Pattern copy on the go

hagbard1st · 2014-02-16T15:44:09.000Z

G’day
Is it possible to copy my active pattern to another slot while the pattern is playing without having to change to that ‘to be copied to’-slot?
Thks

offshore · 2014-02-16T22:06:13.000Z

i’ve also been wondering about this - if it’s not possible, there must be a workaround?

van · 2014-02-16T23:43:23.000Z

no. it’s not possible!
but it’s on this list:
http://www.elektronauts.com/t/os-update-voting-results/3654

miketheman · 2014-02-17T08:25:55.000Z

While not possible, I accidently happened to found something that seems to be able to be used as an “workaround” to the main problem here during this weekend.

The main problem is that you´ll get silence as soon the new pattern is selected BEFORE you get your copied material pasted into that pattern. Where it then start sounding again as soon as the step sequencer starts over.

Given that you have most IIRC default settings regarding patterns (i e start silence etc) still valid. Whenever you´re using a sample you could choose between having it set as loop by itself (playback 2nd parameter page) or not. If set as not, you´ll have to set a new trigger where you need them. Nothing wrong there.

But if you have one track/pattern with an sample (still set as not looping) that will last longer than the pattern scale you´ve set in your step sequencer (16,32,48,64), after its been triggered the last time. That sample will then continue to play until its own end, before its sound stops.

Since you´re not triggering ANYTHING at all from the new pattern yet (since you haven´t pasted the copied pattern into it yet). This means that while this inevitable silence/pause occurs because of the selection of the new pattern, this longer sample will in meanwhile still play until the end of its own lenght. Now you´ve actually got time to paste the copied pattern into this new pattern, and as soon that the step sequencer starts over. Everything copied will start sounding again from this new pattern.

IMPORTANT: parts won´t get copied at the same time… so beware!

If used clever (live), most people would most probably just see/hear this as an (dynamic) break, which is quite common if you want some transitions between songparts or songs.

As much as the question/request is a good one, this workaround exists. Probably not optimal in everyones cases everytime, but still good to know/remember.

abergdahl · 2014-02-17T14:12:34.000Z

Hmm strange:
“Is it possible to copy my active pattern to another slot while the pattern is playing without having to change to that ‘to be copied to’-slot?”
I would say yes and I have done it many times…
I copy my active patterns, paste it to new position… old pattern still playing and I can later change to new copied pattern…

Need to try this again to make sure… but as far as i remember it work like i describe… PLEASE correct my if I’m wrong…

Anders

Rael · 2014-02-17T14:21:18.000Z

""abergdahl"":

Hmm strange:
“Is it possible to copy my active pattern to another slot while the pattern is playing without having to change to that ‘to be copied to’-slot?”
I would say yes and I have done it many times…
I copy my active patterns, paste it to new position… old pattern still playing and I can later change to new copied pattern…

Need to try this again to make sure… but as far as i remember it work like i describe… PLEASE correct my if I’m wrong…

Anders

Sorry Aber but i wonder if your not thinking of another sampler?
This issue has come up a lot of times, and no-one has stated it being possible, and ive never managed to do it…

The method of the loopîng sample is pretty good, to avoid the silence before the paste occurs

Another workaround would be to always have minimal sequences in other patterns
rather than blank patterns, meaning that the music would continue as a “break” when you change patterns before you paste…

hagbard1st · 2014-02-17T15:21:50.000Z

Thanks for the replies!

rhizome · 2014-02-17T18:21:32.000Z

still the most baffling omission to me. is it true of all of the elektrons?

miketheman · 2014-02-18T12:56:11.000Z

""rhizome"":

still the most baffling omission to me. is it true of all of the elektrons?

Just tested on a Monomachine: same thing there. Copy pattern, select another pattern, try pasting before the step sequencer activates the other pattern. The other pattern settings will be recalled and you have to paste “again”…

In the OT you´re at least able to find a way to work around it, thanks to the samples and their lenght and loop settings. As per described in my post above. Not sure if and how one would be able to or how to do it, within the MD/MnM however…

abergdahl · 2014-02-18T20:32:07.000Z

OK i think the reason i seldom experience this problem is that my pattern are often pf the type that dont change after 16 or 32 steps, which means that i have plenty of time to paste my pattern without experiencing the above mentioned problem

So one work around is to change the pattern change parameter to change a bit later… another night be to pre-paste a standard pattern so that you don’t change to an empty one when pasting, haven’t tried ths second work around…

miketheman · 2014-02-19T08:22:45.000Z

""abergdahl"":

OK i think the reason i seldom experience this problem is that my pattern are often pf the type that dont change after 16 or 32 steps, which means that i have plenty of time to paste my pattern without experiencing the above mentioned problem

So one work around is to change the pattern change parameter to change a bit later… another night be to pre-paste a standard pattern so that you don’t change to an empty one when pasting, haven’t tried ths second work around…

What do you mean by “pattern change parameter to change a bit later”?

Pre-paste aren´t any problem if you are just working where the interuption itself (whether silence or totally different pattern/sound) won´t be of any problem. However when doing some live jam, either at stage or in your home/studio i e when you may find yourself recording straight to disk/tape. When having a moment where you just flow with the go (in such situation where IMHO probably most people don´t have an standard pattern to rely on anyway). It´s inevitable that these interuptions occur. It´s just an creativity flow stopper if you happen to work yourself up from one pattern and just want to continue by adding patterns on the go and in the meanwhile tweaking each one to your taste.

I don´t know, as I haven´t explored this much:
But maybe this is a typical situation where the Crossfader and more specifically the Scene Copy/Paste as well as the selection of Scene A, B and/or mute is intended to be your tool?

abergdahl · 2014-02-19T16:19:35.000Z

""miketheman"":

What do you mean by “pattern change parameter to change a bit later”?

Under Projsct/sequenser you have “chain after” standard is pat.len which if your pattern is 16 steps measn MAX 16 steps after you press “paste” if you set i to. for example 4/16 you would have 64 steps to paste you copy before it changes over and i assume that the paste would be complete by that time…

hagbard1st · 2014-02-19T17:20:31.000Z

OHHH YESSS!!

I found THE solution.

Setup your OT prior to a crazy jam as follows:

Pattern 2-16 set to Part1 and each T8 set to Recording 8.
Pattern 2-16: T8 sample trig on 1. Set this trig as a Sample lock to Recording8.
If you want to use different Parts for your Patterns make shure the following setting is set for each Part: Track Recorder 8: INAB -/ INCD -/ RLEN MAX / TRIG ONE / SRC3 MAIN / LOOP OFF / FIN & FOUT 0.063 / QREC PLEN / QPL OFF / AB & CD 0
Go to Recording8 Setup (press T8 & BANK) and set ATTR GAIN to +16dB

Now for the fun part:

Jam on Pattern1.
If you decide that Pattern1 is the shit and you want to leave it as it is. Start recording to Recording8.
During the recording process copy your active pattern and choose the next pattern to be played.
As the next pattern starts the recording on T8 which should be your master mix of the previous pattern has been triggered an you have plenty of time to paste the copied pattern to the active one. Since the copied pattern uses completely different settings on T8 (another part or at least another sample trig… remember? the Recording8 trigger was a Sample lock… ;-)) there is no problem with double play.

Please feel free to optimise my method. But please let us know…

Cheers

miketheman · 2014-02-19T20:44:26.000Z

""hagbard1st"":

OHHH YESSS!!

I found THE solution.

Setup your OT prior to a crazy jam as follows:

Pattern 2-16 set to Part1 and each T8 set to Recording 8.

Pattern 2-16: T8 sample trig on 1. Set this trig as a Sample lock to Recording8.

If you want to use different Parts for your Patterns make shure the following setting is set for each Part: Track Recorder 8: INAB -/ INCD -/ RLEN MAX / TRIG ONE / SRC3 MAIN / LOOP OFF / FIN & FOUT 0.063 / QREC PLEN / QPL OFF / AB & CD 0

Go to Recording8 Setup (press T8 & BANK) and set ATTR GAIN to +16dB

Now for the fun part:

Jam on Pattern1.

If you decide that Pattern1 is the shit and you want to leave it as it is. Start recording to Recording8.

During the recording process copy your active pattern and choose the next pattern to be played.

As the next pattern starts the recording on T8 which should be your master mix of the previous pattern has been triggered an you have plenty of time to paste the copied pattern to the active one. Since the copied pattern uses completely different settings on T8 (another part or at least another sample trig… remember? the Recording8 trigger was a Sample lock… ;-)) there is no problem with double play.

Please feel free to optimise my method. But please let us know…

Cheers

Nice one!

Haven´t got the time to try it out now, but will when time permits!

deHaan · 2014-02-25T10:25:47.000Z

""hagbard1st"":

OHHH YESSS!!

I found THE solution.

Setup your OT prior to a crazy jam as follows:

Pattern 2-16 set to Part1 and each T8 set to Recording 8.

Pattern 2-16: T8 sample trig on 1. Set this trig as a Sample lock to Recording8.

If you want to use different Parts for your Patterns make shure the following setting is set for each Part: Track Recorder 8: INAB -/ INCD -/ RLEN MAX / TRIG ONE / SRC3 MAIN / LOOP OFF / FIN & FOUT 0.063 / QREC PLEN / QPL OFF / AB & CD 0

Go to Recording8 Setup (press T8 & BANK) and set ATTR GAIN to +16dB

Now for the fun part:

Jam on Pattern1.

If you decide that Pattern1 is the shit and you want to leave it as it is. Start recording to Recording8.

During the recording process copy your active pattern and choose the next pattern to be played.

As the next pattern starts the recording on T8 which should be your master mix of the previous pattern has been triggered an you have plenty of time to paste the copied pattern to the active one. Since the copied pattern uses completely different settings on T8 (another part or at least another sample trig… remember? the Recording8 trigger was a Sample lock… ;-)) there is no problem with double play.

Please feel free to optimise my method. But please let us know…

Cheers

Nice, good thinking! Looking forward to trying this. If this works smoothly it would have the advantage of not taking the crossfader in comparison to the “old” crosfader transition trick

Ihatederekreed · 2014-02-25T12:39:23.000Z

All of these work arounds are interesting enough, but why oh why can’t we just get this implemented somehow. All of my performances are live 1take direct to disk recordings and this has been my biggest complaint since day 1 with all of my elektrons. Having this forward copy action would truly make these machines live performance tools of another level.

snowcrash · 2014-02-25T15:11:45.000Z

The sad thing is, the A4 could do this prior to a OS update, since it activated the next pattern only when releasing the trig, so you could hold the trig, paste, release and switch to the duplicated pattern. They changed it unfortunately, can’t remember why…

There should be an easy clone pattern function somewhere in every elektron machine. Even the Electribes can do this!

hagbard1st · 2014-03-10T16:04:52.000Z

Has anyone tried my recipe yet?

avantronica · 2014-03-10T16:35:02.000Z

""snowcrash"":

The sad thing is, the A4 could do this prior to a OS update

I’m running 1.1D and the old copy pattern ahead on-the-go ‘method’ still works fine for me - with caveats plus it might not be to your liking, fine with me tho!

would be nice if the devs could add this along with quite a few other A4 front end interface niceties, multiple trig plocking etc

e.g. Dbl-click either Record button to enter record setup page would be so much easier than the clumsy finger gymnastics we have to do now(easy for right hand but in left hand position), especially for such a crucial page, single click back out (except when selecting recording sources, trig held down)

license · 2014-03-10T17:02:13.000Z

""hagbard1st"":

Has anyone tried my recipe yet?

Just reading about it now - just thinking seems like it would work best if on the pattern to-be-copied you locked T8 volume to 0, so that you don’t get doubling?