People recommending tiny synths to beginners is weird

No

Novation Circuit Tracks is a really cool, portable, flexible and otherwise wonderful little groovebox :slight_smile: Obviously depends on what Volcas you’re comparing too, you won’t be able to mangle samples on the fly for example. But has synth engines, effects, plays samples, alright sequencer and so on. Works well to do small-scale performances on as well.

Buy cheap buy twice.

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Yeah and sometimes people don’t simply have more funds to spend and recommending something twice as expensive because it’s “better” seems like trolling rather than helping.

I don’t think this holds much weight anymore TBH. I mean sure for some stuff like computers, maybe but for synths, not really. You can get really high quality and cool instruments for less money than ever before.

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Depends what you’re doing with them :slight_smile:

A Model: is barely the cost of 2 volcas, and if you own a PC then there are Mascine options I would recommend unless you’re absolutely determined to go DAWless.

It’s a different angle on it but I think it can still be relevant. If most people that buy one of these Rolands just ends up selling it to buy something ‘more’ then they wasted their money on the initial purchase and the losses in upgrading it. If you’re just dipping your toe in the water that’s OK but it’s not ‘saving’ you money, it’s just a lower initial investment. If you don’t like it you’re selling it/returning it whatever it cost.

This is all just behavioural economics :slight_smile:

I can accept this if the person doing the recommending is explicit about this. Otherwise, see hostbody’s reply

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Ah, but that’s moving the goal posts. We were talking of Volcas over other, more expensive synths or vice versa, now you’ve brought a computer into the equation. With a computer you don’t really need any hardware.

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True. A high end synth can break down just as easy as a tiny one.

You could argue they used to money to learn synthesis, then moved on when they wanted to learn more.

Synth doesn’t imply analog - some volcas are ‘computers’.

A synthesizer is just something that generates noise rather than playing it back

Well then, there’s no reason to recommend any hardware box. Just use VST’s.

Though not anywhere near impossible I never stopped finding my Volca keys confusing. I thought it was just me being a dunce. Definitely the most likely angle. But then I bought a TR8-S and I realized that it was the Volca. I’d probably rock any Volca I came across at this point but for starting out I found it more confusing than absolutely necessary.

For the money the basic Pocket Operators aren’t a terrible route for beginners.

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+1 on the knob per function thing. In the dim and (now very distant) past I started out with a flaky Korg Poly61. Parameter access, no manual, no internet and no one to ask. It could sound epic (to my ears!) but it wasn’t the easiest instrument to learn the fundamentals on. It even inspired my interest in digital electronics; I wanted to find a way of fitting a ton of knobs to make it more ‘synth like’! My second synth was a Crumar Trilogy, another hamstrung oddity. It was only flicking the pages of SOS and Future Music that I learned the principles of synthesis and quickly realised I needed something more… knob per function… to be able to fully learn and explore synthesis.

So my advice would be a single or dual oscillator mono with al least control of the basics such as oscillators, filter and envelope… We’re blessed these days with the range of let’s say entry level synths on the market. Back then the analogue revival hadn’t happened. The only analogue mono I can remember in production back then was the original bass station?

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While I agree with the premise to a degree, nothing was more eye opening to me than realizing the limitations of the “beginner” gear. This lead me to more serious instruments and in that way aided in my learning.

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A simple interface and ease of use seem most important for beginners. Size is secondary, though too tiny could be a problem.

The synth that really got me back into hardware after a couple decades was a Grendel Drone Commander in 2011.

In 2010, I had bought a Mopho keys on sale, intending to learn to program it. But I initially found it a bit confusing coming from software because it was almost, but not exactly, 1-knob per function. Luckily I kept it, and later learned it, and still have it. I also still have the Drone Commander.

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I started with the Roland Boutiques and Volcas and then figured out what I liked and bought different stuff.

  1. Synths are expensive and take up space.
  2. Synths take time to learn

These smaller modules are cheap, small, and take very little time to learn and have a few parameters. because they are small (and typically popular,) they are easy to research and learn about.

It’s easier for someone with no technical skill (yet) to be inspired by.

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oooh i like this perspective! puts a different spin on the whole thing.

a bit like eurorack I think it’s crazy to plan out your whole system in advance, you need to start buying stuff and experimenting to work out what works for you and what doesn’t.

bite-sized gear is useful for that too

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For people getting into synthesis or looking for an inexpensive option, I usually recommend the Korg Monologue. For its size, it gives you plenty of sound design exploration, it has keys, a fun sequencer, and is battery-powered.

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It is only weird because it’s 2022 and you learn much more from using free stuff on your computer.

In 2002, getting an Intel PC or Mac with software was extremely expensive. And thus a Volca would make so much sense back then.

The new little AIRA Rolands are aimed for anyone wanting that specific sound only without having to learn /put in some effort, really. It isnt aimed for beginners per se. Judging from demo’s they sound really good, if you need that sound

I would say for a beginner who wants to feel a piece of hardware a Monologue, Minilogue or pretty much any Behringer is a good choice. As is the model Series from Elektron. Or a used old VA or something.

But for learning, use a PC with some freeware or a Lite version of Reason.

I’m sure that people of my age all started with the MC-303 :). Getting the mc-303 now as a beginner would make no sense

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As presents to nephews and nieces, sons and daughters these tiny synths are much easier to wrap. So thats a bonus :grinning:

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