Ha. Same
Also the same. Iām pretty sure if this had the same orientation between screen and pads as the live, people would be all over it. But just looks super unwieldy
EDIT just to say I actually am a fan & use it daily though!
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For people owning a MPC one, is there a reason to own one over a Force if youād take price and size out of the equation?
It does run the same firmware right, aside from the version.
If anything the Force is more evolved, the difference is that on the Force you donāt have the sample to pad mode from the sampler page and the song mode is way more evolved.
But I get more shit done with the Live.
Does that come down to the live being more focused, less full production focused? Thatās my gripe with the force, it can do all that Ableton can (albeit not as deep) but it just takes a lot more. For me itās where the benefits of having a handson instrument fail to outweigh the workflow efficiency of a DAW.
Anyways, itās still a super cool device. I had 2 trade options now, a MPC One and an AR MK2 and I feel more drawn to the elektron workflow despite the epic amount of content on the Akaiās (hype is fun)
I donāt feel like the Force is a replacement for push, donāt even think Akai look at it that way as they said from the beginning that it would not be as integrated as push for Abletonā¦ but as for stand alone use I wonder is it that most users donāt even care that it doesnāt have warp marker technology/ manipulation?
canāt bring myself to consider it without that because that is the most important thing about the workflow they are emulating imoā¦
I donāt need to warp anything when I make music on the Force. I didnāt need it in Ableton either.
So itās not about caring, itās about wether a particular device does what you need it to or not. For me, the Force does what I need it to do, which is why I considered it.
No one device, DAW, or instrument will fit the needs of every person, which is why there are so many different pieces of equipment to choose from.
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another thing I couldnāt get past is the lack of tempo automation, but it was a long time ago that I checked that has akai updated that by any chance?
Still no tempo automation. I just do it manually if i jam with several āsongsā that needs tempo change.
Iāve been looking at the Force , MPC One, MPC Liveā¦as I want something standalone.
the Force, does feel more appealing to meā¦ since Ive no MPC background, nor necessarily want to get into itā¦ so the more conventional/ableton UI definitely is a major plus.
BUT ā¦ it looks so hugeā¦ its form-factor is a real concern.
I think if I got one, Iād probably have to get rid of my Push 2, just to make space for it!
so thatās for me where the Push 2 and Force end up competitingā¦ its not just the (potential) overlap in function, but really theyād compete for space on my desk!
thatās where it gets trickyā¦ I want he standalone function of the Force, and its possible the Ableton integration might be ājust enoughā for the my Ableton needsā¦
BUT (annoyingly!), the Push 2 offers such great integration with Live, its hard to give up !
Im going to Superbooth next week, so hope I can get some hands-on time with the Force (and MPCs) , see if it can convince meā¦
if not perhaps, live in hope, that Akai do a Force 2, thatās a bit sleeker and perhaps gains an internal batteryā¦ a bit more towards the Live 2 form factor would be perfect.
but we will see, perhaps it will entice me at Superbooth next week!
The ergonomics and desk space, having to lean over to see the screen or get a big table top stand (also sucking up desk space) was the only complaint I had about the device. Thatās why I got it off my desk, on a fully adjustable arm, so I can bring it front and center when working on it, or swing it completely out of the way when not needed.
The Force is big for sure, but it makes good use of that space - having 64 pads is a huge leap over 16, as long as youāre not looking for the classic pad performance aspect of an MPC (though setting aside the size, I get on as well with the Force pads as I do with the MPC One). The chromatic modes alone make this worthwhile, but you also gain 64 pressure-sensitive pads for the Macro mode, which is huge (they can also be used as momentary or binary buttons). Then youāve got eight rotary encoders with their own OLEDsā¦ itās just a whole lot of quality of life stuff. I donāt use either with Live, so I canāt weigh in on that, but the Force has given me a lot of what Iāve been looking for for a long time in a standalone device, and as soon as I got it I realised I should have skipped the MPC One and bought the Force from the outset (I could also have avoided a few other purchases)
For me, itās really just the recent update thatās keeping the MPC in position. Once the Force gets access to the new synths, and hopefully the UI and USB audio improvements, itāll be way out in the lead again. If Akai launched a new one, maybe with expanded I/O, Iād be interestedā¦ Iām not sure they could streamline it much without impacting on what makes it work for me. Similarly, I donāt think battery power is really suited to the form factor, and the form factor is tied to the feature set, so itās not really calling to me (a battery would be a killer feature on an improved MPC One, but itād be a bit of a slap in the Liveās face).
And ten more replies today! Weāre our own worst enemies. Well, maybe after Akai.
ooh, I think it could actually helpā¦
the battery could be situated under the screen and therefore give it a natural tilted angle.
which would address @Suspect_Frequency issueā¦ (which Ive seen mentioned many times before)
I get that many use the Force in a studio setting, and its portability is questionable due to size ( which I agree, is pretty much form/function related) .
however, I think with a standalone device, allowing it to be detached from power is appealing - even if its just to use on your couch or in another room. ( * )
ā¦ but for sure, in practice, it would be interesting to see if the size meant you didnāt actually do this often in practice!
( * ) I know we have power in such places, but in my studio the PSU are not that accessible to just quickly unplug, and move the device elsewhereā¦ at least thatās what I find with my Octatrack.
If youāre clip-launching though, itās the only real option after Ableton. Itās revolutionised my live setup. 
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Iāve definitely come to appreciate the convenience of battery power - the OP-1 , OP-Z and Organelle benefit hugely. But in terms of moving the Force around, itās barely any extra hassle to move the power lead with it (provided you can get to it, as you mention), and just the thought of using it on the couch makes me uncomfortable.
But itās no skin off my nose, obviously, and the notion of a titled screen is all I need to endorse your plan.
I do wonder if external batteries are the best solution in these cases, since they can easily be replaced and shared among devices. Iāve considered getting one to use with the Tracker, which does lend itself to portabilityā¦
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Iām sure theyāll get to it eventually, they got a lot going on right now, but in itās current state even if I loved the force it would only frustrate me more because I need tempo, time signature, and warp marker capability if Iām going to be within an Ableton-esk environment or any other for that matter. I know all of the work arounds but when I have a push in front of me it just makes sense to be patient and wait for Akai to do their thing.
Yeah. It will never replace Ableton if thatās what you use. I never used ableton, so dont know what iām missing. He he. The few time I use samples of stuff I didnāt make myself I either use offline time stretch, chop them or prepare in Cubase.
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the thing about manipulating warp markers in ableton that makes it irreplaceable is not actually the time stretching for the sake of fitting loops together, for me itās all about the mangling, for example check out this clip, then imagine manipulating not only your drums, but your guitar, bass, synths, and vocals, if akai gets warp marker manipulation via the knobs itās going to be the most sought after stand alone beat machine in history lolā¦
focus on how the audio becomes elastic, the push and pull while still staying within time, combined with tempo changes and time signature changes makes for an incredible environment for sample based or live instrumentationā¦
I still warp to a degree on the mpc and you can do it the same way on the force by slicing a sample and then warping the slices individually but with the warp markers that you can pin wherever you want on the audio, elongate or squeeze, push, pull, and twist in ableton is the key, itās just on another level and very dynamic in addition to that itās all in realtime and the immediacy allows for different results than what we get with offlineā¦ there are better clips out there but the gist of it is here
the force is so close itās not even funny, and if akai allows warp markers to be set via the macro knobs and edited in realtime they will actually have one upped ableton because with the push you still need to use the mouse to manipulate the warp markers , you canāt do it with the push encoders
Should be out soon I believeā¦it has been in Beta for a looog time now.
Thank you. Thank you!