DJ mixer vs Octatrack (fx and looper)

vasidudu · 2020-12-21T10:23:17.986Z

tallrobphilp:

without staring at the screen the whole time

Yep
Have actually not turned my MBP in a while
Although I use Reaper as my main DAW, I recently have been starting every session with the laptop turned off.
It has proven very productive.

tallrobphilp · 2020-12-21T10:40:00.604Z

Well my work MBP is on for 8 hours a day and then I end up using my personal one as well (much of which is spent here chatting about music gear) so some hardware is a good remedy to get away from the computer.

Thanks for the opinions on the DB4, it’s clearly a leader in the field for a reason. I’m a bit hesitant to spend that sort of money which is why I was considering the pioneer or something else a bit cheaper. Are the Pioneer FX really that bad? I watched a bunch of YT videos and I thought they seemed pretty decent as performance FX. You probably wouldn’t use them for “serious” production work but that’s kind of the thing - I’ve grown extremely bored with the whole idea of surgical music production, spending hours fiddling with one sound, messing with arrangement or EQing a perfect drum and bass snare etc. I respect these professional producers and their dedication but to me it just kills the enjoyment stone dead. Probably a conversation for another day though!

Riuozami · 2020-12-21T10:50:23.329Z

I see your point- a Xone 96 will allow you to add up to 2 fx on each channel, in stereo.

The mixer has its own channel dedicate to effects which can be also equalised.

It is real fun- you can add a couple of eventide pedal or OTO BIM and BOUM and or any pedal you might already have.
It is very fun cause not only you can jam with your machines, but you can also create tracks, do a lot of improvisation.

You can use the mixer also as an analog preamp and go ITB with real analog quality.

I would not compare and confuse this with an Octatrack or Machine +

Have a look at the rear of the mixer to understand the potential of this instrument.

If your main interest is effects you can choose the Xone DB4 which has a real digital multi effects built in and can be used as sound card and or controller for Ableton- possibilities are endless.

Martebar · 2020-12-21T11:02:41.797Z

I just want to add that going from a computer based setup to a hardware one is really tossing a coin.

Getting out of your comfort zone can be interesting when you want to experiment, but I try regularly to go the “Dawless” route because I am also in front of the computer all day and want to look at something other than a screen for a while, but it’s really never satisfying in terms of sound and control and I realise that I’m just having more fun with the help of my computer.

I really want to insist that if it is just a hobby, it may be a bad idea to get too much out of your comfort zone like that because it can really crushing to become a beginner again when you’re not prepared to grind again. Making things sound good as an ITB setup (especially when you have your routines and are fast) with only machines is really difficult, and having to relearn to do basic stuff when you just want to have fun is really difficult and unwelcome.

vasidudu · 2020-12-21T11:09:27.915Z

Pioneer FX are not “bad” but… They just plainly do not sound good to MY ears
DB4 line of FX is coming straight from iLive (or DLive, not sure) line of mixers. They are not just DJ FX.
Using a DB4 as a soundcard is not a good idea as the drivers were very badly written. And furthermore not supported. I had to rewrite portion of the hexadecimal code.
Apart from that, you get a routing matrix out of this world for a DJ mixer as well as 3 types of EQ per channel.
If it was not for the soundcard drivers, I would buy it again. Had a MODEL1 after it and would gladly return to the DB4

Riuozami · 2020-12-21T11:10:23.419Z

What went wrong with the Model 1? I was just going to suggest it after the Xone 96…

vasidudu · 2020-12-21T11:14:50.427Z

@Riuozami
This: PlayDifferently MODEL1 or NOT?
I believe the QC is not what would be expected from a 3’300€ mixer…
Not judging the brand but it surely keeps me away from it now…

Riuozami · 2020-12-21T11:25:16.457Z

Yes this is what I meant…

Wow I am surprised by the QC issues, in the end this is manufactured at Allen Heath like all the Xones

tallrobphilp · 2020-12-21T11:26:39.962Z

Thanks for the advice. I understand where you’re coming from but I have sometimes had the opposite feeling where I can spend all day with microscopic control over sound design etc but not really get anywhere and often not have much fun. I think if you set realistic expectations (a small hardware setup isn’t going to be like a DAW) then hopefully we can still get a lot of enjoyment and minimal frustration!

Ultimately, you don’t have to have one or the other. I can hang onto my software if I want to use that but I can also get some hardware so I can go screen-free when I want to do that. Nobody is forcing me to choose!

vasidudu · 2020-12-21T11:38:29.962Z

Riuozami:

manufactured at Allen Heath like all the Xones

I am not sure about that.
I think they are manufactured in Wales by a small crew.
I was unlucky

ccr · 2020-12-21T12:46:44.994Z

Hey, according to a 2018 video on the Model 1 website, it is built in an Audiotonix factory in Scotland. Afaik, Audiotonix is the mother company of A&H, SSL, etc, and this is the factory where they assemble their flagship consoles.

tnussb · 2020-12-21T12:59:05.058Z

vasidudu:

Xone DB4 is actually pretty good for that matter.

Well, it completely depends what you expect from a looper. For me the missing MIDI sync control is a no go (as well as no standard send/returns as basic mixer functionality).

But, of course, as a complete package for performing with FX on the fly and some looping it’s great.

For everyone not having seen DaveMech’s introduction video yet (+ follow ups):

Xone DB4 Other Gear

Hi fellow Elektronauts! I released another video. This time I show you why I think the db4 is such an incredible mixer for use in live setups and in the studio as well. It gives you an immense amount of control and diversity and can be customized to your liking. I hope you enjoy this video or find it useful, and if you do please leave a like on YouTube. It helps me a lot! And if you want to see more videos, you can subscribe right here: https://www.youtube.com/subscription_center?add_user=dave…

knitram · 2022-05-06T18:57:30.816Z

Late to the party, thank you all for sharing your experience here! I’m in a similar debate myself, as I started my build with a DB4, but have since added many more voices. I think I have a good routing solution (described below), but I’m still looking for that final mix interface.

First, I want to say the DB4 is an awesome mixer! about the most fun I’ve ever had on hardware. You just can’t underestimate the power of 4 independent fx engines, filters/eq on every channel, and being able to mirror inputs to any/all four channels. Combined with the dj-speed of the interface…all you need is Bluetooth and SoundCloud and you’ve got a banging set. It’s sooo much fun!

However, that said — I hit the glass ceiling on the DB4 as soon as I wanted to build on top of it. As mentioned above, no sync, so resampling has to happen upstream. But even more of a killer: It has no sends! Whatever happens in that box comes out mixed down. Period. The audio interface doesn’t fix this, either. What was said above about the USB interface is true: Finicky, terrible latency, and big-time tendency to ground loop. It’s a mixer with great onboard fx, so I can’t fault AH for the lack of expandability…it’s just a repeatedly sad feeling that what’s created there can’t go further.

As an alternative, I’m using a MOTU 16a + Faderfox control surfaces to route audio everywhere in my system. The advantage of this is 1, It’s a hardware setup with 7 stereo aux buses and 6 stereo group busses — I’m layering and sending audio anywhere and everywhere; 2, The creative work can happen elsewhere on gear dedicated to its particular purpose; and 3, The results can also be multitrack recorded into the MBP for further development. I won’t get into the resultant tug-of-war caused by the gravity of the DAW…but, I feel if I’m going to record, I have to accept this.

The problem though is that OSC-to-Motu is not performance speed (hoping I can resolve this, but as of now, adjustments are very “ease-in” and “ease-out”— adequate for routing a system patch, but not jammable.)

So what is that final mix-down interface?? All signs point towards an Octatrack. I see myself using the motu group busses to layer up A and B channels, adding whatever OT fx I can, resampling, looping, and cuing up my next bit. Elektronauts, am I headed in the right direction??

craig · 2022-05-06T19:03:07.764Z

Unfortunately Octatrack sounds like shit, tho, or so I hear.

Welcome to the forum BTW. Soon you will understand the nuances of the above

captain8 · 2022-05-06T19:21:06.704Z

hey what did you ever decide on?

DaveMech · 2022-05-06T19:43:13.023Z

Just as a tip for db4, you can use record out set to ‘phones’(in settings) and then use the cue buttons to send channels out the micxer. Use mic/line channel for the return and voila, a send return

I’ve considered octatrack as mixer a few times, but it just doesn’t have enough inputs which makes you go into workaround modus from the get go and it limits things a lot for the way I work live. Also eying the bluebox . Which might be a great solution together iwth one of the faderfox midi controllers.

knitram · 2022-05-06T20:13:35.179Z

@DaveMech that’s clever! Thank you for that tip

Pulsar · 2024-11-11T13:30:58.832Z

AdamJay:

I did shows with just the Rytm MK1, along with the pigtronix infinity looper + a vestax Dj mixer for seamless transitions.

Sorry to dig this up from the archive, but I was wondering if you had any audio from your Rytm + looper + mixer shows?

AdamJay · 2024-11-12T22:30:46.896Z

Pulsar:

Sorry to dig this up from the archive, but I was wondering if you had any audio from your Rytm + looper + mixer shows?

Afraid not

captain8 · 2024-11-12T23:21:32.135Z

Good to see you Adamjay!