Such peaceful music, yet it seems that you ‘C’ red.
Cheers!
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feels a bit like copium, a very specific workflow (recording and cropping out perfect loops) that I would propose a lot of ppl would like to do!
adding this wouldn’t take away from the SP404 being what it once was, it would just add to it IMO, would need not be so complicated as there are already various places such an up front record to x bars at a certain BPM setting could live
it is absolutely a valid use case to record from some other synth at a fixed BPM for a fixed number of bars.
From a smart phone/ipad or softsynth in a DAW for instance, not to mention modular
In such cases you can absolutely start playing the loop from the beginning
it should always be loud enough to trigger the recording threshold (unless you are doing something wrong)
you have set the BPM therefore know the BPM up front
and I doubt the DAW/Softsynth/modular clock is going to be wildly out of time (but YMMV i guess)
but also one flow is to just take a whole bunch say 20 bars of recording for at a fixed BPM then slim it down to 2-4 afterwards. Having a selectable window to select/crop a perfect 2-4 bars (after the fact) at a certain BPM from this jam of 20 bars is something I do all the time and would LOVE to have on the SP. Also just leave skip back listening and jump in when you heard something good and then crop the perfect loop after.
regarding your suggestions why Roland should not add perfect looping to this to the machine:
- the workarounds (eg this, this and this) to achieve perfect loops take extra time/hassle/?mathematics when other devices (DT, M8, Smpltrek, MPC, Maschine, Koala etc etc) prove it need not be like this
- the moment they added things like TR-Rec mode I think they showed they don’t only care exclusively about sample flipping from vinyl
- saving then importing a file is not convenient and takes away from the immediacy of generating some cool synth loop and immediately sampling for further chopping/processing in the SP
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That’s what they all say. But the #1 complaint I see now about the 404 in, say, the KO II forums is that its many options and weird button combos are too hard to learn. And this when none of those combinations are actually necessary to use the 404 in the way originally intended (when it was hailed as being “simple” and “immediate”). People don’t see “here’s the core plus this other stuff we can ignore because it just adds to it.” They see the whole mess.
It turns out “just adding to it” isn’t free, so that cost must be justified. That’s certainly harder to do with a niche feature that’s already possible (if more a hassle) with what already exists. But maybe they’ll think it’s worth it? Who knows?
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Same as the MPC’s
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Personally I think the SP404 mk2 does a pretty good job doing what is advertised on the surface level/ui experience, barring a few UX oddities, and I’d rather have the options to dig a bit deeper when necessary than not.
Not every device will suit our own personal experiences, knowledge, or heck even needs. Just like everything else in life, there is no perfect solution, and at some point we all need to make compromises. At the end of the day, these things are all instruments after all… make more music 
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Agree to disagree, if one can figure out end snap then one could figure out setting a fixed length up front or after the fact.
This thing is sold as a sampler and I think this is a pretty basic and useful sampling function that most of the competition already has.
Feels a bit similar to saying good on TE for not including an undo because it is somehow good for creativity to force ppl to commit
Anyway agree with the sentiment just make more music and not be expecting any more features than when it was purchased.
But still feels silly there is no quicker and reliable way to make perfect/BPM duration loops and I genuinely hope Roland make some kind of update for this. Just can’t understand the argument they should not. Surely it could coexist with the existing ‘imperfect’ loop sampling.
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Thanks for being you. Your guides and videos have been a huge help. All the best for the holidays and beyond sir.
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There’s work arounds, maybe not as quick as you’d like but they exist!
I’ve said it before, anyone with issues about the MKII should sit down with a OG/SX 404 for a while. I promise the MKII will look like a gold after!!
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Personally, I think so too! And I’d love to have more features. But:
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We have been using this since day 1. So new features really are just “add ons” to us. It’s very easy for those of us already familiar with (generations?) of a device to say “add more stuff” now that we’ve internalized everything it does already. But it’s not great for the poor newbie who tries to take it in all at once.
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The options to dig deeper exist. If this were a matter of the 404 flat-out not being able to play a loop, or truncate a sample to a set size, or threshold record, I’d be like “WTF?”. But it can do all those things. The ask is not to make it possible. The ask is to make it easy. Is just being easy worth making a thing more complicated? To each their own, but in my book simple beats easy every time (especially in the case of instruments. All our most beloved instruments are dead simple, but not at all easy).
Precisely. So let the 404 be what it is and let other devices like the Octatrack or MPC (both already infamous for being difficult to learn because of all the options they give you) be the home of complexity like “easy perfect looping”. I mean, that’s kind of the reason the OT exists. If live perfect loops is your jam, you’re going to be way happier with an OT than a 404 anyway.
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For me the 404SX was already good, only two things I didn’t like, the background noise and the impossibility to record a perfect loop (I’m not a finger drummer and I am very bad at tempo syncing).
The first issue, noise, has been brilliantly solved, the second issue not yet, but we are close.
There are tons or welcomed additions to the MK2 that, considering the price, make it a very nice product.
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I think a lot of misconception is the 404 is not sold as a looper. It’s a sampler!
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love some sort of looper but it’s absence isn’t stopping me!
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Precisely. So let the 404 be what it is and let other devices like the Octatrack or MPC (both already infamous for being difficult to learn because of all the options they give you) be the home of complexity like “easy perfect looping”. I mean, that’s kind of the reason the OT exists. If live perfect loops is your jam, you’re going to be way happier with an OT than a 404 anyway.
The Digitakt can make perfect loops up front
So can the Smpltrek, Akai Force, Ableton Push, Maschine, Dirtywave M8 which can all also easily crop existing samples to bars of a certain BPM
Adding ability to make perfect loops up front or after the fact != making the SP404MK2 as difficult to use as an Octatrack
find it strange that someone would not be happy to have this functionality on the SP
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for the 404hedz that don’t visit the current soundz thredz
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Sounds like you need to get one of the above then!
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I find it strange that no one is willing say “Adding features has certain cost associated with it in terms of complexity and ease of use, but in this particular case I think the tradeoffs are worth it because…”
Instead, all arguments in favor assume it’s a free no-brainer. ¯\(ツ)/¯ if it has no impact on anything else, I also really want perfect loops. I’d also like a piano roll, a color screen, a built-in analog tape delay, all the Valhalla reverbs, multitrack recording, individual outs, Diva, a decent FM synth, scenes with an OT-style crossfader, TB-303 emulation, and OLED buttons that show the name of the samples on them so I never have to go digging through banks looking for a pad I misplaced.
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Yes please!!!
all this talk of adding features has got me all riled up for a feature request.
BANK MUTE?
Currently shift + reverse + remain keeps mute mode open.
In this this state shift + bank doesn’t open the bank volume page as usual. (just switches bank like usual bank button function).
So if shift+bank could mute the entire selected bank in this mode would be nice performative feature. (if like me people keep drums on one bank, bass on another etc this would be swift access to mute entire sections of your pattern structure).
there maybe alternative approaches here and, as ever, i’d be keen to hear about it 
i can find muting swiftly a bit of a finger panic if i’m not on top of the pad positions.
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Every time someone states that they would appreciate fixed loop lengths for sample recording (“perfect loop”), you make this point…I think it’s ok to also just let the evidently popular request for fixed loop lengths stand there, no need to repeat this over and over…
Besides, I think everyone who owns an SP404mk2 from the beginning will know that adding features comes at a cost of usability - with v2.0’s release the thing became a lot more complex to the point where I’d say it’s in need of a new faceplate.
That said, I also hope we’ll get fixed loop lengths with the next update, if there ever will be one.
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Absolutely!
That said, let’s not confuse a feature request versus complaining about an absent feature!!
This is in no way at you @hausland just quoted your comment!
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Let me add Bank Copy to to this too 
and Bank Exchange. And I never could get loop/reverse to turn on by Bank despite the manual hinting that it’s possible
You can make perfect loops after the fact, fwiw … just involves a little math 
And maybe a way to add perfect loops without adding complexity would be to take the math out it. Make the INSERT page a little more fleshed out, so you could choose to trim by beats/bars instead of just samples
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