also add that Arranger Mode never stopped me from a “performance”
4 Likes
Yea and the OT seems to be very much an exception to the rule - and given that they implemented that feature long before they didn’t in like… 6 other boxes? It’s clear that it’s an intentional design decision.
I’m sure it wouldn’t - and having a joystick and a foot paddle control in your car wouldn’t stop you from using your steering wheel but it would make it more complicated to develop and maintain and contrary to popular belief giving users more choice doesn’t always benefit them.
1 Like
The OT is full of strange exceptions.
It definitely seems clear Elektron have a different vision moving forward, and I guess that’s why they made an OT MKII.
I couldn’t agree more,
more options is not always more productive.
1 Like
Be interesting to see what they do with the next iteration of the Octatrack, whatever shape it takes!
I also get why folks would want ‘that 1 feature’ that would make their device perfect for them, I get it.
I see, thanks for the explanation.
I’ve just watched Loopop’s video about this and you can record your on/off actions but I didn’t see a way to edit what you’ve done. If you made a mistake you need to do it all over again? or is there a piano roll where you can see when each pattern is starting/stopping?
You can play all patterns at the same time or is there a limit?
(because 16 tracks * 16 patterns playing at the same time… that’s quite a lot!)
That can be useful!
I didn’t really look into the Blackbox because I thought it would be like using an iPad and a DAW (no p-locking right?) but it seems quite powerful.
Now, having something similar in an Elektron box would be hard for the analog machines (there’s a physical limit so playing 16 patterns of 16 tracks is impossible) but could be possible for the digital ones.
Compared to the actual Elektron song mode:
- Play multiple patterns at the same time
- Start each patterns at different time
- Allow a common track between patterns to keep on going even with a new pattern start.
- add a section container
Am I right?
I guess having a Sequencer track with a piano roll view would be nice.
You could live record the pattern on/off and then edit if needed.
I guess you would need to actively set tracks that should not re-trigger with a pattern start.
1 Like
I would love having a song mode on the digitakt too !
However, I am ok with no song mode since we can program patterns change with midi (program changes on auto-channnel) or overbridge (midi notes on channel 16 through the overbridge plugin).
I find it a good workaround either to playlive (with another sequencer sending program change) or to program in DAW. In the DAW, I find it convenient as I create midi items in my daw and arrange them like lego, which gives me a macroscopic view on the song 
Also, with overbridge total recall thingy, you can save a complete arragement with this.
The only thing is that your need the overbridge sync to work properly and as pattern change tends to arrive too late, your daw needs to be able to apply a negative delay on the playback of the items (containing the pattern change information). When doing this, it kinda feel like a software sequencer vsti you would program from your computer.
Note : I do this on reaper, and it works quite well
Yep, you got it. And yes, you can play all sixteen patterns at once, theoretically, though in terms of CPU, you can’t if there’s a lot going on in each pattern.
And nope, if you make mistakes, you can’t edit - that’s a bummer. So you need to redo that clip to get it right. Slightly frustrating.
The OT can achieve the same results as the blackbox by use of this method -
Assign any samples on a track that you want to run free outside the pattern structure, to Plays Free. Typically, long ambient loops that you don’t want synced to pattern switching, drums or anything. That’s how I’d use it anyway.
Let each Scene be the equivalent of tracks going on or off, by dropping their volume to zero if they’re off, if you want them to keep running but not just be heard. If you actually want to retrigger them, just do so from whatever pattern in your chain you want them to retrigger. It’s a bit crude but it achieves the same effect.
Cross-fading gives you the option to decide how fast or slow you want the transitions from quiet to active go, and if you want it abrupt, just apply the new scene to the current one you’re on, for an immediate transition.
Since the OT can do so much more, this would just be the basic setup to achieve the same kind of mix of synced and free running samples, and yet put them in a structure that does things beyond the singular pattern.
The Arranger mode is great but a bit messy, when I was on the OT, I found that just setting this up to let me manually play through the song, was almost easier (and more fun).
1 Like
I’ve been using the AR pads in mute mode this way. One pattern where I mute/unmute tracks and use fill to change them but being able to start a track independently from the pattern could be nice like having a mute mode and a trigger mode. With 12 tracks, it’s quite fun but with the 4 tracks of the A4/DN, you need to use sound-lock if you want to create something a bit complex, that doesn’t really work anymore…
I would be happy with the OT song mode as is but in all the machines. If we could live record pattern changes (then edit if necessary), it would make life easier though (programming the arranger is not really fun…).
Having both analog and digital boxes, number 1 in my post might be hard but 2 and 3 could be possible I think but well, it seems they really don’t want to put even a simple song mode so…
1 Like
Yep, this or something equivalent. It wouldn’t take much.
I guess that’s the point as well. We’re not looking for the Logic timeline here or Ableton clip launching.
Just a few unlocks to stuff that just can’t be done now, at all. Most likely, three or four well aimed features, that would enable so much.
I’m pretty sure this is how Elektron sees it as well, which is why they’re shy to get this in there. Because it has to be the right three or four features, to not mess with what’s already awesome.
Please excuse the muddled half-baked ideas of a tired person. Sorry if an aside to main topic.
This, plus maybe a sort of 3rd category who want to welcome algorithmic, semi-generative aspects…but in a structure-able fashion? I’ve been seeking this in the DAW environment too. So, I’ve got a cool Turing Machine thing rolling but how do I move forward…clip automation to dictate when to randomise.
Haven’t had the coffees to string this into a strong narrative sorry, but while considering coming up against the limitations of patterns, chaining, arranger modes etc, I’m coming around to the idea that I welcome variety in how I sequence. I might want x0x style drum sequencing, Turing Machine ability to lock something random in and/or drift away from etc etc. A way of laying that out start-to-end would be cool while we’re pontificating.
1 Like
(As someone that is on the receiving end of tasks that often have the word ‘Just’ added to the front of them to mitigate the work involved I couldn’t resist calling that one out 
)
1 Like