I’m kinda considering this or a Digitone as a polyphonic desktop companion to my Syntakt. On paper the SH-4D is offering a lot of synth for the money but I think it’s all going to come down to whether I can live with Roland’s menu-divey UI. It’s all well having those dozens of insert FX but if I have to wade through pages of menus I’m not going to bother experimenting with them.
The advantage to the Digitone is that I know how it all works and it still gives me the best-in-class sequencer. The downside is that FM still throws me off sometimes and it can end up more of preset with tweaks machine for me. I’m thinking that the SH-4D will be more intuitive (mostly) subtractive and a bit more polyphony but with a less flexible and enjoyable sequencer.
Guess I’ll have to wait and try it before making my choice.
For more subtractive sounds on the DN I recommend the Gemometry sound pack. It’s like having an instant analog synth in your Digitone. Just take one of the presets and design your analogish sounds from there, or “steal” the FM idea’s so you don’t have to figure it all out by yourself.
Yes, the SH-4d will definitely be more straightforward to dial in subtractive sounds. Choosing an effect for a track looks very straightforward and not very menu divey at all. If you haven’t already, check out a tutorial or two on YouTube.
I think the key difference will come down to the sequencer. With the Digitone, you’ll probably use its built-in sequencer alongside the Syntakt, whereas on the SH-4d, I’d imagine you will prefer to control it from the Syntakt instead. Meaning that in practice, a Digitone will give you 16 tracks in total, whereas the SH-4d kind of gives you 12 tracks since you’ll want to devote some Syntakt tracks to the midi machine. In practice, 12 tracks in total, with polyphony on four of them, is still plenty to work with though.
This always amuses me a bit… the Digitone (and most Elektron devices) are menu divey and the least knob-per-function that you can get.
What they’re good at is making it intuitive and tactile (I think Roland and most manufacturers don’t understand the power of clicky buttons).
But from what I’ve seen so far of the SH4d, its screen seems way superior to other Roland devices (I’m thinking of my MC707 and JD-XA here).
elektron aren’t menu divey. they have a menu for setting up certain things (prerequisites and that), but for synthesis & general use they’re more “page per function”. i wouldn’t call them menu divey at all personally.
I think this is the genius of the Elektron UI. I find it really interesting that Korg were clearly very influenced by the Elektron UI with the Opsix, but they don’t seem to have been able to pull off the same trick of making it intuitive.
I really wanted a TR-8s and spent some time with one in a shop trying to figure it out. I loved the sound of it, but programming it felt like trying to set the timer on a late 80s VHS player. Just couldn’t see myself ever enjoying using it. Obviously loads love it though, so that’s just my subjective experience.
I think the screen and UI on this 4d seems a fair bit better, but I think a lot of the time manufacturers like Roland are getting caught up in this idea that more knobs = better UI, which is only true if you don’t hide important functions at the bottom of a bunch of sub-menus. I’m not convinced looking at the 4d that I wouldn’t end up feeling the same way as I did with the TR-8s the second I have to do anything with FX or some deeper parameters than Osc, filter and envelopes.
Also, I still don’t understand why so many synth manufacturers are so afraid of endless encoders.
The chord model patch at 6:10 is quite nice. The pitch increases on the release of the note, I’m assuming that’s been done with the mod matrix somehow? This was something you could easily do on the JD-800
It feels like Elektron prioritize user experience above all else, but I get the impression that Roland doesn’t. It feels like they are more focused on a list of features.
Do they even user test products? There are so many issues on e.g. MC-707 that would’ve been obvious on the very first user test, and many of them could’ve been resolved with firmware updates.
Hardware is all about having fun and feeling connected with the instrument to me. If it feels like I’m being slowed down, it just feels pointless and I’d rather use a laptop…
Going to put some real time in with my mc101 and [any elektron] before I gas too longingly on this.
Looks like a lot going for it though for banging out multi track ditties and sound exploration with the battery of SP/MC effects - Need to study the workflow a bit more.
I think everyone will have different views on this, personally I don’t particularly like encoders, much prefer pots and sliders so this is probably right up my street, and I don’t like catch modes either. I think the 4 sliders under the screen is a great design.
Have ever programmed QPerf macros? Or gone in to make numerous Aftertouch and Velocity mods?
They’re menu divey.
It’s a trade off, and one that most of (inc me) are happy with.
Honestly, given that Overbridge is also there for when you need to go deep, I think Elektron are well ahead of everyone else on the UI front. (I quite like Sequential’s approach too).
I agree, that was kinda my point… there’s an obsession about things being knob-per-function and menu-divey, and it’s BS generally… it’s just got to be intuitive and well thought out.
Yep, this has been my experience with the TR8S and MC707… and why they end up back on the shelf… they’re frustrating to me because I know they’re both deep and have sounds for days, but using them is a massive ball ache.
I have a love/hate with the JD-XA for similar reasons, but that allows you enough hands on and intuitive use to allow for the ‘Roland’ bs (stupid tiny screen and unintuitive menu system in the JDXA’s case).
Sounds really good, definitely a pad/drone machine. One can see the advantage of having such a large number of controls a panel, one can just sculpt sound like clay just by touching the knobs. Barely any button press. Much more intuitive the then regular 4 or 8 encoders on most devices at that price. 26 knobs! 4 sliders, 5 encoders.
This is the new standard at that price and above for a synth.
yea I never use those. good point.
i agree elektron ui trumps pretty much everyone imo. I always end up selling my other gear n coming back to my elektrons pretty much exclusively. i could see this happening with the sh4d too.
These are things you set up before you record something, jam etc.
Everything related to actual playing with an Elektron, sample engine/synthesis and effects is only a button press or combo away.
When people say menu divey, they usually refer to going through a long list of parameters in a menu and setting values one parameter at a time. Then there are menus hidden in menus with more parameter lists.
Menus on Elektrons are always short, there are not many layers and they usually have their own short cuts. You can memorize that in your muscle memory, whereas that’s close to impossible on a real menu divey synth or sampler (just too many menus with too many layers and too long lists to memorize more than a few things you change everytime you play with the instrument).
With macros on Elektrons for example, you don’t have to click through a long menu until you find the macro menu, then select each individual macro, open the target list, choose one, go back, dial in range, go back, open the target list, choose one, go back and dial in the range until you set all parameters of a performance macro on an A4 for example.
Instead, you press function + performance to open the menu, click yes and you can set up the complete macro using the ten knobs. Upper row clicks through all tracks and scrolls through the list of parameters, lower row dials in range.
Even Elektrons way of renaming with a popup screen that shows all characters is way faster then selecting and then clicking up/down or turning a knob on each individual character.
