Convince Me to Keep My DT in Light of the Toraiz SP-16

So, my goal for a long time has been able to improvise versions of my own studio tracks (tracks I begin on hardware and finish in my daw) during DJ sets. I make dance/disco/house/techno…whatever…tunes you dance to : )

I recently got an Pioneer/DSI Toriaz SP-16. It syncs directly with my CDJs via DJ Link and the time stretch/pitch adjust is excellent between the 3 devices over an Ethernet switch. So, basically tempo/pitch correction is taken care of automatically between the SP-16 and whatever the CDJs are playing. Additionally the SP-16 will turn that data into MIDI and send the correct tempo to any of my other hardware making anything easy to beatmatch with CDJs and SP-16.

My basic setup would be 2xCDJs and 1xSP-16 routed to a 4 channel DJ mixer. I have the aux send going into the SP-16 inputs if I want to live loop.

Having had the SP-16 for a few weeks I’m absolutely in love with the work flow. It works great with the CDJs. It has a proper song mode. It exports .wav of all sixteen tracks separately either per pattern or per the entire arrangement so it is super easy to finish things in my DAW. And the variety of FX is larger and they are usable.

I’ve not yet tried to deconstruct a DAW-finished track back onto the SP-16 for a more polished performance. I but I feel like that won’t be an issue as it handles loops as well as one-shots. Even if this ends up being problematic, the SP-16 offers way more in terms of performing “raw” versions of tracks alongside my CDJs than the DT does (unless you all can tell me otherwise)

The DT has “nudge tempo” and no proper time stretch nor song mode. Less FX. The only thing it has is the probability sequencer stuff. With a proper song mode, 16 audio/midi tracks per pattern and 16 patterns per project I don’t really need or want it (random things happening isn’t my bag when I’m DJing). Using a DJ mixer switching to new projects isn’t a problem, there won’t be a gap in the music; I can also preview over headphones what I’m setting up before the audience hears it.

I love the DT but I’m hard pressed to think of a reason to keep it. For building tracks it doesn’t offer much the SP-16 doesn’t. I do like the DT workflow, so I’m going to try Overbridge again and see if I can get it to work with FL Studio. Its MUCH smaller than the SP-16 so I could easily take it out of studio with my laptop to use as a studio tool.

Other than that I’m at a loss. I’ve got a free channel on my DJ mixer I could use the DT on, but I also have a RD-8, TD-3 and M:S which all much more immediate for improvisation during a performance and because of the way the SP-16 can translate tempo from DJ Link into MIDI the fact that the DT has tempo nudge doesn’t matter, everything else is easy to beatmatch with the CDJs and SP-16.

Also, my brain can’t handle much more than 2xCDJs and the SP-16. Anything on that forth channel would be like drum fills and ear candy done on the fly.

edit: I also wanted to add there really isn’t even anything else on my radar I’d but if I sold the DT. Just a matter of do I let a great tool collect dust?

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For your application I would think the only pros of the DT that you might miss are the Elektron sequencer (way better) and the extra LFO (newest update)… besides those I think the SP-16 is superior in almost every way, and that’s why I replaced my own DT with one.

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Don’t. Give me a good deal on it :wink:

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I must say InTheAM, you sound like the most together sort of musician who as ever asked this sort of question. If you need the cash, for the DT, by all means liquidate. If not sit on it for a few weeks or so, and see if anything changes. A DT is inexpensive enough that the unlikely event of you having to rebuy it in the future is hardly worth your time considering. Spend your time with the more important musical issues you are working through, and don’t be concerned about breaking a few eggs along the way.

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@DonovanDwyer the value of a second LFO can’t be understated! I’ll go back over the literature on the sequencer before I do any selling. I’ve avoided the more interesting things Elektron sequencers can do for the most part no that so many groove boxes have “p-locks.”

@Ryan I have a dear friend first in line but if you are really interested I hate dealing with eBay, Craigslist and Guitar Center (besides the fact I’d get almost nothing for it), so if aren’t 100% joking let me know.

@Jukka I’m in absolutely no rush to sell and I’m going am going to spend some quality time with the DT before selling.

@ “most together sort of musician”, well thank you. I’ve been dancing to “rave music” for a long time, DJing a little longer and making my own tunes a little longer than that.

Through all that its been a long road figuring out exactly what I want to do performance wise and how to fit into the paradigm at hand. I learned, briefly, on vinyl, carried around a desktop computer, monitor and DJ controller to gigs when most people were mocking that, got onto CDJs, done a “live pa” here and there, etc.

However you feel about Pioneer DJ its the “industry standard” (a term I use with absolute trepidation). But honestly I love the idea of walking into an event with a USB stick in my pocket and being able to perform. Likewise, the SP-16 is a part of that ecosystem and theoretically all I have to bring besides the USB stick is ONE groovebox to do something just a little different than the rest (who I am absolutely not slighting, I’ll happily play a CDJ set any time).

Anyway, I’m nerding out/gushing. But I almost wish I just would have bought the SP-16 when they cost twice as much and did half as much! LOL

If Pioneer DJ made a simple device that translated their DJ Link data to MIDI tempo/sync they could make a mint.

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@InTheAM im open to re-owning thr digitakt.it was my favorite piece of kit when I owned it.

But it seems redundant when working in Renoise primarily. Also, I’ve got the m8 Tracker coming in Monday.

But hey- if after Monday rolls around, and your friend doesn’t bite, message me and we’ll see if we can work something out.

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I thinks it’s best to sell something if you don’t want it anymore. Somebody might make a better usage of that device. Just don’t keep it for the sake of keeping it.

I don’t think anyone should convince anybody to keep anything.

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I don’t see the price of the Digitakt changing drastically on the second hand market any time soon. And you can now easily back up entire projects. So if you sell and decide that was a mistake, it’s not that big a deal.

So I’m on team give Ryan a good deal.

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You’ve kind of answered yourself with this… what more do you want?

It’s fine that the DT doesn’t meet your requirements as well as the SP16… horses for courses. I’d say if you’re not going to use it, sell it on. :+1:

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Since you mentioned you are not strapped for cash, that selling is not an immediate need, and I will assume as an Elektron user you enjoy the Digitakt for what it is - I propose a possible use case for keeping it that has nothing to do with your current setup.

I have a ‘main setup’ where the bulk of my music making happens, and I have a small separate setup on a different desk that I use as a physical and (most importantly) mental break to make music in a totally different way, without the pressures of outcome I have when using my main gear.

For me it’s great to be away from the main rig sometimes, to use gear that I have and like and do t want to sell, that makes me work differently.

I could see the Digitakt being a bedside or couch-side companion for you with a comfy set of headphones where you could sample from your phone/tablet, enjoy the DT build quality and sequencing, take a break from the big rig, and very possibly find different inspiration and outcomes.

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@CCMP oh you are absolutely spot on. While I am pretty sure I know what to do, this is a unique situation for me where everything is paid off (I buy on no-interest payment plans often), I don’t want anything new, and I’m actively trying to keep my setup reasonable. AND it finally feels right. I’m usually not one to even post this kind of question : )

@Suspect_Frequency yea, I really need to get the DT hooked up to my laptop via Overbridge and see if it can be my Kitchen Companion (I work at our kitchen table a lot). Even if I can’t get OB love between the DT and FL Studio to work (I haven’t in the past) it may very well be worth keeping for that as the SP-16 has big ol’ dad bod in comparison LOL.