Global FX/Mix settings are weird!

Elektron Gear Digitone/Digitone Keys
#1

OS 1.41
I just upgraded and failed to solve some problems.
I use input L/R for two mono synths. When I change to another pattern, the volume is set to the previous pattern and the display of the external mixer shows the right volume which should be played but doesn’t. If I change the displayed value about one increment up or down it will catch the right volume.

So I thought I could work around it and set the external mixer to global and store the programs of the external synths with the desired volumes. This works so far but it turned out that this setting includes also the FX-Parameters even its not hocked in the settings. In this way I always need to adjust the FX settings to each song. This is not convenient for playing a gig.

#2

the external mixer is global for all params in the mixer, that’s including sends, there’s no way to just have the volumes global, either have it by pattern and set the levels per pattern or you have to adjust the ext in sends when switching songs…
or, if there’s someway to create midi loopback, you can use one of the midi tracks and set first trig set to 1st and set the sends to zero via midi…

#3

You tell it exactly like it is. But the select options in the menu indicates something different. So if it really should be like it is then it should only provide two options for a so called global mode or they should come up with a bug fix.

#4

I don’t think it’s a bug, I think it’s more of a very valid feature request, you can try sending this to the feature request or submitting as a bug, but either way at the moment this is the standard behavior…

#5

I could live with the default behavior but the major issue is that it doesn’t catch the right volume settings after pattern change if I rely on the pattern settings.

#6

yeah I think I know what you’re talking about, there’s somewhere a thread where something similar was described, iirc there’s something about a buffer of the delay that gets across the patterns, so if you had lots of stuff already running in the delay feedback it would drag into the next pattern regardless of the send level…
if I’m not mistaken there was no real solution except solving this by controlling the levels somehow, maybe use a transition pattern to unload the delay buffer or just somehow control the levels, other then that there was no real solution…

if that’s what you mean…

btw if you can use midi loop you can also set the levels of the fx real quick with one or two trgis of a midi track…

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#7

Just made a video about it:

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#8

This kind of behavior seems irrational. I don’t have my digitone with me right now to test, but I don’t recall ever having this problem when changing patterns. I haven’t upgraded to the 1.41 OS version yet, do you recall if this was a problem for you in 1.40 and below?

I’m curious, have you watched the voice menu to see the voice stealing behavior? What I mean, is that when a new sound comes in, you can usually see where the voices are allocated from the display, so can you confirm at the pattern change if the pad sound is not recognized until the volume change? Can you try an experiment allocating all available voices to the pad sound (in the 2nd pattern) in the voice menu and then let the pattern change, just to see if it prioritizes this sound upon change?

#9

Yes, the issue was even in 1.32.

#10

It’s not about voice stealing. The pad sound is from an external synthesizer. The video shows the behavior of the external mixer.

#11

Gotcha. In that case it’s not a well implemented system and I would submit a feature request, it does seem like a bug but I have to assume it’s deliberate, just without any justification that I can see for being that way.

#12

Could you parameter lock a very short amp volume change by LFO on step 1 of the midi track?

Just to see if it kicks on in the same way touching the level by increment of .01 did in your video. I’m just wondering if it requires a physical change to the level control, or if simply adjusting the parameter is sufficient to engage the correct level.

#13

Probably it works on a gig as long I don’t change any mixer parameter. The problem starts if you change the volume unintentionally about one increment. Btw. Not only the volume parameter are concerned in that way. The FX parameter behave the same.

#14

Even if this is just “the way it is”, it’s an irrational system. I agree, there’s no reason for it to behave that way unless I’m missing something in the bigger picture. I’ll have to see if the behavior is also the same on digitakt or if this is unique to digitone.

#15

The midi tracks are not connected to the external mixer. I could increase the output level of the source but this doesn’t effect the mixer settings.

#16

What about input volume which is an option under master? Does that not impact the external mixer? I suppose it has to actually touch the level control of the mixer to work.

It’s a very specific issue, but still, to impact both volume and fx is inconvenient.

#17

My Setup is supposed to save place. The Digitone should work as multitimbral synthesizer, mixer and sequenzer for two mono synths and one poly synth. And the most important I want to play gigs with it. In this way it’s absolutely disappointing. I will see if I can convince Elektron to do something.

#18

I still think in the interim, trying the midi loopback as a temporary option to see if it can be accomplished using the lfo cc destination for input volume, or as alechko said about using a midi track

but in total, like I said, I can’t think of any reason to keep a system like this in place unless the hardware is physically insufficient to implement an upgrade. I know that it would require the effort for them to change the presently working system, but I’m not sure why this wouldn’t be a change that would be beneficial to make.

I hope you have some luck with your request.

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#19

just watched the video, never encountered such behavior but my external mixer is set to global for a long time so I couldn’t encounter it, you should submit this as a bug via elektron.se from your user menu and see if elektron support has something to say about this, this seems strange behavior indeed

#20

I received an email from Elektron! They explained to me a workaround to reset the external mixer settings.

Thanks for reporting!

Note that you need to trigger an internal synth track for the updated external mixer settings to take effect (this is by design). In the video’s playing pattern, are you using internal synth tracks, MIDI tracks, or both?

If you’re using the Digitone solely as a MIDI sequencer and mixer for external gear without internal synth tracks, try this workaround: place a trig on the first step of an internal synth track in each pattern and parameter lock the AMP volume to 0. This will ​ensure the external mixer settings take effect at the start of the pattern.

Best Regards,

Patrik - Elektron

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