Roland SP-404 Mk2 (Part 1)

The Lounge Other Gear
#2534

This is a good Mk II of a machine that has been on the market for a long time.

I think the hype machine might have misled some people to expect something it wasnt intended to be.

The 404 has a weird approach if you are not used to it. However I’d still recommend is as a different work flow.

Though it could be frustrating if moving from MPC, Digitakt etc as it is very different. Be prepared to play live (and I mean as a studio production approach, not stage performance) and overdub. That’s where it shines over the precise sequence programmer approach people might prefer.

4 Likes
#2535

Interesting. This is something I wanted talk about since moving to a full on hardware setup, the live jam approach vs the programmer approach.

#2536

I wish skipback bypassed buses 3/4 aka master effects. Anyone else? :man_facepalming:

Edit: or at least have it optional in the settings

#2537

Just my personal take on it of course, others may differ. But that ‘work needs to be done’ aspect is what I like about it. You feel like you are discovering something and making it your own,
Don’t buy it as a better Digitakt or MPC, it’s a different proposition as the trimming/resampling model is a very different workflow that to some might seem awkward.

4 Likes
#2538

I read somewhere that the older sp’s could not resample while receiving/being triggered by midi.

Is this a fact and is it also like that on the mk2?

(This would. Be. A. Terrible. Terrible fact)

#2539

I haven’t even really used bus 3/4 just cuz that whole implementation is a little odd. Even if they are static in their routing I would have liked an easier way to set them. Would be nice if even if it was a button combo like holding down the push knob and pressing Bus FX. But really, their use is a little more limited in my case just cuz they are more difficult to get to and assign. Would have been great if you could just cycle through the whole FX slots by tapping the button. For me I’ve just been working with Bus 1 and 2 mostly.

I know this was a big thing SPVIDZ mentioned in his video on things he didn’t like about the sampler.

And I want to reiterate one more time, most of my issues are just with how odd some decisions are. I definitely knew what type of device this would be, a sampler where I resample and it having some quality effects to it, it definitely won’t be replacing my Digitakt or Octatrack. I think it’s really cool in its approach and I’m glad I’m finally apart of the SP “family” after being hesitant for about 10 years.

1 Like
#2540

Nah I used the SP but the whole normalising audio over USB is PITA, but if its Koala then forgivable.

#2541

I’ve heard a couple of people say they leave Bus 3/4 off until they have finished making their sequence and then use them at the end like mastering effects to glue the track together. This way you can avoid doubling up on effects when resampling.

Seems like it might be the way to go.

2 Likes
#2542

I just got mine yesterday, I was expecting it to only show up in januari, but its here!

I hadn’t read this thread too much because of not wanting to torture myself while waiting, but now that I’ve used the machine for a couple of hours and read up on this thread here’s some general notes and my experience so far:

  • The machine feels very solid, build quality is certainly good, and it still feels like you can throw em in a backpack like the old ones.
  • I love the new pads and the options for finger drumming they provide!
  • Compared to my steps up from the 303 to 404 to sx, this one doesn’t feel comparable at all. Before, I felt at home immediately, the button combo’ s and overall functions were mostly identical between those 3. This one feels different. The button use feels different, the screen makes you look more than listen, and some of the options (like the fx busses) still fry my mind a little.
  • The sound is different from the sx. I didn’t really think about that before buying, but I’m not sure I like this one better. It’s a bit harsher in the highs I think.
  • The fx are awesome. There’s a lot of choice, and having both the 303 and 404 vinyl sim is great. I do look at the numbers on the screen a lot though, which makes it less intuitive than before.
  • The chopping and waveform editing work great, much faster than anything I’ve ever used.
  • I feel like this machine will do great if I use my old resampling workflow on it, with the added benefits of having pitch, envelopes, chopping, mute groups etc. Will probably love this after I get my muscle memory back.
  • reading this thread I see a lot of people expecting this thing to be something it’s absolutely not. I’ve used the 303, 404 and sx extensively over the last couple of years, and they’re some of my favorite samplers ever. They are not, however, in any way comparable to the daw-like super samplers of today. They don’t sync well, the sequencers were complete shit (I literally never used it on the older versions), they didn’t have envelopes, lfo’s, or pitch shifting before, and you couldn’t load samples from folders whatsoever. These updates make a lot of sense if youre used to the old workflow, but I can see that this machine makes no sense at all to first time users. Please don’t expect this to be anything like an mpc or maschine. You can’t ‘print’ individual tracks, or mute tracks in the sequencer. You can’t easily sync clips or automatically sync/timestretch different loops perfectly. It’s not meant to be used with a huge library of samples, but to sample into, and mess around with. Resampling is not like track explode on the mpc, it is indeed more like committing something to stereo tape, and losing the option to ever go back and fix things. I love this workflow but make sure you understand this before buying!
24 Likes
#2543

@Sleepyhead

Dope. I had no idea you were getting one. Really excited to hear what you do with it and can’t wait to get mine. There’s an SP404 music thread now, so definitely drop something once you get your head around the new workflows and your muscle memory back.

I’ve got loads of ideas for what I want to try out. I do expect it to take a few weeks to get up and running though once mine arrives. Definitely wiping those factory samples day one though.

I was at my most productive when I was just using the Digitakt, so I’m excited to go deep on a device again. Gonna be fun to see where the limitations and unique workflow takes me.

I’m also all about the committed to tape workflow as well at the moment. It definitely gels with my mindset for making music right now. Back to basics.

2 Likes
#2544

Mk2 can resample/sample the midi triggered samples. (but cannot record midi notes in pattern mode.)

1 Like
#2545

FYI, the Digitakt and Transfer software was recently updated and you can now backup your Projects, Samples and Sounds through it. It’s a near perfect device, all it needs is a song mode but no need to start that here lol

2 Likes
#2546

I’ll check that thread, and will certainly join when I made something worthwile! Curious to hear what you come up with when you get yours, I think it’ll fit your style perfectly.

I think our workflows are pretty similar, I’m also very fond of focussing on a single box, and working within that ecosystem. For me it was the mpc for years, then the DT and now the AR which I’m completely in love with.

Before, the sp’s were ideal as an fx unit/sound mangler/recorder to accompany your main sampler. I often bounced samples back and forth between the DT and the sp/303/404/sx to add some of the great fx. I also recorded jamsessions into the sp to save them and mess them up afterwards.

As a bonus, I often took the sp out of my setup to sit on the couch and make resample beats, or just to collect samples to take back to the studio. It’s awesome to commit to finishing something by resampling, and everything gets a really nice glued together sound because of it. I finished a lot of music this way. A lot of these beats were actually used by rappers, which often lead to an awkward moment of me having to explain no individual tracks for mixing existed anywhere haha.

I plan to use this one in the same way: as a useful companion to the AR, and a unit to make full resample beats on when I’m away from the studio. I can see the sp with these new options now actually becoming more of a workhorse/centerpiece though.

4 Likes
#2547

…and stereo samples… :eyes::popcorn::eyes:

#2548

Yeah it’s pretty clunky. I’ve just got a few tweaked preset ‘Favourites’ that I tend to be using so far. Nothing like some EQ into 303 vinyl sim compression as a rough ‘mastering’ :slight_smile:

So when I’ve got a sketch I think is going somewhere I then turn it on. That’s where my problem with skipback starts though as the instant excitement from the sound gets me jamming new stuff on the track and want to capture the moment then bam, doubled up effects!

3 Likes
#2549

One thing I don’t get is why they made it so large. It’s 2/3rds of an MPC One, even slightly taller than the MPC. The SP-404 seems like a device that would benefit from being downsized a bit since there is a lot of dead space and thickness. Given that it’s meant to be portable, it doesn’t seem that optimized for it. That’s one of the things that contributed to me opting for something entirely different instead (a PO-133, although that one is clearly pushing the portability factor to the extreme).

In any case, I would have much preferred an sp-404 that is a lot thinner and compact, without sacrificing too much of the size of the pads and buttons. I guess this wasn’t part of their design goals.

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#2550

No that wouldn’t of sat well with the dedicated sp fanbase. People on sp Facebook groups didn’t like very minor changes to the design, let alone a completely different design. That definitely would of factored in to their decision.

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#2551

Let me know how the AR/SP combo works! Might consider swapping my DT for one in the future.

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#2552

Yeah they clearly were trying hard to make the existing community happy. Maybe that community is big enough that Roland doesn’t care to expand the market for SP’s, but I could imagine a much larger market if it were downsized since it’s such an immediate workflow with a focus on portability (battery, usb c).

#2553

It’s a good point that shrinkage to a slimmer unit might have been a good idea.

however many might like the form as it is as a lighter but still adequately chunky in height off the table and to handle like a large hardover book as the sweetspot, rather than a slimmer volume.

Not sure if it was half the height off the table it would be a real bonus.

They could have added a cross-fader though, and endless encoders …

1 Like