More Machines? Seriously, we need them

Elektron Gear Analog Rytm
#1

I purchased my Rytm a few months ago and have been for the most part pretty happy. Personally, I don’t really see the point of OB until it has a sequencer built in as my machine sits in a rack about 6 feet from my desk. Using OB right now means I have to go to the machine to put notes in so I end up not using OB except for sample management and SDS Drop pretty much put a knife into that too (you flipping rule Void, maybe you should work for Elektron…?).

With that said, and with OB being the main focus for quite some time now, do we have a time line for new machines???

I’m honestly shocked that my $1500 drum synth has several voices that are the same “synthesis” as an Akai Rythm wolf (way better sound of course but still…). I love p-locks and can get some excellent results from them, but seriously, Tune, tone and that’s it??

I’m sure others have brought this up and I’m sure I would have found them if the search feature wasn’t such a mess (the same topic takes up 4 pages of searches).

I realize OB is still in beta after a year +, but I’m really bummed I didn’t wait and just get a Machinedrum (which has something like 60+ machines) for a fraction of the price.

So, I’d love to hear from someone (hopefully from Elektron) about an eta on some new cymbal, hats, toms, etc… machines. If it’s all OB stuff for the next year, this thing needs to go to someone else who is more patient.
I thought I read somewhere there was supposed to be a ring mod kick in 2014. Was that ever released? did I miss it somehow? If not, was there an explanation why it hasn’t arrived in the past few years?

This was one of the biggest expenses I’ve picked up for music in awhile and I’m starting to get buyers remorse which really sucks for such a promising instrument. I can’t even feel good about owning an elektron sequencer since they decided to cut’s it’s legs out from underneath it (aka no midi out…wtf?).

Anyway, I’m sure I’ll catch some guff from some fan boys about how I’m entitled or something, but this is my honest opinion and I can’t imagine I’m alone.

#2

I used to be like you a year ago. Once you get past the year and a half mark, I think you kind of stop caring. I don’t expect any development with the RYTM anymore because you will never get any deadlines, you will never know what gets updated, and there’s been 1 significant update after two years. You gotta accept what you got. Elektron doesn’t like to communicate these types of things.

#3

There was a post from an elektron official during 1.22 news that the new machines weren’t planned for “this update”. Considering of “this”, my assumption is that they are planned.

Can someone explain a noob to synthesis like me what might be a “new” machine might be? I know there is a ring mod bass drum in the works…what do you imagine others to be? Or what would you like to see?

#4

Hmm, your post started well, but ended… hmm, a bit aggressively. Perhaps you should sell the AR and trade it for a machinedrum UW? Kinda reads to me like your mind is made up already…

#5

I’m totally agree with the OP. The only things I miss in the AR are at least 3/4 of the machines of the MD, and a basic MIDI Out to sync with other gear. Program changes send aren’t very useful except with few grooveboxes. OB is…meh.

#6

The akai drum machine doesn’t have tweakable amp & filt envelopes, or even a single tweakable filter, let alone 12 individual ones that can switch between types…

I ordered my rytm as soon as it was announced all those long and lonesome patches ago, and I still haven’t come close to rinsing out all the sounds in the available engines.

For my latest track I did some minot adjustments to the clap tracks amp & filt env and made a really convincing Maraca sound. Then I gave it some shake with the lfo and plocked some varying velocities and delay sends and bam.

I didn’t even have to wait 2 years for elektron to finally release that maraca ring mod engine they promised me.

#7

If i wanted anything it would be a second filter (much like the A4) to spice things up a bit.

Often find the single filter def makes the rytm sound very rytm’y

#8

@Prints: Well…damn, all I can say is I hope you are wrong.

@xidnpniss: “Machines” are Elektrons version of Subtractive Synthesis. Some machines have most of the components of Sub. Synthesis, but half are very stripped down.

I sincerely hope that the next update will have at least one machine for hats or cymbals, those are the most basic to me and would really benefit from some more options on the current machines or some new machines with more than what they offer now.

@tsutek: I don’t share your opinion that I became “aggressive” but I’ll try and be more sensitive in the future. For the record, I haven’t made up my mind which is why I put up the post. If someone from Elektron confirms another year of OB betas, then yes, my mind will be made up and RYTM will be sent away. I really enjoy elements of it so when more machines eventually/hopefully come, I’ll probably buy it again. In the meantime, my money could be spent better elsewhere.

#9

I know most AR owners know already but in the manual it has a picture thing of RingMod BD…

#10

I’d like to see a hat/ cymbal machine with a noise generator with selection of white, pink, blue, red noise. Gimmie the rainbow!

Ringmod bass is loooong overdue! It would be cool if they implemented a feedback machine similar to the A4/ keys oscillator option.

But i’m doing quite alright with the limited options currently available :slight_smile:

#11

I’m feeling a bit like the OP in the sense of: I expected more variety of machines once I bought it, since I really wanted to get rid a bit of sound libraries. Once I had my disapointment, I finally ended up using it with my own samples, using only analog machines to layer sometimes. I kept it thanks to the new routing and sound processing cappabilities, if the last update hadn’t occurred, I’d have sold it.

Not saying AR isn’t amazing, which it is, but seeing how Elektron has updated Analog Four during this time, I expected more love to AR. It’s a great machine, but right now it seems still unfinished, or at least a “wannabe” version of the full potential machine it could really be (or it will be, I hope).

I’m quite happy with it now, and I definitely need to learn more about it since i know only a little part of it, but it’s a bummer to see only a big update after 2 years.

Last but not least, about OB: I find it really useful (it avoids me menu diving, lets me easily automate parameters in Ableton, and easily record my stuff in different channels without routing to my sound card). It’s the best integration between software and hardware I’ve probably seen.
But I think that from now, Elektron’s main effort shouldn’t be OB but the machines itselves (AR on the top of that, the one that lacks more work). Or at least, split ALL the updates: OB in one hand, AR in the other, and A4 appart too. Why? Because providing the updates all in pack (OB + machines) just causes OB to massively delay the machine updates. I really doubt they needed one year of development to add trig conditions to AR. And Seeing how A4 had also trig conditions, once this implementation was done, the AR update could have been released a long time ago while they were still working on A4 and OB.

Sorry for the toast

#12

f**k, this new-machines-threads start to get a hold on me.
elektron, please i beg you to listen just one time. you should have reacted to this misery long ago. from the waters of forgetfulness evil took the chance and cursed all new-machines threads.
elektron, know thy sword shall sing once again. the blundering thread visitor falls for an evil spell to whinge about his bewilderment there still are no frikkin niu machiines!

#13

@Mattleaf, @VanillaSun: YES! I think having a selectable (or even a morphable so you could slowly blend between two types) noise parameter would be a huge improvement.
Also, an extra LFO on the Synth page that only controlled other parameters on that page would be really great too and most likely a lot less work than a fully assignable LFO.
Imagine a big crash that has an LFO (Sine) morphing between the different noises as it decays. That would be gorgeous!

@HnT: I share your disappointment. When I got the Rytm I thought it would be 90% Synthesis with 10% samples. There aren’t many voices on any project that are just synthesis. Every voice I use has to be layered with samples to get a great sound with the exception of the Kick and Snare. But even those are mostly samples too.

I really thought I was buying a drum synth with sample support but I feel it’s really a (very very limited) sample machine with some synthesis support. Don’t get me wrong, with the right samples and the analog pathway, I’m getting good results. But again, a $1500 drum synth should be a monster at actual synthesis.

Lastly, I agree, the AK/A4 have had some good loving for themselves but now it seems AR is wrapped up in OB and AK/A4 development. This is another disappointment as AR is the most expensive and newest machine, yet it feels like a very low priority. It doesn’t make sense.

Anyone at Elektron care to chime in? As the OP I want to express that this is not a thread intended to bash elektron. I know I can get a little frustrated and it can seem that way but it’s not my intention. This thread is to let them see that some of there customers are feeling pretty down on how this amazing machine is crawling towards it’s potential at an alarming slow rate. OB has some awesome features but the AR needs your attention. I really don’t want to sell this machine as I know I’ll want it again when it’s finally getting the love it deserves. As well as the fact that ebay is getting more AR’s every day at the sub $1200 range, a pretty sizable loss from my original $1500. Me thinks other users are bailing due to the issues spelled out in this thread.

#14

Well. I think its really great. Sounds so nice. Fm synthesis is great too. Love the seq and retrig, scenes, performance, fxcomp and distorsion sounds awesome. And it will be an update for the rytm. Im not really worried about that. They always do…

#15

It would be great to be able to design our own custom machines…

#16

It would be nice if those “new machines” threads provided suggestions based on what the synth engines can do. We do not know the exact synthesis engines for all tracks, but there are things we can guess:

  • Bottom 4 pads use 2 oscillators with variable waveforms and Decay envelope for volume and pitch, a noise source with color, the ability to modulate one oscillator with the other (FM), a transient tick.
  • BT/LT/MT/HT seem to be resonant filters (the decay time depends on the pitch) with an envelope on frequency and a noise source with color, BT has different exciter waveforms
  • Hats are 6 oscillators. There is control on their tuning
  • Cowbell/Cymbal have 6 oscillators. Only 2 of them are used for the Cowbell
    => There may be other available parameters we don’t know about. But we could already think of different machines that use what we know is available.
    Not that Elektron would be forced to implement them in the end, but at least, it would be more constructive :wink:
#17

+10

#18

then, maybe a tempest?

#19

Yeah, I did buy the Rytm as an analogue machine first and foremost, but I quickly adapted to using the analogue machines to supplement samples rather than vice versa, as I’d expected. Would be nice to have some more variety and control for sure - the A4 is my go-to drum synth -but I wouldn’t say that I “need” them … “misery” would definitely be overstating it. Tbh, a 100% reliable Overbridge version is way more important to me than new machines.

#20

In my opinion Overbridge is totally overrated. I think the great thing about dedicated HW synths is that they are not tied to a PC, plus the development of OB apparently tied up a lot of Elektron’s human resources.

New machines would be very much appreciated, of course.

It would probably be a good idea to be constructive about this and tell Elektron exactly what we want.

A machine that generates different kinds of noise would be a start, for example (off the top of my head).

More flexible hihat machines would be another (that’s not very detailed, I know) (and yea, I know that you can hipass other machines to get hihat like sounds, but still)

One thing that is very nice about the Machine Drum is the per-Track Ring Modulation feature. Too late to do that in the AR, I guess, but at least new machines could have that feature (or even existing ones, some have unused params)