Too tied to DAW plugins for my sound

Anyone else in this boat? I’m now so used to using certain plugins on my DAWs, that I’m finding it difficult to work outside of the box.

I especially miss side-chaining compression or frequency duckers like SmoothOperator.

I can get most of where I need to be with EQ and compression on my QU24, but my typical routing now is:

Kick side-chaining into bass with SmoothOperator ducking frequencies on the bass based on the kick.

Then a combination of the resultant kick and bass ducking frequencies in pretty-much everything else.

Side-chain compression would probably be enough for me to achieve what I’m after, but it’s not quite the same.

So, for live gigs/on-stage, I’m now gravitating back to the laptop running Ableton solution. Anyone got thoughts on this conundrum?

I guess one obvious solution, would be to use a laptop purely for the plug-ins and as a mixing device, but that would feel live overkill.

Not sure what hardware you have. But how important is it for you to have a polished mix when playing live?

Could you live without it, and instead get more hands on control, and less distance between you as an artist and your instruments?

What conundrum? Use the laptop if it provides what you want.

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If I’m using a laptop, I may as well be running most of the set from Ableton.

The ideal, is to get away from the laptop, and not use on on-stage. …but it seems that I might be more closely tied to it than I intended or realised.

I have a fair bit of hardware, but for most gigs I can envisage at the minute, I’m likely to be short of space and set-up time.

From that angle, laptop as core is arguably my better bet. Polished sound is quite important.

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Some people bounce stems from the computer and play them live.

Or consider your laptop a synth and sequence the vsts from a hardware box. That’s what I do.

Serum is a million times more powerful than any hardware synth I have.

And yes. Going outside the box creates a scenario where you’ll need to be comfortable with a less polished and detailed track. There can be something cool about that if it’s done right.

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Check out his live setup, I like how his computer is integrated/hidden and the screen is more like a DJ setup. He’s doing BitWig but Live could easily be substituted.

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Please forgive me, but why is using a DAW for this function a problem? You write as if there is some expectation that you don’t use a DAW. It seems like you’re happy to use one for some of your performance… why not use it for more of your performance, if it’s going to be with you anyway.

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I used too, especially when I first started moving into more hardware.
There were a few Reaktor ensembles I thought I couldn’t live without.
I really had to force myself to leave the computer out of my rig.
8 years later, I’m completely over it.
Now if I do try to integrate my computer into the audio chain I’m quick to realize how much I can’t stand my computer in the rig.

Be ok having a different sound. You don’t need side chain compression to have good music. Focus on levels and MAYBE eq, but mostly levels, and you’ll be ok

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For live gigs, I’d prefer not to have a laptop in the system for various reasons. I can’t afford to have a dedicated machine, which I don’t update to new OSes etc., since I also use it for work.

So, having dedicated kit, which is arguably better built for lugging around to gigs, is preferable - if possible.

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Thanks for explaining. It’s much more clear now.

On that subject - I notice that Steinberg has a new Mainstage-type system. Might look into that at some point. I have 2 Macs, so possibly worth keeping the old cylinder Mac Pro, to run that on at home.

Why not get a sampler that can hold all your loops and use that live, then all your instruments and effects can be in the samples?

That should still allow a degree of freedom wrt to improv, tweaking etc.

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This is a classic forum problem. Non-forum-using pro: what’s the easiest, most reliable way to perform the music I want? Laptop and Ableton? Done.

Us forum folks: how can I make this complicated enough so that I can justify buying new gear?

I’m including myself in this, lest it come over as judgmental.

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This is exactly what I’m toying with at the moment… torn between using Ableton/Push 2/Laptop as the core, or recording up to 8 stems per song across 8 tracks on an MPC and having fader/mix control over those 8 with a Novation Launch Control XL.
The reason it’s tough for me to commit at the moment is that I’m still writing/finishing the tracks to be played at the first gig… which is in 5 weeks.

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Actually, I’ve been using this forum for years.

I think you might be misrepresenting what I’m actually asking.

I’m asking for opinions on whether or not to use a DAW as a live mixing system.

There’s nothing wrong with using a DAW for a live performance, especially if it works and you like doing it. You make the rules for yourself and your own workflow.

…we can always argue, a computer on stage might be not that sexy in first place…

but no one who’s making some kind of living from performing on stage can argue, it’s not essential to show up with a polished mix…bigger soundsystems and bigger venues don’t forgive unpolished material…

performing electronic music truuly live is a myst…
vast majority out there don’t see any difference, if ur show is based on only hitting play or ur constantly twiddeling every single element…but they can hear and feel the difference…

and there’s no way around truuly polished results without computers…
with some rare exeptions in certain genres/styles and their minimal/liminal approaches…

and i gave up on all this everlasting and overshadowing make believe struggle by performing with ot’s…
still the only device, where ur polished sonic results can join any amount of whatever and however u wanna perform ur stuff without a real computer on stage, at the end of the night…

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…aaaand if ur stage is just the dj booth…why not run a laptop with ableton or bitwig…
same goes for big stages, where any kind of computer backbone can rest on sidestage…

if ur a truu live performer, always focus for each track what elements u really like to perform live for real and leave the rest to some flexible playback, so that u can really enjoy what ur doing, really gain impact and make an obvious difference to the average dj…
if not, don’t bother and be a dj…

or go real live in electronics and admit that u need a band to do so…

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