Help me pick the right gear!

Elektron Gear
#1

Hi everyone, apologies for the long first post!

I’ve been reading this forum for a while and found it invaluable - Especially in helping me towards solving the problem I’m facing. I figured this was specific enough to ask for some advice. I’ve thought this through a lot but can’t make up my mind.

In the last year, I’ve been lucky to pick up a DT and learned how to use it/push it as much as possible, I love making music with it. If I had to keep one thing in my studio, I’d stick with the Digitakt.

My goal is to build a flexible setup that works for writing music at home, both for my own techno/ebm/industrial-ish stuff, plus more ambient and experimental music.

However, most of the music I make is with my post-punk band - We’re (slowly) writing a new LP and incorporating drum machine and synth parts alongside our setup of drums/bass/guitar and vocals. I’m the guitarist in the band, and currently switch between playing electronics and guitar - sometimes both in the same song. We also play live/tour a fair bit (pre pandemic) so whatever we use has to work for writing/recording and touring.

over the last few months I’ve also added a DN, which I’m still learning but feel as connected to as the DT, and an A4mkII. The A4 is also great, a bit of a deeper dive than the other two and works well for the ambient/weird music I make, but I can’t really get it to make the sounds I want for my band or the harder techno-based music.

One of the reasons I got the A4 was to have a song mode and performance controls, to free me up from the electronics when I’m playing guitar. Sometimes I’m going to want to just hit play and let the song happen, with the odd parameter tweak here and there. I’ve tried some setups of all 3 doing this and it works, but I’m still struggling to sequence whole songs easily or in quite the way I want.

My current MIDI setup is A4 -> DT -> DN. At home, audio is either sent from DT -> DN -> A4 -> headphones, or each separately in to a mixer if I want an FX send (Line6 HX Stomp for techno, although this is my guitar FX in the band).

Here’s the problem I’m facing:

Do I a) Admit defeat with the A4, sell it + the DT and ‘upgrade’ to an OTmkII. I think the OT does everything I need - possibly better. An OT + DN setup is clean, simple to move around and one less box to worry about on the road. For some live stuff, streaming out a whole backing track would be sick. I could possibly even route a click out to the drummer from the OT.

Or do I b) stick with what I’ve got knowing that I have a huge amount of fun with the DT + DN, and push myself to figure out the A4 as a master ‘song controller’. I know if I work hard enough at it, I can find some sounds in the A4 that might work for me.

I want to say again here, I love the DT workflow and I’d be sad to lose all the bits of projects I’ve built up so far. However, if OT + DN is the way to go, I could live with moving samples across and remaking my sequences.

I know the OT is a steep learning curve, but I have a decent background in music tech (I work in a university setting in this area) so I can put the time in and learn it.

TL;DR - Do I trade my DT + DN + A4 for OT + DN? I would really miss the DT a lot, but will I like the OT more?

Thanks for reading. Let me know your experiences and what you think!

R

#2

I’d take sometime and consider your options but yeah it sounds like the A4 is not for you. I’d start with cutting that loose.

Another machine to consider is the Rytm, it’s not JUST a drum machine… this thread would be a good read for you:
https://www.elektronauts.com/t/analog-rytm-standalone-thoughts/146767

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#3

If you’re set on the OT, keep the DN and DT, too. That’s my favorite trinity out of all of the combos. The OT handles longer sampling, mangling, midi, and song mode, the DN and DT do all the stuff they’re good for.

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#4

This would an ideal option I think, however I don’t have any spare cash to add in to the A4 sale for an OT, and I wonder if the DT would be redundant?

#5

If you’re really enjoying the DT and feel like you would miss it if it was gone, I think that’s a great sign that you should keep working with it! The OT is amazing and extremely flexible/powerful/all those things, but ultimately it’s just a lot different than the DT and may not be something you gel with if you’re already really enjoying the DT workflow.

To put that another way, I think the OT might be a little frustrating if you try to impose a DT-style workflow on it. You can definitely get your muscle memory going and do all of your sampling/sequencing/etc. really quickly on the OT, but there are just a lot of very immediate parameters on the DT that require extra steps on the OT. So if you want to get an OT, I think you should get it because you want to dive into the OT world and not as a kind of replacement for the DT, if that makes sense.

(Also I’m pretty sure there are some buggy things with the OT being MIDI master and driving pattern changes on the DN/DT, but you might want to research that more.)

Last thing: Before you ditch the A4, I just want to say how much I love the drum and percussion sounds you can get on that thing. Blows my mind every time. Would highly recommend checking out the drum preset packs here:

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#6

Maybe get a OT MKI?

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#7

Go with the connections… Don’t lose those chasing something that might not be a good fit. Keep productivity high by minimising gear learning and making music instead!

I’d suggest keeping DT and DN. Sack off the A4 and avoid OT for now. Maybe find a different box instead…

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#8

i’d say lose the A4, my hatred for that things knows no bounds! personally i find it extremely difficult to use more than 2 elektrons in a live setup. shoot for as little redundancy as possible.

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#9

Amen!

#10

I sometimes think about upgrading to an OT but haven’t found the right justification yet. I also feel like what the DN offers won’t be as easily replicated by samples alone. Since you seem to want backing tracks the OT does seem ideal, so it seems reasonable to ditch the A4 and DT for an OT but keep the DN. If you pick an OT up b stock you should be able to fund its purchase with the sale of the A4 and DT alone…

Edit: I have spent many years fantasizing about the one box solution. OT seems as close as I’ve ever found but I also hate the cycle of constant buying and selling so I’ve committed to what I have. Just want to say I feel your pain!

#11

This seems like a thorny problem with no easy answer.

One possibility: look at swapping the A4 and DT for the ARMKII, unless you think you’d have the same song mode problems as you’re already having with the A4.

Who knows? The ARMKII might sound “dirtier”, heavier and more organic for your industrial stuff.

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#12

One thing: if you love your DT, don’t sell it. You will regret it. This box have a soul and throwing it away will make you feel bad.
I think you can sell your A4 .

If you started with your first Elektron last year and you already have the best combo they made (DT+DN) I think you should stick with theses 2 cutes machines and try harder.

It’s real instruments like any other, the learning curve is quick because workflow is streamlined but they are 2 very deep machines and you have to spend many times and gain lot of experiences to truly master all the tips and tricks.

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#13

not at all. I have the DT, DN and OT and it is so nice to have the DT just handle drum detail. LIke…so nice.
It leaves more tracks open on the OT for resampling, neighbor tracks, whatever…

Thats good advice.
While the Ot does have a reputation for having a steep learning curve, its not the nightmare people make it out to be. Once you grasp some fundamental structural differences between the Digi’s and the OT ( Digis came later, more streamlined, but OT makes sense), like the slots list, record buffers, and how the project takes precedence over the pattern, its not all that dissimilar from the DT.
Streaming long backing tracks from a Static machine? Done!
If you HAVE to sell the DT in order to get the OT and you dont want to let the DT go, dont do it.
wait. save up the money.
Look around for a used MKI if possible.
or keep your eye our for a used MKII. Thats how i got mine. and i got it from Elektronauts.
local sale.
All that being said, the DT DN combo is absolutely sublime. nothing wrong there. if you really need the arranger mode of the OT, thats understandable in your situation as a guitar player/ electronics operator.
Most importantly, take your time with the decision.
and i wish you well!

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#14

If you absolutley possitively need a song mode, then that should be your priority.

Doesnt really matter what synth or sampler you get, if they dont address your priority.

The answer to me seems pretty obvious. Learn how to make the harder sounds with the gear you have. All of which is perfectly capable at doing so.

You have a machine with song mode. You have a synth and sampler to make sounds. Go forth and make music.

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#15

…a4 is a beauty…and in many points even way deeper than the ot…
and also way more a studio machine…

i don’t see ur point in getting rid of the takt also…
u can easily swap the a4mk2 for an octatrack…

which is the only option for performing live for real the way u wanna do it…
tone AND takt will serve u perfectly hosted by an ot…

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#16

I’m trying to understand the hate for the A4, even more for techno.

What’s up about the A4 sound that seems to elicit such a love/hate reaction? I had some rough patches (pun not intended, hehe) with mine but the more I put time into it the more sounds I find that I didn’t know it could make. Is it about this deepness and lack of sweet spots?

#17

Personally if I was to combine electronics and guitar in a band setting I would setiously consider a mpc of the new generation.

The mpc would accomodate the song mode you would need for the digitakt. And does a whole lot of other stuff, that in my opinion works better in a band setting: longer patterns, being able to record midi in a proper way if you want to prepare yourself, multiple outputs with click tracks if needed, etc etc.

My background is making electronic music at home and also incorperating this in a band where I also play guitar. I have tried the octatrack, currently own a digitakt plus mpc live. So much better in this context in my opninion…

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#18

the mpc argument remains a good argument in this context…

#19

Thanks For everyone’s advice so far - lots of really helpful angles. Ultimately I’ve really fallen in with the Elektron way of programming, so I hadn’t considered the MPC Live at all. I’m looking it up now, it looks sick! I have been enjoying making music by ear/being away from a screen, although the Live II looks really well put together.

Looks like I’m going to need to spend some more time thinking this through!

If anyone else has a view on this I’m all ears.

Cheers,

R

#20

I have the A4, DN, DT combo, and I love the depth of the A4’s engine, the performance macros and chaining everything off it’s song mode… but I never play live. Of the :3lektron: boxes I’ve used, it feels the most fidley (and so least performance oriented).

On the other hand, the thing we’re all looking for — a “brain” to glue together the DT and DN and some sort of performance/song mode — I don’t think it exists. The A4 sort of fits as does the OT and AR… but all in different non-overlapping ways. The frustration you feel with the A4 not fitting ideally you’ll probably also feel for the OT only you’ll be adding streaming samples instead of subtractive synth sounds. Maybe that’s a good trade? But I’d hate to sacrifice the DT in the bargain.

Looking outside of :3lektron:, the closest thing I’ve found to a brain that fits with The Elektron Way is the Polyend Tracker. It’s small, affordable, great for techno and ambient, can send out all sorts of MIDI, and a fantastic sketch pad on the road… but while quite sturdy it feels more fragile than, say, a DT. I don’t know that I’d gig with it.

I wonder if some programmable midi foot switch that lets you macro up what you need for live but focus in on your DT+DN passion otherwise would fit the bill?

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