Do you consider the ethics of synth manufacturers?

I try to shop ethically wherever possible. To this end I normally do my research before buying something big like a synth, as to whether the manufacturer has any ethical practices. You know the sort of thing - it’s also called CSR (corporate social responsibility) and concerns areas including conditions in the supply chain, policies on sustainable disposal of chemicals used in manufacturing etc. Just wondering if anyone else can identify with this?

Results vary wildly. I’m pleased to say Elektron seem to score really well; I emailed them last year and I had a helpful reply providing all sorts of encouraging info, including saying that the machines were manufactured in the EU and, until recently, were even made just across the road from Elektron’s office. The respondant did admit that Elektron needed to put this on their website but regrettably it seems they still haven’t.

Yamaha and Roland also score well and have extensive CSR info on their website. Other firms I’ve had less success with. Some of the smaller synth firms have responded with bemusement bordering on hostility when I ask the question. Korg have nothing to say about CSR at all on their site but did say in an email reply to me last week that they have been working hard on their sustainability and would put info about this on their site “in due course”. They also linked me to their anti-forced labour policy.

All of which is to say, is this something you consider too? I know chipsets are all (?) made in China, and there’s only so much you can do (it’s not normally possible to shop 100% ethically) but there are still choices to be had usually.

Anyway, interested in anyone’s thoughts on this or whether you’ve done similar research!

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Honestly not really.

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I get bad vibes from this kind of discussion.

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No, I just want synths to sound good.

If I started caring about ethics of synth manufacturers, I should probably also throw out the devices I use to browse this forum.

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Very true - which is why I said there’s only so ethical you can be. Every smart phone/laptop contains cobalt which was (probably) mined in very poor conditions, etc., but we all need a phone and so there’s little room to make an ethical choice. That doesn’t apply to all areas, though; if synth manufacturer A goes all out to produce ethically, and synth manufacturer B doesn’t at all, then we’re faced with a choice as to whether we fund ethical or unethical practices. And I was just wondering if I was a lone voice here or whether others took this into consideration when synth shopping.

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I try to buy things that are made in the same country where the company origin is, obviously it doesn’t mean it’s 100% ethical, components can still be made elsewhere, but something about the notion of “designed in X - made in Y” bothers me to some degree that I at least look for an alternative.
for example I bought monitors recently and it while I made not the most cost effective choice it made me happy to see on the back plate “made in X” where X is the origin country of the product, and seeing “made in Sweden” makes me happy seeing on my Elektron boxes.
maybe it’s because when I was younger working jobs via a subcontractor that’s what triggers me, and it made me appreciate companies that keep the work inside the company rather subcontracting it… doesn’t mean that I’m 100% sure they don’t, but that’s the illusion I want to believe in :slight_smile:

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By 2050 AI will be consuming 75% of all energy resources on the planet and those still living will be plugged into their cocoons, neurolinked to the mothership, floating in gelatinous pink goo.

This doesn’t mean we should all start littering though.

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I never buy Beringer, because all they do is sell cheap knock offs.
I never buy apple, because all they do is sell overpriced, castrated, walled in crap.

One can decide on his own as to weither or not these views have anything to do with ethics.

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This!

Ethics, peace, values, heaven and hell are no absolute constructs and concepts. They depend of the individual views of persons, groups, societies and nations.

I’m quite sure that there are entities that declare any electronic music equipment as hell and unethical.

So what? Everyone does what they want to do and shouldn’t expect that others share their point of view.

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heaven and hell are definite absolute points.

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I get your point. I should have worded “the way that leads to heaven or hell” instead. :blush:

…where to start, where to end this in essence quite good approach of backchecking how well and in full correct circle ammount a company does their business before u purchase anything from them…?

puh, thin ice…

at least we can all agree, that elektron is indeed one of the good ones…u get valuable and top quality products that are concepted and assembled under reasonable conditions…

while as much as i love apple products, i’m aware of the fact, the last bottom end resources of their hi quality products are based on / lead down to nothing but modern slavery…

as all other smartphone companies do, by the way…

thankfully, when it comes to music products, all this remains a niche market in comparison and there are no real issues wilth childlabour exploitation and such things…
and if somebody knows better, i’d be intrested to hear otherwise…

since the last remaining truu power we have left, is the choice to buy or not to buy…

meanwhile, let’s keep in mind, there’s a whole new industry on it’s very own lately, that get’s paid to take care of mothing but how to make sure, other companies look as pc/green/ethic as possible., even if they could not be more far away from xactly that…

white/green washing is real…no company that would’nt give that at least a try at some point…
and the more u got to hide, the more u try to not spread the word of it…and/or/by work the wording…

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. Buying a Macdonalds or shopping at Amazon then feeling better about myself for buying an ethical synth. It would make me a hypocrite. Not for me.

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The lady doth protest too much, methinks!

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Yes and no.

In general, I like to know a bit about companies I buy from, and when there’s an similar choice between something more/less ethical, I’ll try and go with the former, assuming it fits in with what I need.

For a lot of things, that’s much easier because things are fungible. E.g. I’m cooking roast chicken, so I might prefer some free-range organic corn-fed happy chicken over battery farmed sad chicken. If I’m choosing an energy supplier, I might choose one that uses more renewables.

When it comes to a lot of music gear and technology, that’s not the case, and products aren’t freely interchangeable. If I wanted say a Syntakt but didn’t like Elektron’s ethics, I can’t just buy a non-Elektron Syntakt, there’s just no equivalent.

This is the reason I end up using Apple stuff still, in an ideal world I wouldn’t, but there’s no equivalent hardware/software ecosystem that I could switch to.

So when it comes down to it, I like to be aware of what companies are up to, but also realistic about balancing that with convenience and lack of alternatives, being ethical where I can, and not beating myself up when I can’t.

image

#gifwanker

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Are you sure about that? I‘m perfectly fine without evil and I‘m also able to define good without the existence of evil.

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I think it’s perfectly fine to consider choices in terms of more and less harm. Sure, we could all decide to buy everything as ethically as possible and none of that would solve the climate crisis without major reform of how corporations operate. But we would be doing less harm.

I also don’t think good acts are automatically cancelled by the fact that we are all morally compromised by living in this system (cobalt being a great example of how). “You live in society” is not a valid critique, and purity politics are usually an excuse for doing nothing.

I have bought new two clearly “unethical” music tech objects that I know of: a Buchla 208c (found out about the current company’s history with Don’s family after I bought despite doing my homework) and a Behringer cable tester (didn’t know it was a copy, should have done my homework).

In both cases, getting rid of them doesn’t undo the harm I caused by giving the companies my money, so I use them and try to do better next time.

I also think buying used is a different proposition than buying new.

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perfect movie for ethics and values!

what am I seeing here? with your brother???

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