Hi!
I’m looking for guidance.
I’ve had a pair of Yamaha hs5’s for years.
I’ve noticed that when I listen to my recordings on other speakers the mix is always off in a more or less predictable way.
The bass end is over pronounced and tiring.
The mids are blended together.
And the highs are unclear.
I’ve been able to get louder and more listenable recordings by compensating with eq and compression etc.
I get the feeling that my speakers don’t articulate bass well, and my listening position is close enough that some frequencies pass me by.
I then compensate for it in my sound design, which leads to super bass heavy recordings that sound vastly different when I listen to them on different speakers.
I work and play in my living room and share the space with my partner, so I could maybe do some acoustic treatment, but chances are things will be rearranged once or twice this year, making it a moot (mute) point.
I need new speakers because mine have a whine, that is not related to their power source.
I want to make the right monitor choice, and position them correctly so that I can design more reliably, and create clearer more detailed music.
Tl;dr
Adam a7x or genelec 8010’s with subwoofer? Halp plez
Am I doomed?
Dont underestimate the power of proper speaker placement. Seriously.
Personally Wouldn’t get new speakers. Id try room placement first. There’s plenty of online resources for that, the triangle thing is your best option. Some dampening material behind the speaker and behind your head on the opposite wall to the speakers also helps.
If you get a nice mix on your monitors, it should sound good on any system. I have the Yamaha HS7, never had an issue with them. The whine you talk about sounds like interference, that could be easily isolated.
Also dont forget that pretty much all hifi systems, car stereos and such, artificially boost certain frequencies, often bass.
I think you can learn your monitors, sounds like you are on the way there, and adjust your mixes accordingly. That said, Yammy H5s aren’t exactly a high end listening experience so it may help to make a serious upgrade, but w/o treatment in weird space those returns might be less than you think.
I invested in a fairly expensive set of semi-closed headphones (AKG 702) and learned those really, really well. These days most people I trust tell me my mixes are plenty loud and sound pretty damn decent.
My monitors were not expensive when I got them but they are loads better than the KRK Rokit, Yammy H series, etc price range. They don’t make Equator D5 or D8 monitors anymore afaik, but I have a pair of D5s and will be sad if they ever die : (
FWIW, I “downgraded” from six inch monitors in my very small space to nicer five inch monitors (the equators) and the reduction in bass actually made my mixes better.
Sub woofers are tough too. You might not want that depending on your space and what treatment you could do. As Mictrotribe suggests if are in some wacky node it might ALL be speaker placement–that is why I’d recommend trying some good headphones before I went crazy on new monitors (that is if you want to throw money at the problem lol)
I think a big portion is speaker placement.
I know I’m sitting in a node because when I stand up and move through the room I can hear the bass become more or less prominent.
I don’t really have the option to move my desk away from the wall. The speaker whine happens wherever I plug them in. I’m not sure what I could do to further test them or reduce the noise. I’m pretty sure it is a transformer whine.
I am capable of mixing the problem away (mostly) but I want the recordings of my improvisations to retain the detail I hear when I’m playing.
Maybe room treatment would make things better? You already have ideas about which frequencies to treat, so that would be a serious direction I guess.
Can’t say I’m that savvy on the subject, but you can find some resources here and there. My own suggestion would be reading Mike Senior’s “Mixing secrets”.
It doesn’t need to be invasive… An option could be panels that you can move around do there not alway in the way, and cutting room angles.
Looking at your photo I see a few things.
The triangle isnt equilateral, it should be.
The upward tilt of the speaker cones means your bass port is firing down at the back, that’s not ideal.
You have hard flat walls, and hard floor boards.
The speakers are placed over a flat desk.
Those are all small things in isolation, but the sum of those things presents a big effect on the sound.
I’m no expert, but if you work on the space, you dont need to spend any money at all.
Easy way to find out the source of the whine is turn the speakers on, then turn off every other thing in the room, in sequence. See if you can identify the source. Also check cables, are they balanced? Are they damaged at all?
I understand completely! My studio’s ceiling is angled / \ at either end so I’ve got all kinds of crazy stuff going on. The angling of the monitors does reduce the sweet spot significantly. In my last studio incarnation if I scooted my chair two inches to the left or right I lost the full frequency spectrum immediately. Like magic. Gone.
I feel you on the headphones thing. The reason I can put up with it is from years of DJing, so I’m used to having them hanging around my neck at the least. Speakers are 100% way more fun. cant deny that.
Given where your setup is I don’t think bigger monitors and/or a sub are going to help but rather would probably cause you more problems.
It is a sh*tty conundrum that many of us hobbyists have to deal with. My partner is convinced if I hang treatment it is going to cause some kind of not easily repairable damage when we go to sell the house and it just isn’t worth the debate for me lol so I’ve just learned my monitors and headphones and make the best of things.
Ok thanks for all the info.
I’m thinking I’m a bit in a fix.
Thank you all for the information, guidance, and reassurance.
I think my conclusion is to get small speakers that aren’t broken, and to be ultimately precise about my placement and treatment.
Thanks
bigger monitors would definitely not help in this situation. the acoustic treatment suggestions are likely the best- im trying to work out a similar thing in my setup atm. alternatively, a pair of significantly smaller monitors like the 8010’s (they are comically tiny), spaced further apart to create more of an equilateral triangle (and potentially a better sweet spot) could be a good move- the 8010’s are great in the mid and high detail, and surprisingly better than youd think in the lows, but what you could do is work predoiminantly in those, and then have some decent headphones to switch back and forth with to check the low end, as well as reference the whole mix from a different source… tho obvs that involves throwing money at the problem when there could be a cheaper solution
Speaker placement is always a good place to start. But without measurements its hard to really know what is happening.
Another very important thing to do is to use reference tracks. When you are mixing your song find a similar genre song that is commercially finished. Lower the volume of the reference track so it is in the same ballpark as your track. Then switch between them when mixing your track. That way you easily notice what is missing or what is off on your track. Your ears adjust to the things you listen to alot, so you cant be objective without a reference.
This is how some people make pretty good mixes on “cheap” speakers without perfect rooms.
FYI: I had this concern when I bought studio treatment. the Auralex foam they want you to use some spray adhesive or tacky glue. the Primacoustic stuff they have these ridiculous brackets you have to anchor to your walls, to the tune of like eight holes for every panel you do. ridiculous.
solution: the GIK Acoustics panels. they hang exactly like a picture frame does. one small hole in the wall each, with a picture hanger hook (unless mounting to the corner, then two holes). and a lot of places I’ve read rate them better than the above options as well.
The whine noise could be because of an LTE antenna somewhere near you maybe. I have the HS7 and they are not shielded as well and start to resonate with the HF signals coming in. I had guys from state department here who called the LTE company to turn off the antenna - and suddenly: No whining HF noise anymore. If that’s your problem: Get Genelecs.
I did use basotect with a picture frame, these are really light weight, and could hang on 2x screws on the wall, They clear up the midfield quiete a bit. I also replaced my KRK 8 vs Genelec 8330 with 7350 apm. It was a very good choice. Yes expensive, but i use them everyday. '(Also to listen to music.)
Seconding some high quality headphones, you can still make the music with your monitors but adjust the final mix with some good headphones. Much easier than redecorating your living room with a bass trap and acoustic elements, hah.
