Heat Output is Low in Volume

[DaveMech]

Yeah I know there are multiple settings to accommodate this. If you use clean boost there’s not really a problem because you can set the drive high enough for the volume to get a proper boost. I’m using saturation however and only want a little bit of drive. Unfortunately the output level in that situation is lower then what comes in. input gain is at high to make sure the levels come in loud enough, preset volume is at max level, master is at max level. So that’s really not where the problem is.

I do have to plug into pioneer mixers most of the time unfortunately but that’s not the reason the output is low.

[dtr]

There are many discussions of the AH’s levels in the forum. It seems it was designed with large headroom margins. In situations where it is returned on a mixer channel with input gain control it is easily adjusted for. But when that s not available I can see how that can get tricky.

@DaveMech Are you saying that when you run your AH output into a Pioneer DJ mixer channel you don’t have enough gain available on the Pioneer to compensate?

[DaveMech]

Well, I have to set the gain very very high. Last time I had to set it to max and it still wasn’t enough unless I added more drive on the AH and therefore adding more saturation then I would like so I ended up just removing it from the chain that perfomance. Not fond of running my signal through a pioneer mixer, let alone setting the gain on it to the max.

Of course all this wouldn’t matter much if you have a proper sound guy that will set the levels higher at the final stage. But most of the time there’s not such person present Not playing in bigger clubs…

So it’s a combination of DJ’s slamming their records into the reds + AH low output + no sound guy = screwed.

I just bought a second hand mkii from a friend (has yet to arrive) since I heard it was improved a little. And of course because of the screen and buttons matching better with the rest of my setup :P. Anyway, to be sure I’m going to do some AB testing.

[thoughtstarZ]

Well, you don’t really need a sound guy to do this. Just find out where the mixer is, run a cable to the main mixer and get a friend to turn you up until it sounds good (also see trim knob ). But I think I get what your saying…Maybe they don’t even have a mixer. The only thing they have is a Pioneer DJ mixer? And powered speakers?.. Well, yeah, barrow a small mixer from someone to gain your stuff. Hopefully the MK2 gives you what you need.

[DaveMech]

Yeah exactly sometimes there just is no mixer after the pioneer. Sometimes it’s somewhere in the back. Sometimes it’s just packed, or you only have about 10 minutes to set everything up etc. You can’t rely on that.

Yeah I’m going to see how the mkii is a bit better in that regard. Otherwise a small mixer or some type of signal booster would be fine. Footprint just has to be as small as possible. Rather not add more stuff

[dtr]

You re using a DB4 mixer i assume? Too bad it doesn t have a master channel fx insert. On the xone:96 i wouldnt have this problem because it does have the insert, and level control after that.

I m planning to add an RNC compressor at the end of my live signal chain, on the master insert. Maybe you could do something like that to level your signal. Even if you don t compress (much) you can use the make up gain. It s smaller than a mixer.

[DaveMech]

Yeah unfortunately DB4 hasn’t.
I did have a RNC but sold it again. If there is no simple stereo level booster with a small footprint on the market I might buy it again.

[cold_fashioned]

Dave,

Did you ever sort out your volume issues with the Heat? I wonder if part of it has to do with impedance balanced I/O on the heat vs. fully balanced I/O on your mixer? I just discovered some strange behavior with some of my elektron gear (Digitone / Model:Cycles) and my mixer (SSL SiX) that I think is due to the impedance balanced output of the elektrons. What tipped me off was when I hit the “Mono” button on the mixer, the synth connected via TRS cables had a lot of signals drop out (i.e. phase cancellation). The synth connected via TS cables remained just fine. Anyway, that’s my issue to troubleshoot. I’m curious though, whether you have discovered anything with your signal path using the Analog Heat. Cheers.

[tnussb]

@cold_fashioned

I think is due to the impedance balanced output

That’s one major difference between impedance and fully balanced connections: with a fully balanced connection you get an additional +6db volume boost, because the receiving side sums up twice the same signal (volume gets doubled).

[natehorn]

I’m just experimenting with using an Analog Heat as a master insert for a XONE:PX5 and coming across this issue - it’s sucking volume out of the mix which is quite annoying and not something easily resolved in my setup.

The funny part of this story is that I bought this mixer in part due to your execellent videos @DaveMech ! Didn’t expect to find you here talking about the Heat

Was the MKII an improvement at all? I’m also using a MKI.

[DaveMech]

Nice wonderful mixer!

Yeah so mkii doesn’t make a huge difference if at all. I’m still on the xone db4 and the px5 went back to A&H so can’t check it again for you, but currently I use heat on the master out. Making sure that the input is hitting around 80%. Master volume and preset volume to max. Circuit I use now is clean boost with a pretty high drive. Making sure it doesn’t clip on the output. This works and wherever I plug into will have a gain / master volume to control my entire output signal.

So make sure preset volume is set to max. Easy to miss (amp page). And on the px5 just crank that master volume further if needed. It’s what it’s there for. Should provide you with a loud enough signal really.

[natehorn]

Yea to be fair with the right settings I can get very close - it’s as you say earlier in the thread, if you’re wanting to ride the drive quite delicately you notice the drop - with certain settings it’s a non-issue as it’s certainly capable of being loud - it just has to be quite wet.

Love your work with the DB4 its a very creative mixer!

[natehorn]

So I was just fiddling a bit more with my chain and noticed something kind of odd. Even with the Heat deactivated (i.e. bypass) there is a big volume drop. I can understand where some headroom might be created in the effect circuit - but why is volume being lost through the bypass?

[tipple]

Just to add more info to this thread, I’ve realised mine does the same. So I did a few tests. 808 into the Heat (MK2) with the output going to channel 2 on the mixer. At the same time I’ve got Overbridge in Ableton processing the same 808 but outputting to channel 1, so I can see the difference in levels on the mixer. Through Overbridge the 808 is clipping its so loud but through the input/outputs (none Overbridge) the signal is barley there. Whats even stranger is that the input/output levels on the Heat are the same as its the same signal going in and out.

[tendingtropic]

ever solved this? does the new heat also have this?

[Tapepusher]

Do you find you find that it’s hard to bring up the overall volume of the AH when using it softly/in a subtle way? I don’t necessarily want to drive it much.

Ppl say it has a huge volume dip unless you drive it and that they have to boost the volume after with something else. This is the only thing keeping me from grabbing one for my DAWless setup as I want it at the EOC

[Quassatio]

When sound passes through Analog Heat it becomes significantly quieter. (

[tubefund]

It’s no problem in a dawless setup if the heat is the end of chain before a mixer or interface with input gain control. It is a problem on a insert bus of the master channel of a mixer. You need to compensate the gain loss with drive, and that amount of drive doesn’t match the users sound preference for that particular patch in most cases. If someone knows a affordable tiny stereo pre-amp to connect between output that doesn’t affect sound quality im all ears.