I’m running into an issue where the synth loops I create in Ableton sound noticeably different—and a bit more distorted/saturated—when played back from my Octatrack, even though I’m gain-matching them. A tiny bit of Elektron “flavor” is fine, but in some parts of the loop, the difference is just too obvious.
Here is my workflow and what I’ve tried so far:
File prep: I export my synth loops from Ableton at around -14 LUFS.
OT Settings: I have already turned off the basic things like Time Stretch (attributes page) and verified that the playback rate is normal.
Routing: I play the sample from the OT, send it out via the Main Outs into my MOTU M4 line inputs, and back into Ableton.
The Gain Issue: When the audio comes back into Ableton, it is significantly quieter. I often have to add a +12 dB Utility in Ableton just to match the original -14 LUFS of the raw Ableton file.
Despite matching the final LUFS, the OT version sounds pushed/distorted in certain frequency areas.
Is this inherent to the Octatrack’s audio engine/converters, or am I doing something wrong in my gain staging? Could it be related to the internal track volume, the MASTER volume, or the way the OT handles headroom?
Would love to hear your insights or tips on how to get the cleanest, most transparent playback possible!
do you have a way to a/b them without sending the ot through the converters and adding gain? the extra ad/da stage could have an impact depending on the source material. you might want to check the input settings on your converters too, usually it’ll be something like 0dbu = -18dbfs
that said, i sold my ot because of the ‘color’ of the sound. but finding the most neutral way to a/b them would be my first suggestion
FX1 and FX2 set to none on the track and (if you’re using it) the master
Track volume at 127, master track volume at 127
VOL on Amp page at +63
Make sure MAIN is set to 0 on the MIX page.
Balanced cables between the octatrack and your interface
your interface has +18 dBu on the line level inputs. OT1 is +10 dBu on the outputs, OT2 is +17dBu, so you’ll need to make up either 8 or 1 dB on your interface.
Why are you measuring in LUFS? Just normalise it to peak at a specific dB. Even 0dB is ok because you can then alter the gain in the Octatrack if it’s too hot and clipping the output.
check that it sounds correct coming straight from OT → headphones
check that it sounds correct coming from OT → interface (monitor INPUT of interface, not DAW mix)
If it sounds bad when monitoring via headphones, it’s a problem with OT settings.
If that’s OK but it sounds bad listening from the interface INPUT, then it’s a problem with the interface settings.
If that’s OK but it sounds bad listening in the DAW, then it’s a problem with DAW settings.
I would agree with poster above that LUFS is not the best target in this situation, it’s peaks you have to think about. You loops could peak in Ableton but be handled gracefully by master limiters etc in a way the OT won’t. A synth track could easily peak in Ableton without audible distortion if you have compression/limiting on the Ableton master; if you export the track, that master limiting won’t be there and the sample will be distorted at any volume.
I’d export them normalized to -1db (or 0db if you want to), make sure there’s no clipping. Then in the Octatrack’s AED either go to sample attributes and set the default -12db to 0 db or compensate with amp volume (+63 in this case IIRC).
Edit: -12db is only default for recordings, samples should be 0db anyway. Thanks @sezare56
Track level 127, main out level at 0 (open mixer menu and check levels there).
Reset fx slots (FX1/FX2 + Clear) or manually check if you’re not blasting filter drive or smt like that.
As noted above the (default) Filter FX colours the sound even when fully open, so remove that and check again
Gain staging everything properly with an OT can be a fine art.
It’s a sampler! I personally like that they all have tonal characteristics. The first thing I do with a transparent modern sampler is find ways to introduce character - 303/404 vinyl sim, SP1200 emulation, bit and samplerate reduction etc. Perhaps better to lean into it, especially if you’re at the point where you’re treating it as a science experiment, it’s a path to insanity.
Personally I monitor everything that will be played by Octatrack through my Octatrack. I’d chasing ghosts all day if I didn’t. But it shouldn’t sound distorted and usually a bit of EQ does wonders if your goal is to get rid of OT’s colour.
Embracing it is probably the best choice. Go nuts with what the OT can do.
Never experienced that from times directly loaded onto the OT, they sound 1:1 like on the PC if i dissable all the effects/timestretch.
Now with the ins the gain staging can be tricky, especially if you go by the useless LEDs. And i really dont understand the use of lufs here, only peaks are relevant as far as i understand
Ok i see you are exporting it. 44.1 khz?
Does it distort in the headphones from the OT?
Sounds like it gets recorded to quiet and then gets pushed? Hm. Im curious what it is
@brisket
I did listen with headphones directly in Octatrack vs through my Motu M4 and there wasn’t much difference. I don’t know another way of comparing the synth sound coming from Octatrack vs the synth loop just playing in Ableton.
I have OT2. You were right about the FX: I did have a lot of values on it. But I think it was because of the EZBOT template maybe? Nonetheless now I also now how to erase any FX with Clear + FX .
I also looked at my cables and they were unbalanced actually! So I tried with some balanced cables, turning up the volume to 127 and amp +63 and I did not need an extra utility anymore! That worked, so thanks a lot! @Schnork
The reason I measure in LUFS is because I thought that way I could get a good comparison of the synth loop of 32 bars playing in ableton as resampled audio file 44.1 khz (it already has compression and other processing from the synth group baked in that resampled audio channel).
I did try to export the 32 bar loop with normalise on and I think that did also help. I tried it all togheter with the advices of BryanT.
What I do notice still is that some synth loops it’s almost identical what plays through Octatrack as what plays in Ableton. But a lot of synth loops I still have to manually adjust some dB + or dB - (like 2-3dB) mostly. Am I still doing something wrong or?
Besides that if a synth loop is getting busy (like multiple synths playing at the same time in that loop) or most noticeably if I play a heavy distorted guitar part, the Octatrack does sound quite a bit different than what plays in Ableton.
Does that remove the effect (i.e., switch it to “None”) or does it initialize the effect? I ask that because even when initialized some of the effects impact the sound. The Filter does, for example.
Parameter Page + Clear initiziales the page. Works for every Playback/SRC, Amp, LFO and the two FX slots. If you want to get rid of effects, you have to scroll up and select “none”.
Some effects (IIRC Filter and Lofi) colour the sound a bit even with their default settings.
.