It's unlikely that we'll ever get kits on the Dark Trio, but I had an idea

After gaining some experience I think my preferred implementation of kits on Digitakt would now be this:

  • 8 “bank sounds” per pattern bank, one per track, called “bank kits” or just “kits”. Therefore 16 kits per project.
  • You can assign (toggle) the bank sounds to the tracks by holding TRK and then holding FUNC and pressing TRIG buttons. Easy to swap the persistent sounds in and out, or you could just use them as an Octatrack style part/kit, associated with the bank.
  • To edit the sounds you just swap them in
  • To save/restore the “bank kit” to/from project hold TRK and press YES for save and NO for restore. Can also use Save Ptn and Reload Ptn which use the temporary buffer instead of save/load to/from project.
  • You can transfer a track’s default sound to any bank sound by using the normal track copy/paste operations. Useful to make a sound that you like persistent on the fly.

Introducing TRACK LOCK.

TRACK LOCK lets you set one or more tracks to never change its sound on a pattern change, and optionally to keep playing the same sequence. Now you can continue tweaking a sound without it changing on you when you switch patterns, or mix-and-match tracks from different patterns.

Locked tracks flash orange when they play notes, and sequence-locked tracks flash yellow.

To enter TRACK LOCK mode, hold [TRK] and press [PTN]. The status of each track is shown on the trig buttons. Normal tracks in white, locked tracks in orange, and sequence-locked tracks in yellow. To change the lock status of a track simply press the corresponding [TRIG] and it will cycle between normal, locked, and sequence-locked. To reset all tracks to normal status at any time, hold [TRK], then [PTN], and then press [NO].

To change a locked track to normal status without locking the sequence, hold [FUNC] when pressing [TRIG]. Going from locked to normal in this way is effective immediately. The sound will be loaded from the currently playing pattern and you will lose all changes. Using this method on a sequence-locked track will load the sound from the pattern but continue playing the locked sequence until the next pattern cycle or change, whichever comes first. Note that, conversely, when you lock a track, the sound becomes untethered from the pattern it was loaded from and will no longer affect the sound stored in the pattern.

If the sequencer is playing, going from sequence-locked to normal or using the reset function described above is effective on the next pattern cycle or change, whichever comes first. If the sequencer is stopped, it is effective immediately. Tracks that are queued to return to normal status will appear flashing white in TRACK LOCK mode.

Saving the current pattern works a little differently when there are locked tracks. When the SAVE TO PROJ function is used while there are one or more locked tracks, you will be asked whether you want to save the locked tracks over whatever is in the pattern, only save unlocked tracks, or cancel.

When saving to the temporary area, all tracks are saved, regardless of their status. However, the pattern sequences and sounds aren’t lost. The untethered track states are saved in the temporary area as well as the normal pattern data, so that when you reload the pattern, any locked tracks are as you saved them, and when you unlock any of them, the track(s) “hidden beneath” are restored. Reloading a pattern does not change the lock status of any tracks.

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Precisely - something like this maybe?

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this is brilliant, this is (for me, anyway) the final piece of the puzzle!

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…for individual patterns/tracks/trigs ?..doubtful…
within the song mode logistics for whole patterns exclusive ?..reasonable…i guess…
nice detail…

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Suggestion (if you haven’t already done this)

  • add an entry for each box to the relevant feature request thread, linking here.
  • submit a formal feature request for each box.

That will be hard for elektron to ignore.

I like the way you’ve thought through how to actually implement it. I’ve seen so many feature requests which make me think, well, okay, but how exactly are you going to implement that in the UI, because I can’t see a way to squeeze it in ?

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One of the main reasons I no longer use my A4 is its kits implementation, I really dislike it. The uniqueness of every pattern is a real plus, from my point of view, on the Digitone and Digitakt.

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great idea! the big E have really opened the Digi worm can now haven’t they

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Maybe this would be even better than kits in one area. Not sure…
On a4 plocks and here more important live rec plocks are stored with pattern anyway, mangling and ptn changing without thinking is limited.
I imagined using dn songmode mostly by going to loop mode, improvising with plock and rec plock, ctrl-all, then reload ptn and leaving loop mode.
Your method would bring lots of nice other possibilities.

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I like this - didn’t think it could be squeezed into the song editor but you proved me wrong! I suppose it should open a popup like the mute column does, where you can edit which tracks should be locked.

The only problem I see is a whether it would be okay to have a potential inconsistency with song mutes, which can’t be unmuted (an annoying design choice). Do we allow unlocking of song-locked-tracks while song mode is enabled?

My preference is to avoid the question altogether and not have song track locks. Simply because of this issue but also because it would be less work for Elektron.

My REAL preference is to have song track locks and also change how song mutes work, making them work as a one-time event rather than an unchangeable state.

yea i tend to agree with you. I understand the benefits kits bring but I personally prefer no kits, the way I work. I used to overwrite kits on a daily basis on my A4 & MD :laughing:

tho maybe now with song mode I may begin to desire em. haven’t tried it yet.

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I’ve overwritten kits I needed for other things, I’ve failed to remember the weird non-saving thing, it’s just one more level of inconsistent faffing that my tiny brain rejoices is not part of my Digitone. Even contemplating a Digitakt now, got one on loan. Only the meagre 1Gb of fixed sample storage is putting me off compared to my Octatrack - but at least every pattern would be unique. Wonder why they didn’t just add an SD card slot or something…

I had given this some though as well last week and what I had come up with is essentially the same but I would call them Pattern Groups. I haven’t fired up my DT but I seem to recall an available blank parameter slot on an appropriate page. Pattern Groups could either be ‘Off’ or assigned to a group from 1 to 16 (or an appropriate number that memory could handle). Any pattern who’s group is matched to the active pattern will have their parameters mirrored/persistent between pattern changes.

I’m no programmer but I’m sure this could be done in a hash/table by adding a new field for ‘Pattern Groups’. On pattern change, the machine loads parameter settings from that table. Something to that effect.

This setup wouldn’t allow for proper Kits to be saved but would function more like Parts I suppose. Essentially the same thing and would solution for the problem at hand.

@Roger - In response to your first post, I suppose pressing a TRIG repeatedly in this SONG MODE MUTE PAGE mode, would cycle between:

Normal (un-muted),

Muted,

Sound-locked (i.e the track sound parameter changes are muted, but note events still register),

Seq-locked ( per step trigs still active (!!))

and presumably the icons for each track would alter to reflect these 4 states as per my very crude scribbling below. (nb I renamed page from MUTE to TRACK PAGE - its still a single page)

Not sure how this would work from a FX perspective…

The midi tracks would of course just toggle between muted/unmuted in response to repeated TRIG presses in this context.

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…i love the a4…since ages by now…still struggle with kits from time to time, no matter how much i’m aware of all advantages the concept of kits has to offer…

with this inbetween locking feature, it could bring best of both worlds to the actual square to be there trio of swedish devices…

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Yeah I agree with you @reeloy. This seems like really good thinking, nice work @Roger.

I love using kits, I’m OK with the idea that they don’t fit within the Digi-box paradigm, but it feels like a solution is needed to really get the most out of Song Mode — and this would address it head on.

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This! I actively hated kits on A4 and would always make a new kit for each pattern and then compulsively save them. This made kits useless and I would still accidentally lose sounds from time to time. An in between solution for transitioning and tweaking like the track locks would be awesome!

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Done; although I only sent one feature request since there’s only a single email address.

I also posted on M:C and M:S’s feature request threads because why not :slight_smile:

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I came up with this one earlier this year. I want kits, goddamnit!

What I really want is to be able to choose what sounds stay the same throughout per track. So my kick, for example, is always the same, but some of my synths can easily be switched up.

I don’t know if there’s really a good solution that would work for everyone, but I think we can all agreed that we need some way for slowly evolving live tweaks to flow into the following patterns for fluidity.

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What I wonder about the implementation of this. What happens if you lock a track sound, change the sound, then save the pattern, does it save the locked sound to that track on the pattern?

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My guess would be to throw up a warning asking the user what they’d like to do. Save the locked track(s) in the pattern, save only unlocked tracks, or cancel. If they cancel, they can unlock if that’s not what they wanted, and save again. (This warning always comes up if there are one or more locked tracks.)