DJ, Musican, Artist, Producer, Other

The Lounge General Discussion
1

I would love a non abusive, civil discussion on this topic.

I have done DJ sets in the past (last one was 4 years ago), but never identified with the DJ culture, I viewed my DJ set as me sharing my music passions. I also never got how someone who plays records can be held in superstar status. I don’t think I ever will.

I get that some DJs created music that changed, or created new genres. I view these people as artists, that also DJ. I never liked the title “producer” either, music is art… artists make art. Producers produce items for use, or consumption as in factories. Or in this case dance floor fillers.

I’m also very tired of DJs using Traktor to play 4 tracks at the same time just because they can and too often creating a wall of cacophony.

I would love hear about other’s feelings and experiences and what do you identify with?

I am other, a one man band I guess, or better yet, my bandmates live in boxes.

2

The DJ can be the lowest form of music making.

He can also be a highly trained selector, who can mix in disparate styles with ease.

I’ll compare two good friends of mine, both DJs.

One uses Serato, tho he does mix in vinyl and has been doing it for some time. I enjoy listening to him spin, so I’m not slighting him. However, we’ve tried jamming a few times, and at one point he tried to make a point to me that DJing was superior to playing real instruments because he can play whatever he wants without great effort. And truth be told, when he spins he does get people moving. But he can’t jam.

My other friend has been spinning wax since the 80s. He has the most amazing collection of music I have ever seen, alphabetized according to genre, with deep roots in dub (and all it’s offshoots),punk, post-punk, industrial, hip-hop, dnb, techno, disco, and so much more. We jam and get experimental, and it flows. Somebody tosses him some shoegaze or indie folk pop at a house party, and he can blend it in with some Augustus Pablo in 2 bars. He knows his craft, and does it well.

I think of people like Amon Tobin or Daedelus as people who ride that line between “producer” and “DJ”. You can do both. Any sound is fair game, just give credit. If you significantly alter the original so it becomes a new track, call it a remix. If you’re basically playing it as is, you’re DJing. If this is all live, who the fuck knows.

I tend to say I “produce” because it is the best known term for whatever I do; in truth, I spend a lot of time on sound design and jamming, and finish like 1:10 tracks. So I don’t “produce” that much, but I like what I produce more than when I finished a track a day in Ableton Live, and I don’t get into the semantics with people who don’t do the same thing.

3

Philip Jeck - Vinyl Requiem

4

I want clear one thing up, I got into electronic music because of DJs…
it’s because I listened to Gordon Field doing a downtempo set in Montreal years ago, then Anton Kubikov and Meshkov when they were regulars on Deep Mix Moscow Radio. Their minimal techno, tech house sets were sick. So, I’m not diminishing what a DJ does, when done well.

I’ve also met Fumiya Tanaka and Joel Mull… very talented and modest human beings. It’s been my experience that too often the smaller the talent the bigger the ego is…

Accent, your friend that can jam and knows his craft…I feel that is a lot of practice and experience. But more it’s a natural born talent that can’t be taught.

I’ve been around awhile, my roots are punk, post punk and goth, I was not any of those things… it’s just the music I listened to and the shows I went to. Meaning I didn’t wear the “uniform” associated with the scenes.

5

thanks, I’m enjoying this.

6

I was very much of the attitude that DJs weren’t ‘real’ musicians back in my Gtr wielding days, as were the rest of the band. We considered ourselves pretty open minded but DJs were just cheating as far as we were concerned.

Then whilst engineering at a club this guy turned up & blew me away!
The singer from my band at the time doesn’t speak to me now b’cos he can’t accept my change of attitude, how sad is that! Lol

7

that’s pretty sad,

8

last year I did a live set using Ableton live, I had two drum racks running eight instances of Operator each, all percussion. And a bunch of stems and loops that I had prepared in Ableton and Reaktor… all controlled and sequenced with two legacy Jazzmutant Lemurs. I did so well. That the Dj/Producer/Promoter that booked me, refuses to book me again.

The crowd love it, the energy was great. The problem was when he went on… the place emptied out with 25 minutes. Many in the crowd told me how much they enjoyed it, and thanked me, but not one of the local Djs said… hey that was great man. :smiley: not one. how sad is that?

it’s pretty sad, funny and pathetic.

I am not full of myself. I just love making music, and I love playing it out live.

9

i think DJing is NOT making music - and usual DJs are Not musicians…
DJs are usually playing recorded & produced music - i think of DJs as big music lovers
beeing a musician means that you can actualy play an instrument, understand a bit of music theory, knowing bit of music history… and not just mixing 2 records in tempo :slight_smile:

on the other hand there are a couple of people who do really crazy stuff with records - like Kid Koala - but being a real musician needs a bit more.

yes there is also “music university” - and you get REALLY pro if you get there - and its really not easy to get there.

sorry all of you DJs :slight_smile:
best niko

10

Curators create value. We need more curators, and not from the usual places.

11

I’m in the opposite camp. I find DJ’ing much more enjoyable to listen to as opposed to live gigs. Records sound sonically better to my ears than live instruments too.

There are also VERY few artists or bands who have even an hour of really great material, a DJ can handpick the best tracks from whomever artists he wants.

12

a great interview with Babicz, a dj and producer, shed some basic light on things in the sense that if he was DJ’ing a gig, and if he found the vibe of the performance needing quite a different flavour, it was easy to switch on up.

when Babicz performed a live set with hardware, not so easy to change things if the performance wasn’t progressing in the most positive direction.

as regards DJing just being about mixing two tracks in time, please people, let’s just keep things intelligent and a bit friendly here yeah? like really, it’s one of the most disempowering things to say about a creative pursuit, sending it into the level of playing a computer game or something. it’s a cheap shot and many creative DJ’s here would be fuming from such an ignorant passive aggressive statement.

13

One of the bands I’m currently involved with refuse to acknowledge any talent in Sampling & Electronic circles in general! I find it amusing :slight_smile:
What’s the difference between Free then AC/DC then Airbourne rehashing the same old riffs & someone sampling them?
Well they’re playing them with feel, stamping their own identity on them! Really!!!
& that’s coming from a guitarist :slight_smile:

14

I think of myself more as a creative storyteller…
Using video and audio mixtures to tell how I feel this stage of my life…

So technically you could say I produce indoor multi-media stuff.

Thats a bit far from “dancefloors and dj’s and hip crowds and young people”
Sometimes my kids and their friends promote my weird shit as an after-party
download on their party page… so thats about as close I get to “the young and hip”

Cannot dj even if it would save the whole planet from the invation of 60ft amazone lesbian warriors… (and I hear you cheer :wink:

I did some live-gigs (but not enough to brag about) I did jamsessions (as a percusionist, or with some groovebox) Did remixes for others (nothing to brag about) did writting for others… so hmmm I had a nice trip through “what can you do with a musical idea” the last 25 orso years…

I bet, that if i had to entertain a whole crowd with what i did… I end up telling stories laced with some beats and pointing at the pretty colours and images and why they like that…

funny detail about the kids views on dj’s
if u use cdj’s without autosync… your cool…
if u use cdj’s with autosync… your not so cool…
if u use cdj’s with a laptop… you suck, but you can hide it.
if u just use the laptop with a dj controller … you suck and you cannot hide it
if u use ableton with some loops… you suck and they hear it.
if u use ableton with all the tricks you can come up with… they prob hear a few mistakes and love you for it…
if u use drumcomputers and a few square feet of gear… they love you… unless if you make idm/noise like me… then you gotta be famous 2, before they love it…

but i dont care… i just play with puppets…

15

yes. badly.

16

I agree with most of that, creative and talented DJs are excluded. But what I’ve been hearing around here does not fall into that category.

Also, If one knows their hardware, and can jam, or improvise well they can too change were a hardware set is heading. It is easier with prerecorded material though, especially with laptop DJing with days of material with you.

17

ha well said. Tis just a personal experience after all. If it tickles someone’s interest, than ya i’ll tell you more about why it makes me feel this way. I dig the story telling aspect, the journey, the process more than the end result. It was always more about attitude & passion for knowledge than anything else when it comes to creation.

18

I have seen very very few DJs in my lifetime that were actually interesting enough to warrant being put on a well lit stage, where everyone basically just stands around watching them mix tracks (which these days means watching the DJ stare into a laptop). It’s weird because people seem to be confused whether they should put their head down and dance, or stand still and watch the “performance”.

I mean hell, when we go to restaurants we don’t stand there watching the chef putting everything together - we just enjoy the food and the atmosphere. And when we go to a play we don’t watch the director who’s standing just off stage giving cues. What’s so interesting about watching a DJ? Nothing. Most DJs could be hidden behind a curtain for all I care. Sorry.

All that said, I do think DJs are good for certain settings, like clubs where they aren’t front and center, or at art gallery openings (just kidding!).

19

ha well said. Tis just a personal experience after all. If it tickles someone’s interest, than ya i’ll tell you more about why it makes me feel this way. I dig the story telling aspect, the journey, the process more than the end result. It was always more about attitude & passion for knowledge than anything else when it comes to creation.[/quote]
not sure if its on topic :slight_smile: but yeah… i am curious…

20

@Freefall: Agreed. My favourite DJ sets are traditional pick good songs, keep up the energy, simple mixing type deals. They are good for partytimes, but I don’t know what people why people are watching but not dancing.

I do love “live” electronic performances if they find a way to make it truly live, but they often end up being no different than if they just played the track and mimed the buttons. I doubt most the audience would have any idea. Most the time I think ‘what’s the point?’.