Octatrack MKII issue discovered

You must have not been around for the very rocky start of the original Octatrack OS updates. The OS was unfinished and far from rock solid. The fact that there were still outstanding bugs even after the very last updates indicates the complexity of the problem.

Adding conditional triggers was likely a huge undertaking and a big risk. It’s not surprising that some things may have got broken in the process.

I do think that the beta testers for the Mk II probably did not pound the OS as thoroughly as they should have done. Although finding very good beta testers is an art unto itself.

i prefer the mkII by a factor of 10. love it.

there might have been a freeze after the machine was left on overnight, after some use the next day around 11am, not sure. Honestly the machine appears to be very stable in general.

oh btw, i noticed the 8 Recorder buffers actually do hold any recordings that were there before, if it is restarted, cool!

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Actually this is a pretty new practice in hardware, and even in software (mostly games, it’s a lot easier to get away with it with a game than with a tool) releasing with bugs and let the early adopters essentially do the last round of beta testing really didn’t become standard until the last 10-15 years or so. There may have been one or two minor bugfix updates (often requiring physically swapping out an EPROM) in the life of a product 20 years ago but nothing like what we see today.

It’s a mixed bag though, on one hand companies are definitely cutting corners by essentially outsourcing beta testing to their customers, but on the other hand ti’s pretty easy to update firmware today and by doing it they get a much larger pool of beta testers that at least theoretically should be able to find more bugs faster, simply by brute force. I think it comes down to the size of the company for me. Elektron is still small enough that I think there’s some practical necessity to do it this way, but it wasn’t that long ago that a release as buggy as this (or the Digitakt or the OT MKI…) could have easily (and sometimes did) ruined a company this size and would have been a pretty serious problem for a much bigger company. In the case of Elektron, it’s unfortunate but forgivable because they’re a medium sized company who put out a lot of good, innovative instruments and have an earned reputation for good, long term support. When Akai or Pioneer does something like this it’s a lot less forgivable, and they should be called out on it by customers whenever possiblet. Smaller companies, not so much (as long as they stand by their products and get them working and have some transparency about it). Having customers is a privilege, not a right.

In Elektron’s case I’m not that worried because this seems to happen on half of their releases and they always make it more or less right in a more or less timely fashion. There are still a few minor things in the OT MKI that could be fixed up but overall, the fact that the firmware hasn’t been updated in two years is a GOOD thing, because it shouldn’t need to be.

What I’m saying is, no, releasing fully tested and working products is the baseline and releasing products with buggy firmware that (hopefully - I’m looking at you, Beatstep Pro) gets fixed quickly is a recent trend and it’s natural that people would expect the thing they just bought to work, because until recently that was a safe assumption to make.

EDIT: just to clarify, this is mostly directed at companies like Akai that have the resources to not need to follow this business model and just do it to cut costs (and in the case of the Akai/Alesis/Numark/Ion/Etc conglomerate, don’t really need to cut costs because the vast majority of their profits - at least according to people I’ve known who worked there - actually come from manufacturing electric blankets - one QA guy I knew there a few years back said that for a couple weeks they were actually making QA wear the new generation of electric blankets around while they did their normal work on the MPC Renaissance beta testing, so that they could test both at once and the company wouldn’t have to hire any new people), I think Elektron has a good track record as far as dealing with this stuff goes and unfortunately, even though it’s a shitty business model it’s also the standard now and for better or worse once you reach the scale that Elektron works on it’s probably hard to be competitive (we’ll ignore the question of whether being competitive is actually a good thing) without doing it.

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Yes I find more people need to communicate here a simple fact but very important, what’s bug or feature to make better need to arrived in Elektron hands … so im mean by ticket support.
because that’s the only way it became beneficial for every users…

@Simon : you should received some on this one

Maybe it’s not relative to every users…
I don’t have mine for now

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I was originally one of the first on the list with Sweetwater for the preorder of the Octa MK2. I’ve very glad I cancelled it as I had planned on replacing my aging Macbook Pro and switching to more hardware based performance.
I own both an AR and A4 mk1 and I’m basically in love with them…but, I got them at least 1 year into production.
I can’t express how much I love those machines but they were not cheap. Had I bought the MK2 Octa and had freezes/crashes at my performances, I would probably not hold Elektron in such high regard. Any musician knows that “showstoppers” can cripple you when your starting out. I really hope Elektron decides to be above the fray and buckle down on their beta testing. I would be more than happy to help.

How does one apply for beta testing? Do you get a preproduction “loaner” to test on? That would be crazy fun!!!

Forgive me, but am I understanding correctly that you are saying the blame is on the customers for their excitement over the product?
If that’s the case, I must say I don’t understand. All of the power is in Elektron’s hands. They decide if/when to release teasers and of course to release the final product. “Pining” customers are traditionally a positive aspect for manufacturers, but I fail to see how that forces an effect on Elektron.
Again, I might not be understanding your post entirely (english is not my first language) but it seems that you are saying customers should receive input about a up coming device from a company, then contain their excitement and not let Elektron know they are excited…?

Sorry, “Pining” might not be the right word. This language is difficult :slight_smile:

Apparently there were a lot of order cancellations of the digitakt after it got delayed. So customer actions definitely have effect on release, development, etc.

Ah, yes, I can see how that has an effect. But I still think the decision to release the Product with significant issues is entirely on Elektron. I can understand the urge to push it out the door to keep preorders, but surely the argument of waiting till it’s really ready to go is stronger and would garner more orders after positive reviews right?
I know personally I looked into the Digitakt after its release but decided against it as I read several reports of freezing with MIDI and other issues. Had it been released without the MIDI freezing issue, I would have sent Elektron my money. However, I don’t direct a manufacturing company so I’m sure there is more to it then anyone who doesn’t run one can know. Either way, I trust Elektron will get it corrected eventually and I will surely be purchasing either the Digitakt or Octa MK2 when that happens.

As every first release model it can take time (a bit of firmware version…) to get stable. But I’m surprised of what you claim as Octatrack is considered as the most stable gear for live setup… (there’s other gear of course) but this one is rock solid and as the software is the same inside the OT MK2, I really think it not gonna take to much time to get at the same level of stability. (a bit of speculations but I trust Elektron for that)

Advise : take an OT Mk1 second hand instead or try it and you will see there’s not so much bug like that (I mean multiple frozen in a show, what’s the temperature around in the show ? is it hot like super hot ? sometimes it’s not the gear who’s unstable by itself)

I don’t know the specifics of how elektron runs financially but if a trend was seen of order cancellations after a delay in release date that is quite a financial impact, especially for a boutique company like elektron. Consider, preorder cancellations could have effected production funding, funding for firmware development, qc and bug fixing, money needed to produce future batches of the hardware, etc. So while ultimately the choice of when to release is elektron’s there are many factors that can influence and even force the company to make certain decisions. The market especially a niche market like synthesizers is ultimately controlled by the customers.

There is a balance to be struck though. In the short term, releasing an unfinished product might retain more preorders (and therefore cashflow) but in the long term if the company gains a reputation for broken / unreliable products they will lose their core customer base.

In software development especially though, short term pressures usually win out.

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Well you would have been happy in the 90s and early 2000s then, because relatively gutless releases were the norm.

Not sure if a bug or not but I noticed that nothing would playback when I changed record/playback from 16 bit to 24 bit until I did a hard reset of the machine. Not a big deal at all, was just going to give it a bash after @previewlounge mentioned it on another thread.

Without meaning to derail things, I would say that build quality is a step in the right direction from what I experienced with the DT I bought. No issues found at all with the buttons. I also purposefully left the OT on for ages playing the same two patterns. No issues at all. I never play live but I thought I’d see how stability was for me and no issues so far.

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something to mention - always use standard letters or numbers when naming Projects, Parts, Samples or a Set.

years ago the mkI started acting up when i named a Set with something other than standard letters and numbers.

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I’m very happy on the whole with my mk2. One thing I e found is xvol on scenes doesn’t work consistently. Anyone else found this?

probably the same as the XLV bug addressed at Octatrack MKII (MK2/2nd Gen) specific bugs thread

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That’s a left over bug from mk1, after changing mem config you need to power cycle or save project before making changes then reload project after…

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Happened 2x today. On the Sample AED screen. If you let it sit too long, whole machine locked up.

In 25 years I didn’t buy any buggy machines. That’s new to me. Release before properly working Os too.
That said, if it works almost perfectly at the end, with original functions, musical and sound possibilities, why not.
First buyers = beta testers ? So be it.
I won’t pay to be a beta tester.

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