I am about to upgrade the IO in my home studio to more fully incorporate my hardware into my setup. I have only 6 Ins and 4 Outs right now. I have stereo synths that are using mono inputs. I’m not doing that lovely Juno 106 chorus any favours.
So I’m looking at the Arturia AudioFuse 16Rig, with two of the Audio Fuse X8 IN ADAT expanders which will give me 32 ins and 8 outs. This gives me a lot of flexibility and expandability. I will have the space to take individual inputs from the Analog Rytm and Analog Four for instance.
And then I’m thinking also… why not include a patchbay in front of the inputs. This could give me flexibility to insert FX or patch in other pieces of kit temporarily. I was thinking about the ART P48. This would be able to sit in a 3U rack with the Arturia gear, neatly.
Yes, this all sounds expensive, but it also sounds fairly future proof as i’m keen on a 10 year solution.
I have some questions for anyone with experience.
Will there be a limit to the audio quality with the double adat expander? I’m happy at 44 or 48 kHz, but are there potentially unforeseen consequences?
What is the round word clock connector on the back of the Arturia gear? Will I need to use it? What type of cable is that? Basic question I know but I can’t find a good answer to this.
Is this a good use of a patchbay, using it ‘in front’ of the combined interface to allow greater flexibility. Are there other more creative / sensible use cases?
If I connect a synth to the patch bay, then the patch bay to the audio interface, would you recommend a normalled or half normalled setup? It seems they are very similar, but in the half normalled setup, even if the top rail is patched, the signal still flows to the bottom rail. What’s the practical use vs the full normalled?
It all sounds like a lot of wiring (synth to patchbay, patchbay to interface). Could be 60 plus cables coming out the back of a 3U rack… is this nuts?
Ok, there’s a lot there. I am very grateful for any advice, experience as I grow my setup.
You usually cross ADAT connectors. ADAT IN of an interface to the ADAT OUT and the other, and the other way around. I’m not a 100% sure but I think you need the word clock if you don’t use 2 ADAT cables. Anyway, that’s the cable we’re talking about :
Yes, it is a lot. A lot of energy, a lot of setting up for, finally, not so much music in the output…
I went down that rabbit hole, and I’m glad I’ve let it down and downsized my setup. All the synth and drum machines out of the box, all the FX in Bitwig now.
A patchbay ? Yes. A patchbay in a 32in/8outs, no. Your body will get flexibility for sure, after spending hours under your desk wiring all this, but your setup, not sure.
EDIT : If I had a lot of fx pedals today, I would go dub-style with a mixer with several ext sends, and I would wire the aux returns to the audio interface. Just saying.
Agreed. I’ve got a 16Rig, and slightly more than enough synths to fill all the inputs. 16Rig has its own routing software and plenty of I/O. I’d play with that first and see if you can get by without the patchbay. I’ve also got a patchbay, and I absolutely loathe everything about using it. As soon as I have the energy, I’m pulling it out of my setup.
@almack77 you should be prepared for this project to take a long time, and to be potentially frustrating as you iterate. Not to mention the expense of all the extra cables since everything you send through a patch bay now needs 2 cables at minimum. It adds up. It introduces a lot more flexibility in theory (though I think that’s debatable in home studio setups), but the cost will be that troubleshooting becomes more tedious and it introduces more points of failure. If you’ve got no signal, is it the patch bay inputs/outputs, one of the 4 cables in the signal chain, is your interface routed appropriately, is your volume up, is the pedal powered on?
Plenty of people like patchbays. There are legitimate uses for them, there’s a reason real studios tend to have several. In my personal experience, mine hasn’t reduced complexity or expanded my routing options or made my setup more flexible - it simply changed where I plug things in, and that has never been an issue for me.
Wordclock In / Out is useful if you’re clocking the interface and the expanders to a master studio clock, HD recorder, etc and you want everything clocked to that device.
If I were in your shoes, I’d probably go with the Ferrofish Pulse16 and a mixer-style control surface with knobs and faders - essentially making a configurable mixer
Why?
1 - You’re looking for a 10-year solution
2 - 16Rig & Pulse16 = 32 I/O in 2U
3 - 16Rig & Pulse16 both have MIDI recall, which means
3a - connect all the gear In and Out
3b - setup / program a few routing schemes and save them
3c - once you’ve learned the setups, now you can rewire the gear by recalling a patch
4 - the setup & recall abilities of the Pulse16 (6) and 16Rig (8) will probably negate the need for a patchbay and the associated cables
5 - pay for the CV mod so that your Pulse16 can drive your modular gear
1 - not sure there. I’ve always been OK with 44 or 48
2 - word clock sends a clock signal from the 16rig to the other devices. so that each of their samples are all in lock-step. there could be an issue here… the X8 IN only has a word clock in and the 16rig only has in and out. you need to send clock to two X8 INs. so you may need an external clock to clock all three. not an expert on this, but I don’t see how those connections make sense otherwise. you can usually clock via ADAT if you have in and out connected to the device, but you don’t with the X8 IN
3 - that’s how I use a patch bay. usually it’s mostly empty. until I want to patch a pedal in. or a new synth I haven’t found a home for/don’t know if it’s staying yet. etc… always nice to have an input to your interface right there in front of you, without having to climb around the back of things to get to it
4 - I usually do HN so I can split it if I want. but buy a Samson patch bay so it’s easy to change these on the fly (from the front) if you want. without pulling it and flipping switches or - worse yet - re-connecting things.
I like a patchbay for the simple fact of having access to all inputs and outputs in one place without having to get behind or under things.
I use the Samson patchbay as well and leave it all set to normalled. For me that’s the most logical option because it correlates the closest with the idea of just having moved the i/o jacks of everything to a single place, while still having everything going to mixer/interfaces without patching at the front of the bay. If I patch at the front it’s because im wanting to take a synth output to a different destination, or if I want to use a mixer channel for something other than the normalled connection, ie, auditioning a new synth.
I think in theory the arturia stuff can do all this in the software domain, and I would say if you’re comfortable doing all your patching on a computer, and you’re not likely to need to change physical routing much, then that’s the more efficient option.
But if you say want to use a sampler standalone and be able to quickly plug in different things from your setup, a patchbay can be pretty handy.
Also, not sure if you can use the Arturia software to setup a chain of hardware fx? I’m sure it’s doable though.
All that being said, you could easuly add the patchbays later if you feel the need. All your cabling will already be in the one place, so just a matter of popping them out of the interface and into the back of the patchbay, and then adding a patch lead back to the interface.
Why not use overbridge for the elektrons and do your fx routing in the DAW? With OB you get free stereo ins via the A4 and AR inputs in addition to the 16 on the audiofuse, so should be enough for all your gear. Patchbays are a huge hassle and I would avoid wherever possible.
Cool! I’m in a similar position, I recently picked up the 16rig for a long term home studio.
My set up is:
synths -> patchbay 1 -> 16rig.
16rig -> patchbay 2 -> effects & sampler inputs.
3 - That is a good use for patchbays if you like running different configurations of outboard effects & samplers.
4 - No right or wrong answer. No definitively best use case either. Get a patchbay & you’ll figure out which suits you afterwards.
I use normal for synths & thru for effects (I think, not in the studio right now). Normalled redirects signal with no splitting (which I want for synths). Half normal allows for parallel processing. With 2 expanders you’ll have that angle sorted.
Pinkbox is right about the Samson vs Art patchbays. I have both. Being able to switch from normal, half & thru without reaching to the back is good design. I should’ve gone with Samson the first time.
The rig16 has internal audio routing/patching but it’s best for set & forget set ups. It also runs on a slightly different mentality to simple ins & outs.
If you patch differently per song/jam session the physical patch bay will be more convenient.
5 - It’s not nuts, loads of cabling is how studios function. Get balanced snakes to minimise clutter behind the rack gear. They’re expensive but worth every cent. I use these Hosa ones, but there’s probably cheaper/better options.
100%. Love my patchbays, they keep everything a bit tidier! I use Neutrik patchbays. I have a 16rig, expanded with more inputs via a focusrite octopre and then a couple of patchbays.
Personally I would recommend going with using more patchbays rather than getting more ADAT ins- the only reason to have that many ins is if you wanted to record everything all at the same time.
Yeah, I recognise that this will be a lot of effort. But I want to invest my time into getting the right set up so all the hardware I love it easily accessible and preconfigured in my DAW template, ready to go. Simultaneously, I want to be able to route the signals from the synths to adhoc pedal chains.
Thats quite a strong warning. Thanks for being honest. I dont want to embark on this journey and then feel it was all rather pointless.
That thing looks awesome. More outs than the Arturia and still expandable… I’'m not sure I want a control surface for it though.
Yes! This is how I’m envisaging using the patchbay. Nothing patched by default. All the synths running to the top rail and the bottom rail running to the audio interface. I can patch a synth out via an FX chain, or patch in an extra desktop synth really easily if I need to, but otherwise, its there to make sure I’m not plugging and unplugging the interface.
Ok, good call on the Samson. Seems much more flexible. Hopefully there is still enough space for the obligatory console tape!
I used Overbridge once with a Digitakt and I was really put off. It was early days for the software and it wasn’t especially stable. I now have +FX, AR, A4 and haven’t actually tried Overbridge. Probably time to review again.
2 patchbays? Is that just because you have a lot of hardware? Or is there a different logic to having a separate patchbay for the inputs and the outputs.
So the table below shows my plan. You have already been kind enough, but any further thoughts and comments welcome… also recommendations on 3U 19" rack enclosures that aren’t super ugly.
@almack77 No worries! Glad you’ve had a lot of useful responses, it’s been a good read for sure.
So my set up is aimed towards using outboard gear for sources, effects & sampling. All that eats up channels in 1 patchbay fast. Plus I lose Rig16 ins if I want to run effects sends (stereo room delay & reverb = 4 less sources). Your choice to go with expanders is solid.
I like how you’ve drawn up that spreadsheet, but does it allow for long term growth/change in your studio? No right or wrong answers, just a question I ask myself whenever I make a change to my studio (the answer is often ‘No but…’).
Re: 3ru cases that aren’t for travel/hideous. There are some really nice wooden ones on places like Etsy & Reverb but they can be expensive. A catch with wooden cases is ventilation, at least the Rig16 doesn’t get too warm.
A few years back I bought one of these Gator Elite desks (the maple one). The rack module can be set up in double & single 4ru arrangements for GAS control. Build quality is fine but I messed up construction a little. The keyboard tray’s roller is a little rough so that’s on me.
There are some beautiful producer desks out there, I just went with the most convenient & available option.
This pretty much summarizes my experience with adding a patchbay to my XR18-centered setup. A massive waste of time and money, and a huge inspiration killer.
Most of the time was spent setting it up, of course. Soldering patches, managing the extra cables. Then troubleshooting noise. Then troubleshooting noise again. By the time it was done, I no longer felt inspired by my studio, it was overly complicated with no obvious benefits to it. It became daunting, and made me focus on my OP-Z instead.
If I was going this way now, the closest I’d agree to get to a patchbay would be the Erica Synths Matrix Mixer (all the benefits plus way more without half of the disadvantages), but overall I’d definitely rather get an extendable interface with more ins and outs.
