I haven’t done any market research, but I have the feeling there are not too many mixers with so many CC-able parameters (incl. FX and filters). At least in that price range. Paired with a MIDI controller/sequencer you can really use it as a so-called performance mixer.
(Like others, I think arranging etc. is done in a DAW, I only see the BlueBox as a mixer that can record multitrack, no more. And for that price, that’s fair, IMHO)
Sure arranging is done in a DAW if you use one, I don’t which is why I bought a Bluebox, seems very pointless buying a Bluebox if using a DAW to me.
That is why I was saying about there being a market for people who want to record and edit (in a basic cut/copy/paste/trim/fade way) the only options are big older digital portastudios, but they are too noisy, old fashioned media, underpowered CPU so things like normalising take forever - yet they do allow extensive editing.
That said I do like the Bluebox for what it does do, it is a little noisy (I think the USB update made the noise worse) and for portable use it is very handy, but it is fair to say it is very light on features like basic editing. I tried a Blackbox twice, it has better editing but I just never enjoyed using it and found it pretty fiddly and tedious to use as a way to arrange audio.
Arm your tracks, hit record, do your 2-3 takes and drop the stems in the DAW guys. The bluebox will never come close to what you can do in 90 seconds with any DAW.
Edit: Yep and I’m saying this as a „dawless“ guy. But especially arrangement is one of the major strengths of DAWs. It’s just so very fast, easy and powerful. IMHO it’s not fair to nudge the 1010music guys into that direction because it’s a difficult task to build such kinda features into the bluebox while there’s a high chance that people won’t be satisfied nevertheless.
Sure, points taken.
I’m also really reluctant to use a computer - actually I don’t, and that’s why I never finalize any arrangement ^^ - but I have the feeling any hardware trying to compete with a DAW for arranging will feel like a computer anyway (Akai Force?). So I might as well use a computer.
Even if 1010 ended up porting extensive editing features to the BlueBox, I’m afraid the small screen would become rapidly cluttered. So I guess, it’s just not really made for that.
I wasn’t trying to do that, I was initially just responding to @Acidizer question about using the Bluebox in this manner, then replying to other posts.
I already asked for some basic editing on the 1010 forum a few years back, but as I said it seems not to be something that 1010 see as important, it is their product and I have accepted it and still use it, because for what it does do I have a use for.
I agree that fitting in too many features would make it cluttered too, I think the Blackbox suffers from this and why I ended up selling mine. However for the basic kind of editing I was thinking it could be in the timeline screen where you set the audio active, but regardless it is a moot point anyway.
I won’t clutter up the thread with why I won’t use a DAW, but it is nothing to do with being “DAW-Less” for the sake of it.
I record all my songs with the Blackbox. The workflows in the Blackbox are really fast and not cluttered at all. When a project becomes too big (16 simultaneous pads limit), I migrate the files into Loopy Pro for draft arrangement and after that to a software DAW for stem preparation.
Blackbox and Bluebox together should allow you to get as far as draft arrangement before professional mixing, skipping the Loopy Pro part in my case. That’s pretty good. Naturally, a software DAW offers more flexibility and that’s to be expected given a fully powered computer-based system.
Well it is marketed as a recorder as well as a mixer. You would think given it has a responsive touchscreen some kind of basic editing could be done.
Seems it can hardly manage recording, never mind editing.
It does record fine, I never had any problems with recording even 12 tracks at a time, it is playback where a few takes exist on the same track where the problem lies.
But yeah editing is non existent.
What is the point recording if it doesn’t play back.
I assume this is a bug, has it been acknowledged? Has it always been there? Surely not.
It doesn’t happen all the time, and yes it is a bug, not sure if it has been acknowledged - it may well have been fixed in the last update, I have not used it for multiple takes since updating, however on previous projects if I load them and they had this problem before they still do.
How I use it now is plugging in a bunch of gear and just using it to capture live jams, for that it is fine, but due to no editing if I mess up, I just re-record the whole thing again.
That’s probably what I’d do with it like 90% of the time and why I’m considering it for replacing my “cheap analog mixer + even cheaper Zoom recorder” setup. DAW-like editing is not what I’m looking for, and I absolutely don’t want to have a computer running when I make music.
After a lot of reading, Bluebox still seems to offer the best package for my use-case, although it sucks to buy something that seems to have unaddressed bugs in key features after so many updates.
Here’s my view on competitors, in case it helps anyone with a similar need:
So, BlueBox it is for me!
I’m coming from a Tascam Model 24 and it was really good for the price, I would say.
But, yeah, the BlueBox does the same and more for a smaller price and footprint
On that basis you will probably enjoy it, to be clear I wasn’t needing DAW like advanced editing, just basic copy paste stuff, like an old digital portastudio does.
But yeah for capturing multiple tracks at a time, and with midi clock (send or receive), it remains one of the very few modern options, TBH this is extremely useful to me.
Should add too, if you mess up whilst recording - say press the wrong pattern on a drum machine or whatever, it is possible just to redo that track, but for the way I work it is easier just to do the whole lot again. Takes can be recorded over and still remain on the card, so you can always comp the best bits in a DAW if that is your thing.
New Bluebox owner here and trying to figure out the best way to set everything up. My sources:
I’ve got things working pretty well, and I love the flexibility of involving or not involving the computer, and still being able to record. However, I’ve encountered 1 big issue: latency!
Specifically, this is an issue when feeding the Octatrack audio from the other sources. I think the problem is mostly due to the fact that I monitoring from my interface (Apollo X8) which has a really nice dual headphone setup. When I record parts played in real time to the OT, they end up playing back ever so slightly out of time.
As an example, when playing sounds from the computer into the OT, the signal path is:
Computer > Bluebox > OT > Bluebox > Computer (monitor)
I did a loopback test with this path and I’m seeing that it takes about 8ms round trip (not including the interface latency). That number surprised me.
I suppose I could monitor direct from the headphone output of the OT, which would in theory cut that time in half, but then I’d still have to change how I’m monitoring every time I do that.
Can anyone think of a more streamlined way to accomplish this?
The screen recently fritzed on my Bluebox and I had to raise a ticket for repair. Just thought I’d share how that worked, for those of us in the UK, and give a guide to the timelines and cost for such a repair.
The sad sight…
I raised a ticket to 1010music on 03-May-2023 and was almost immediately asked to complete an RMA form so that they could get their UK repair agent to contact me.
I followed up on 20-Mar-2023 as I didn’t hear from anyone but it turned out the 1010music folk were at Superbooth and were running a bit behind with this sort of thing (they’re a small outfit I think…happy to let that slide. I’d have rather been at Superbooth too).
On 24-May they confirmed my details had been sent to the UK repair facility, Audiocircus Ltd (http://audiocircus.co.uk), and they contacted me two days later to share their terms …and shipping details…note, I had no warranty (https://robhukin.files.wordpress.com/2023/11/terms-and-conditions.pdf).
I shipped to them using Royal Mail (24 hour, signed for with sufficient insurance which cost ~£10) on 29-May and late the following day Audiocircus emailed to say the work was complete and the unit ready to ship back (nice!).
They did highlight the following…”We’ll use DPD and we just need to let you know that we cannot accept any responsibility for loss or damage during shipping. If you prefer to arrange a collection with another courier then please just let us know.”
The bill was £128.
I hope this wasn’t already answered (search didn’t come up with a result):
Is it possible to use all the three stereo outs as headphone outs at the same time (for a “silent” live jam) while doing multitrack recording on the sdcard?
I’m curious now… what is the warranty on these things?
I’d assume I’m beyond any manufacturers warranty too.
Nice to see they offer a way to get these fixed and the total amount seems fair.
I guess the answer is “maybe”. It depends on what you mean with “use as headphone outs at the same time”:
The Bluebox can record (multitrack, or only specific tracks if you like) and output sounds at the same time, including outputting sounds to all three outputs.
Afaik you can not configure all three outputs to always mirror the main mix (i.e. including the internal effects); only one of the two extra stereo outputs can be toggled between a ‘cue mix’ (which wouldn’t include the internal effects) and a ‘main mix’ (which would). Yet if you do not use the internal effects (reverb, delay, compressor), you could set both extra outputs to act post-fader and send all inputs to each output mix – which would get you the same output on each of them.
Only one of the three stereo outs is marketed as a ‘headphone out’ and I read somewhere that it’s slightly different from the other outputs. I haven’t been able to find any technical specs on it, but would expect that this means it is able to output more power and has a lower impedance, and you would expect of a headphone out.
Does that help?
Thank you for all the information. So if I don’t use the internal effects I could send the main mix basically on all three outputs. That’s a start, so the only open question is if the two non-headphone outs are capable of driving headphones.
I intent to use it as an expensive alternative to a TC Helicon Blender.
