Thomann Germany refuses 2nd Hand Warranty / Guarantee

TrabanT · 2014-04-30T12:00:14.000Z

Sehr geehrter Herr TrabanT,

vielen Dank für die Rückmeldung.

Da Sie das Gerät von einem unserer Kunden erworben haben, können wir Ihnen keine Serviceleistungen im Rahmen der Gewährleistung anbieten.

Gewährleistung bedeutet, dass der Verkäufer dem Käufer die Sache frei von Sach- und Rechtsmängeln überlassen muss. Gemäß § 437 BGB bestimmt die Gewährleistung oder auch Sachmängelhaftung die Rechtsfolgen und Ansprüche des Käufers gegen den Verkäufer. Gewährleistungsansprüche bestehen nur zwischen dem Verkäufer und dem Käufer.

Durch den Weiterverkauf wurde unser ursprünglicher Kunde zum Verkäufer. Sie sind keine Vertragspartei des ursprünglichen Vertrages zwischen uns und “Ihrem” Verkäufer. Bitte wenden Sie sich an diesen.

Für weitere Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen

Nein · 2014-04-30T12:07:31.000Z

Ausgezeichnet.

TrabanT · 2014-04-30T12:25:19.000Z

then I said to them there is a Producers Warranty / Guarantee resting on the unit …

and look at this:

Sehr geehrter Herr TrabanT,

die von Ihnen erwähnte Herstellergarantie ist jedoch an den Kaufvertrag geknüpft. Sie sind jedoch keine Vertragspartei dieses Kaufvertrages.

Es gibt jedoch die Möglichkeit einer Abtretungserklärung, in der der ursprüngliche Käufer an den neuen Besitzer die gesetzlichen Gewährleistungsansprüche abtritt.
Ein Muster hänge ich dieser Mail als pdf.Dokument an.

Bitte senden Sie uns diese vollständig ausgefüllt und vom ursprünglichen Käufer sowie von Ihnen unterschrieben im Original zu.

Teilen Sie uns bitte auch mit, wie sich der Defekt äußert. Für die weitere Vorgehensweise werden wir Sie entsprechend informieren.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen

husc · 2014-05-01T14:11:24.000Z

""TrabanT"":

then I said to them there is a Producers Warranty / Guarantee resting on the unit …

and look at this:

Sehr geehrter Herr TrabanT,

die von Ihnen erwähnte Herstellergarantie ist jedoch an den Kaufvertrag geknüpft. Sie sind jedoch keine Vertragspartei dieses Kaufvertrages.

Es gibt jedoch die Möglichkeit einer Abtretungserklärung, in der der ursprüngliche Käufer an den neuen Besitzer die gesetzlichen Gewährleistungsansprüche abtritt.
Ein Muster hänge ich dieser Mail als pdf.Dokument an.

Bitte senden Sie uns diese vollständig ausgefüllt und vom ursprünglichen Käufer sowie von Ihnen unterschrieben im Original zu.

Teilen Sie uns bitte auch mit, wie sich der Defekt äußert. Für die weitere Vorgehensweise werden wir Sie entsprechend informieren.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen

Well that’s a good solution!

I have no idea what the document looks like, but you can forward it to the original owner, have him fill it out, scan it and return the signed document to thomann with an explanation of the problem. My german is not that lousy after all.

TrabanT · 2014-05-01T15:26:39.000Z

""husc"":

[quote=“TrabanT”]then I said to them there is a Producers Warranty / Guarantee resting on the unit …

and look at this:

Sehr geehrter Herr TrabanT,

die von Ihnen erwähnte Herstellergarantie ist jedoch an den Kaufvertrag geknüpft. Sie sind jedoch keine Vertragspartei dieses Kaufvertrages.

Es gibt jedoch die Möglichkeit einer Abtretungserklärung, in der der ursprüngliche Käufer an den neuen Besitzer die gesetzlichen Gewährleistungsansprüche abtritt.
Ein Muster hänge ich dieser Mail als pdf.Dokument an.

Bitte senden Sie uns diese vollständig ausgefüllt und vom ursprünglichen Käufer sowie von Ihnen unterschrieben im Original zu.

Teilen Sie uns bitte auch mit, wie sich der Defekt äußert. Für die weitere Vorgehensweise werden wir Sie entsprechend informieren.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen

Well that’s a good solution!

I have no idea what the document looks like, but you can forward it to the original owner, have him fill it out, scan it and return the signed document to thomann with an explanation of the problem. My german is not that lousy after all.[/quote]
@ husc … that is true … but Thomann shouldn’t IMHO make such a fuzz in the first place … I may not get the original buyer who sold the unit to me to sign the document … 2nd hand purchase …

I was given a document to fill out and sign, B U T .,… Thomann refused in the first instance to give me warranty at all …

that is soooo fucking dodgy and malicious, I could throw my OT in their faces and collect their gold from their greedy teeth to buy an AR and an OT

TrabanT · 2014-05-02T12:24:33.000Z

update:

Thomann accepted the signed document which I had from the original buyer (stating he would give me 2nd hand users warranty) and asked me to ship in the faulty unit.

Then they would inspect it and depending on their assessment would either handle it as a warranty claim, or bill me …

… totally (!!!) ignoring, that I already talked with Elektron and they said it is a warranty issue, and ignoring a video link which I supplied showing the broken button

damn!

I had it with thomann.de FOR SURE

(bought goods for over 2000 Euro from that online retailer and get treated like that)

husc · 2014-05-02T12:29:42.000Z

Trabant, I understand your frustration. Just realize that they are a big distributor and their methods are also to protect them and their customers from any legal problems. There are always two sides to a story and when dealing with money/warranty there’s always a lot of added emotion. Just be glad and positive that your problem will hopefully be fixed.

TrabanT · 2014-05-02T12:37:28.000Z

""husc"":

Trabant, I understand your frustration. Just realize that they are a big distributor and their methods are also to protect them and their customers from any legal problems. There are always two sides to a story and when dealing with money/warranty there’s always a lot of added emotion. Just be glad and positive that your problem will hopefully be fixed.

hey husc … you are right , and yes I am frustrated … mostly to be told there is NO warranty for me , even though I hold the invoice … that pisses me off big time, I think, imho and in my not so humble frustration and aggravation THAT is the real rip off … think of what happens to the other millions of end users who do not get a signed statement from the original buyer … or loose it … jeeeee … i know I am repeating myself, but I need to speak out to protect others … I am like jesus in a way, or the 3 musketeers, or robin hoood

husc · 2014-05-02T12:48:53.000Z

""TrabanT"":

[quote=“husc”]Trabant, I understand your frustration. Just realize that they are a big distributor and their methods are also to protect them and their customers from any legal problems. There are always two sides to a story and when dealing with money/warranty there’s always a lot of added emotion. Just be glad and positive that your problem will hopefully be fixed.

hey husc … you are right , and yes I am frustrated … mostly to be told there is NO warranty for me , even though I hold the invoice … that pisses me off big time, I think, imho and in my not so humble frustration and aggravation THAT is the real rip off … think of what happens to the other millions of end users who do not get a signed statement from the original buyer … or loose it … jeeeee … i know I am repeating myself, but I need to speak out to protect others … I am like jesus in a way, or the 3 musketeers, or robin hoood[/quote]
I guess that is the true power of small communities like forums, you have a place where you can share thoughts and most of all: VENT!

Let those frustrations out, discuss them or whatever! If we can find a middle ground between venting our frustration without blaming others, designers, resellers or products we have a good thing going on.

Enjoy the weekend, have a Becks or two

TrabanT · 2014-05-02T12:58:36.000Z

okay

Y-NE · 2014-05-02T13:35:27.000Z

Hey Trabant, thanks for sharing this. I hope everything will be fine for you and that the issue is handled on warranty.

Personally I never thought there will be any problems with 2nd hand stuff like that - looking at eBay there thousands of offers for used gear with proposed rest warranty either for thomann or musicstore.de etc. For me that always was a good argument when buying stuff or to be able to call a reasonable price when selling something…

TrabanT · 2014-05-02T14:16:33.000Z

""Y-NE"":

Hey Trabant, thanks for sharing this. I hope everything will be fine for you and that the issue is handled on warranty.

Personally I never thought there will be any problems with 2nd hand stuff like that - looking at eBay there thousands of offers for used gear with proposed rest warranty either for thomann or musicstore.de etc. For me that always was a good argument when buying stuff or to be able to call a reasonable price when selling something…

Y-NE
please spread the word!
that is like: buying a (sealed) second hand condom and then arguing it was only intended as a safety measure for the first buyer
I am still facepalming the shit out of me

elektronician · 2014-05-08T11:17:58.000Z

Hey TrabanT,
Sorry to hear about your problems mate.

I am about to buy a second hand machine and I have been asking myself that warranty question actually and it states on the Elektron’s site in the FAQ under warranty:

Screenshot_2014_05_08_13_18_25.png828×414 123 KB

Elektron machines bought 2010-07-05 and later come with a three year limited warranty, starting from the date of the original purchase. Being able to prove the date of the original purchase with an invoice or a receipt is necessary if you require warranty service.
If the machine should need a repair during the warranty period no charges will be applied for parts or labor. This warranty is transferable to other owners should the Elektron machine be resold during the warranty period.

It clearly states here that the general warranty is transferable to a second hand owner as long as you have the invoice!..
I have emailed them about this and I am waiting for the reply so i will keep this tread updated when I get a response
Cheers!

TrabanT · 2014-05-09T17:29:39.000Z

after weeks (launch of AR and AK) Elektron told me they would accept the broken Octatrack and I would not have to go through Thomann.de … but then Thomann.de accepted warranty from 2nd hand owner because I had a written form from buyer no 1 …

phading · 2024-02-15T12:37:37.396Z

I was wondering about this,

2nd hand market plays a huge role in our music gear consumerism, so I find it strange how I can’t find any official information from Thomann on their Warranty policy when it comes to resold items.

Did I miss something?
Is it a grey area?
Is it a straight “no”, but with some exceptions here and there?

B_LD · 2024-02-15T14:28:28.190Z

It’s there. At least the German terms and conditions clearly mention 3 year warranty as non-transferable. The same way do all other shops exclude this as far as I can tell.

phading · 2024-02-15T14:40:49.220Z

I can’t find it,
Can you link to it, please?

Btw, Elektron does have transferable warranty on all their products! Cheers to that!

KaOsphere · 2024-02-15T14:48:35.681Z

In europe, ( EU ) warranty is one to two years, depending on product and country for any product sold to consumer. This is manufacter warranty. This is the law.

Thomann, extends this warranty to 3 years. By adding one year on their “good will”. This is retailer warranty.

Manufacter warranty is attached to the product, not the owner and starts at the time the product is sold to the first customer. This warranty is transferable to as many user as there are during the warranty period.

The retailer warranty is only given to the first owner of a product and not transferable. If you buy second hand, you loose the benefit from it.

As simple as that.

B_LD · 2024-02-15T15:01:29.633Z

Thomann German AGB

Search for paragraph 6, 1

Edit: it’s the same in their English terms.

Thespa · 2024-02-15T16:02:13.827Z

EU law I believe, not European…