Will Brexit bring prices down in UK if we do a WTO deal


No, and I don’t think anyone was suggesting that. I guess the point is, anyone would have a hard time quantifying the variety of reasons that prompted voters to choose one way or the other, especially when there is huge regional / demographic variation. But, yes immigration was a large part of the debate.

Darenager - Ironically, the NHS is hugely dependent on EU migrants, there is a huge shortfall on nationally trained nurses and so most Trusts have gone on huge recruitment drives throughout the EU and further afield (Phillipines) to try and cover the gap. Perhaps paying nurses more would be an idea for solving the recruitment and retention crisis!


I’d heard an interesting angle that some of the leave voters in rural areas did so in order to spite London; being such a magnet for most of the country’s wealth.

Nothing to do with racism, xenophobia, let alone even the EU.
They just wanted to piss off the wealthy metropoles in the capital for looking down on/neglecting the country folk.


I agree, the UK handling of illegal immigrants was definitely a factor especially in poorer areas.


Concentrate most of the country’s wealth around one place, cut services and funding to others (there has been blatant corruption with regards to which councils were given the most severe treatment as opposed to those that weren’t) and it’s understandable why people are frustrated. We have a tertiary economy that swells the coffers of a small group, whilst many others end up working for companies like Sports Direct with terrible working conditions.


No argument from me, and I don’t think skilled EU migration ever was an issue for people who decided to vote leave. I find it staggering that nurses have to pay to train when the logical course of action would be to have apprenticeships where they can train for free whilst working and earning.


They have not long ago reintroduced tuition fees for nursing degrees, safe to say the current government has no interest in ensuring the UK has a functioning NHS. I used to work for health unions before moving away so it is a particular bug bear of mine! At least Elektronauts has stimulated some interesting debate :slight_smile:


LOL. I’m not the one making the claim that MAGA types are racist so I haven’t a thing to prove. Go ahead and see if you can substantiate your claim, as parroted by the media.


I hate to say it, and I mean absolutely no disrespect to the hard working people in the NHS, but for at least the last 15 years the NHS has not been very good at all, in rural areas most people do not have a dentist, to get a GP appointment often means a two week wait, and many other problems which go back beyond the current government. I have not lived in London for over 20 years now, so I do not know the situation there but I don’t imagine it to be much better.

Speaking of Poland what do you make of the current situation with Poland and the EU?


Interested in this one for sure.

Also, regarding Brexit, specifically, I seem to recall that some of the initial heartburn years ago was over Belgium telling the UK to pay up to the tune of hundreds of millions of £ annually. I don’t recall immigration having had much to do with this. It was in fact an issue with national sovereignty, at least for the Brexiteers.


The NHS has been subjected to numerous challenges - several unnecessary restructures that cost a lot of money (health and social care act being the main one), cuts to funding (i.e. not increasing in line with inflation) privatisation of the most profitable services, serious understaffing etc. The previous government left us with unnecessary Wonga style repayment loans to fund new buildings that will cost many times what they cost to build, it’s fair to say that the track record of governments is somewhat chequered, but I’d honestly say (despite not being a supporter of Major, Blair, Brown, Cameron, May) that it’s far worse now, due to funding issues primarily. It still scores highly in comparison to most other healthcare systems in terms of efficiency of use of resources etc.

I’m not so hot on current Polish politics unfortunately, but from what I have read, the deliberate attempts to undermine the separation of powers by appointing senior members of the judiciary is a major sticking point…you may know more about it than me!


Im done with this btw. This is a UK thread.




I’d be happier for AU & NZ need to engage with where they are actually located on the planet. Trade and politics suggest this might be a better idea.

NZ has been more effective at this with other Pacific nations in the past than AU.


yes, despite the historical ties it would make more sense for us (NZ) to focus on Aus & the Pacific.
I do sometimes wonder about some kind of alliance between Scandinavia/Australasia/Canada… a NATO of relative sanity without imperial ambitions…


I for one would just like to say thank you to the Admins and all other contributors.

I can’t think of any other forum I visit where political debate is allowed. It’s usually writ large that it’s something you’ll get banned for discussing.


I think the high standard of moderating in place here keeps away the shitkickers who usually make this kind of dialogue impossible!


I think it’s not what, but how something is debated. IMO almost all Elektronauts seem to be very polite and civilized persons. It’s a great community and I am happy that I can be a part of it.


I’d like to echo the last few posts.

Thanks to everyone that has made this is a respectful conversation.




Hate to be that guy but all of this messing around will be so inconsequential in the next decade when we realise just how far we’ve travelled down the path of mass extinction.